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Please read this carefully - for those who care
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 02:50
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This supposed to represent what I think in a way about certain things that went on this weekend, and by no means supposed to offend anyone - please give it a serious reading because there is a point in what I say, and I feel it must be said.
So lets start..
In my past, I organized free of charge parties ( so called Hat Parties ) myself and was Djing in events like that. As an organizer, I can say ( and those that have been to my hat party three years ago can confirm ) that I invested in that party the same way I would do in a party where I charge at the door, I broght a foregn DJ ( Shybe ) there was ambulace present, chaishop, food and 2 sets of EAW. There was no SMS made and it was a friends party as a friends party should be ( IMO ).
As a DJ I have played in one or two hat parties for free, and I must say it is a lot of fun and I enjoyed the friendly atmosphere and basically all was well. It was great.
So....
In no stage those parties came as a competition to other proggy underground party that was about to happen in the same weekend - I am not talking about ordinary proggy party with local DJs that some of the readers here are maybe a little tired to hear already, but excellent foreighn DJ, head of one of the leading labels in the Proggy scene. And here I come to my point:
This is written to organizers and DJ's as much as it is written for the people that come to dance and enjoy the party.
We have a relatively small underground proggy scene in Israel. Except of big holidays, we have only 2 big underground teams that actually can afford themselves to bring a quality foreign act or DJ - that leaves us with approximately 10 - 12 parties a year with foreign guests, that at least 4 of them are made in the same date ( Rosh hashana, Purim, Pesach etc... ). All the rest of the weekends the parties played by a team of maximum 8 - 10 DJ's / Acts, and I don't know about you but it can easy be tiring. Every single organizer that dares to arrange QUALITY event apart of these 2 party organizations, is VITAL to our little scene, otherwise we might die from boredom.
A free of charge party on a day of event like this, is IN MY OPINION, as democratic as we are, simply killing the chance of anyone to succeed and make something new and serious around here. Especially hat party that I personally got 3!!! SMS messages about it during the 2 - 3 days before Friday. How can fair competition be, when one party charges 70nis ( very fair price for a party with head of Digital Structures ) and the other charges 0? Are we big enough as a scene to afford it?
I know that at least 2 or 3 of the DJs that played on the hat party would come to hear Peter if they wouldn’t play there, and so are their friends...
What I mean to say is that for sure Free Parties are great, and all... But hey... If that means that good ppl that invested 2 last month in planning, making, saving enough money in a really invested event with killer setup and sound, with damn excellent DJ that wasn't here for last 2 and a half years... If all this is gone in vain... if that means that for the next few months a dear friend of mine gonna work his ass off to pay debths, only because his causes are good... then I say NO to Hat Parties.
I want to state again, that I am for free competition. But free competition has rules too, and it is fairly hard to compete with someone that offers his merchendize for free.
We are just not big enough for that at the moment..
Please consider what I wrote here, organizers AND DJ's - since I presume that in Hat Parties DJ's dont get paid, hence my opinion that just for fun making, we sometimes pay too big price on the other side.
Here my long monologue comes to an end. Hope no one was offended, it wasnt the point of this
All well - have a great week!!!
  A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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djvadim
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
69
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 08:23
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yuli... as u know the istaeli trance life...
and i'm not happy to say it...
ppl will read this... remember it for aweek(...maybe)
and... back to bissnes...money.. ego... money... ego...
anyway i'm with u!!!
if it's halp...
cheers |
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Candy
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
184
Posts :
2273
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 08:38
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Yuli I think you're exaggerating.
You are blaming the hat party that was in the north for the lack of ppl that came to Avishay's party in the desert. I don't think it's fair to blame the northern organizers.
First of all as you know hat parties are not really free of charge. You pay. Maybe not 70 shekels but you pay as much as you want (minimum 30 shekels, the average though pay 50 shekels).
Also, ppl that came to the hat party in the north most of them are northern people, ppl that wouldn't usually drive to the desert for parties (I'm not talking about the djs who played there).
If you want to look for excuses for why the party lacked of ppl, I suggest you think about those who did the progressive party in the center, cause in my opinion, as most ppl are lazy, they prefered something close (40 minutes from their house) and not a far location such as the Gilboa (1.5 hours of driving) or the desert (2 hours). Just following your way of thinking here.
But then again, I don't think anybody or any organization is to blame.
Something to think about...
Majority is never right!
"Without music, life is meaningless."
-Friedrich Nietzsche |
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fuzzyfly
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
138
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 09:05
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I'm with you Candy...Yuli take me for a chance, I live in the north (Gilboa) and I planned all week going to Avishay's event, then friday came and I got a bit sick and heard about a northern party, never mind it's a hat party, it just seemed to me more suiteable (very)...
I say it is not the hat, mostly not the place of the party but who's playing and where your heart takes you.I think that usually it's not out of lazyness or a lack of money.
Idan 
Strawberry Jam for the Booty Shakers |
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Nomolos(Zenon Rec.)
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
48
Posts :
2027
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 09:44
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Yuli.....
Im sorry but i think u are totaly speaking out of the pain of seeing a friend loosing money.....
When the 3rd Empire had there party with Magnetrixx and your self it was reported that around a 1000 people drove to the desert....on that same day another 2500(more or less) drove all the way south as well for Moksha that had a some what Prog' event as well(Shiva Chandra is pretty fucking prog)!!!! that gives us 3500 potential trancers,that would be happy to make the drive and pay a nice or even high sum....
I played this weekend at a paty in the center(yeah Candy the one that is "to blame" ?!?!?  )
and so did Shanti and Huda,the party "stole" no more than 120-150 people from the scene....and was a beautiful event,now i heard that there were about 400 people in the north hat party which im sure MANY of would NOT make the long drive regardless!!!!
even if we do add up the 2 parties that are "on trial" here its about 500 people....where are the rest of the 3000????? and one other thing....the north(and a few in the Center party) hat party wasent all prog' and many of the goers are not the people u would see in the Prog' events!!!
now i do agree that orgn' in our small scene can call each other up and make sure that they are not steping on each others tows....sometimes they only know about each other after the party has bookings etc. and is hard to cancel(or know but dont care?)...
to sum things up i first want to say to Avishay that he shouldnt be disscouraged and should keep making his super events with the spirit that drives him! and i would like to ask u Yuli as a DJ(cause i did feel a bit under attack for whiling to spin)if a FRIEND would ask u to spin at his party(small friends party,40 shekel at the door etc. etc.)would u say "NO!!,theres another party and i dont want to play for u!" please dont suprise me with a PRUDE answer......
Cheers.
"....or is it???"
www.zenonrecords.com
www.myspace.com/thenomolos |
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yossi
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
72
Posts :
1641
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 09:45
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yuli, what u r thinking of is an almost perfect symbiosis between party orgenizers... u truely think it can happen? (im not even sure it should...)
u can also take purim for example, imperia and moksha.
nothing to compare to last friday orgenizers but still... it worked.
every1 was where he was supposed to be.
i guess it was a strange weekend, coz all parties were kindda empty no?
and btw: u think u would`ve post this topic if it wasnt avishay?
if you want to be rich, u`ve got to be a bitch! |
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Ananda604
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
57
Posts :
1136
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 10:58
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psy^soldier
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
922
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 11:17
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well i think not many people came to dakini party becuse its not that knoun org such a the 3rd empire
lets say.
i know alot of good poeple that like prog music and had no idea about the dakini party |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 12:18
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Well answers mean that ppl reading and that is good...
But if ppl reading there are answers in that long monologue for some of yer statements...
@ Candy, Ananda604 and Nomolos the righteous..
I didnt blame anyone, all I suggested is free competition - for me free competition is close range of prices. For sure free of charge party and 30 nis party is not same range of prices - and Hat Party is FREE. If I dont want to pay to the hat I wont, this is my call as a visitor to the event.
@ Yossi
If I would see the same amount of effort that was put in a party, for vain, yes I would. Actually man, yeah that is true that the man is a good friend but I guess other ppl that were there will join me and back me up on that case.
@ Candy again  and also Fuzzyfly
Candy I know for SURE that if there was no hat party then more than half of its DJs would go south to hear Peter and that means that many of the crowd that were there would do the same. FuzzyFly u rest my case with what u said, since if the party in the north would cost u 70nis u would think twice about going there.
And ppl I advice to leave the 3d Empire and Moksha out of this. I think that without naming names I pulled them out of this myself - pls READ WELL. They can do on their own...
But as I see from the answers, till now u deserve what u got, and we will continue playing in circle in small parties waiting for 3d Empire or Moksha to come. There is nothing wrong with our Proggy DJ's but I would get sick of hearing myself 10 times a season.
The point was to raise the topic of QUALITY parties - not only crowdwise and atmosphere wise but maybe in other aspects too...
pls continue contributing...
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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Nomolos(Zenon Rec.)
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
48
Posts :
2027
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 12:24
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1) "Nomolos the righteous" wtf????? explain please....
2) your answer didnt answer any of my points so....would u say NO to a friend that askes u to spin?
3) free competition????? isnt a free(hat) party the epitome of our psytrance culture????? for me it sure is!!!
Cheers.
"....or is it???"
www.zenonrecords.com
www.myspace.com/thenomolos |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 12:50
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Quote:
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On 2005-04-17 12:24, Nomolos(Zenon Rec.) wrote:
1) "Nomolos the righteous" wtf????? explain please....
2) your answer didnt answer any of my points so....would u say NO to a friend that askes u to spin?
3) free competition????? isnt a free(hat) party the epitome of our psytrance culture????? for me it sure is!!!
Cheers.
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01. Righteous because u start fighting with me and that wasnt the point. For this time, and this time only I wont fight with u my man, sorry.
02. Your points...
I asked to leave Moksha and 3d Empire out of this... In Jewish holidays much more ppl go out to party then normal, and in REAL LIFE there are maximum 1000 prog heads for a weekend, sorry to tell u this fact.
About a friend bringing me over for an ultra cheap party / Hat party - if I know that by doing so I gonna run over other ppl I might say no.
03. Free Hat party isnt a free competition my friend. It is breaking the game and throw it away. I can arrange a decent Hat Party for around 5000nis and the chance of loosing money in it is almost none. It is either very easy to move to different date ( usually u dont bring a foreign DJ to play in hat party unless u r as silly as I was at the time )
Nomolos please dont try to fight with me here - I wont fight u back
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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Nomolos(Zenon Rec.)
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
48
Posts :
2027
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 13:01
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1)righteous? because i have an opinion? why in hell would i WANT to fight with u? its called having a disscussion...
2a)fact is Yuli,Moksha and Empire can bring big names and make super production cause they have the STABLE crowed bank that will come on ANY DATE!!!(and u know what i remember them loosing allso...big names=big money=big risks!!!)
2b)you would think of saying no???........yeah right....Yuli do me a favor! (i was allways looking for a prude girl to marry and rise 10 kids....to bad your not a women,or have birth giving ability  )
3) breaking the game???? what game is that man?
FREE PARTIES ARE THE ESSENCE OF THE TRANCE SPIRIT .P.E.R.I.O.D. id rather see big names from over seas once in a while thru the big productions and have hat parties with local dj's every week! org' not loosing sounds good to me
and again in case u feel i am trying to fight u(weird thing to think) IM NOT!!!! just voicing my opinion that is not the same as yours....
Cheers.
"....or is it???"
www.zenonrecords.com
www.myspace.com/thenomolos |
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karnaf
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
1745
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 13:03
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Yuli my friend, you seek the utopia... a scene where party organizers talk to each other and not try to f%&#ck one another, where there's no violence at parties, where the crowd is mature and smart, where the sound is perfect and the DJs are masters.
Not going to happen (and I can give specific examples of each case not happening...)
The moment the trance scene became a scene, around the early 90s, the "dream" has died. We saw too many cases of that.
I went to the hat party. If I had to choose again, I'd still go there. Not because Asi is a better friend than Avishay or Dudu, not because one is closer to my house than the other, not because I had $$$ problems, but because I wanted and used my right for free choice.
I'm really sad that Avishay has lost money, both as a trance fan and as a friend. I wish things were different.
Have a grand week and don't fight each other 
Please REMOVE my cellphone number from any SMS spam list you may have. Thanks.
http://www.savetherhino.org |
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Cyber Punk
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
29
Posts :
759
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 13:19
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On 2005-04-17 13:01, Nomolos(Zenon Rec.) wrote:
FREE PARTIES ARE THE ESSENCE OF THE TRANCE SPIRIT .P.E.R.I.O.D. id rather see big names from over seas once in a while thru the big productions and have hat parties with local dj's every week! org' not loosing sounds good to me
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Exactly what I wanted to write !
-=Lead System Designer=- |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Apr 17, 2005 13:28
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I guess that explains how come I broght Beckers with Zombi 2 months ago and hardly a 100 ppl came up to hear probably the best proggy artist this time in the scene.
Your answers explain a lot to me, and maybe I really seek utopia, I dont know but I for sure stand every and each of my words.
Nomolos maybe that is your normal form of speech but it is very agressive. I dont want to marry you and I wish you wouldnt EVER doubt what I say, since I dont thrashtalk. I say it and I make it.
Quote:
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On 2005-04-17 13:01, Nomolos(Zenon Rec.) wrote:
FREE PARTIES ARE THE ESSENCE OF THE TRANCE SPIRIT .P.E.R.I.O.D. id rather see big names from over seas once in a while thru the big productions and have hat parties with local dj's every week! org' not loosing sounds good to me
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As long as they go side by side with other events. Otherwise it is called 'Breaking the Market' and actually in REAL WORLD is illegal by law.
And in this pace that is what u will see Nomolos. 1 in 2 months u will have a serious production, and the rest will be the same crew playing to the same ppl with low budget productions, lets see how long it will last.
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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