| Author
|
Myopic novices and the art of their music (PSYTRANCE)
|
auralserenity
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
63
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 19:58
|
|
Now 'dreadieg' that is interesting, but friend, psy trance has much bigger listener base thats why it suffered, same can happen to other genres under electronic music spectrum. And it certainly matters. Yeah lot of people go about lot of things with- 'what the hell, who cares', kind of approach. If that is the case, then I'll find myself lost in words if we continue the debate. Anyways, I'm not all set to save the dying genre, but all I'm saying is that its just happening like that. And it certainly IS sad. |
|
|
auralserenity
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
63
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 20:03
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 19:51, Obelizk wrote:
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say one day it will pay. There's a lot of great psytrance music. I don't think populations have grasped how great it is yet. It was 'big' before, but not really huge. I think psytrance is going to play a big part as 'music of the future,' with the new technologies coming out every year that keep making it easier to make insane, disorienting sounds, and awesomeness.
I see clubs of the future playing psytrance, raves at night in major cities. You could say that's naive, but who knows. Especially with the community of people that make psytrance and listen to it. There's a lot of collaboration that leads to creative ideas and innovation.
|
|
C'mon 'Obelizk', thats already happening. And in abundance. Where do you live to not notice it? |
|
|
|
-aeon-
Aeon
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
546
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 22:12
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 19:39, auralserenity wrote:
Wow, 'aeon', you must be dreaming of 'groupies by your both sides and crowd going nuts over you for the awesome trance that you performed for them', in your most memorable dreams. But my dear friend aren't you awake sometimes and bored of the reality and finally succumbed to mind numbing synthetic so that similar buzz can take over again. |
|
i am married with a baby on the way.
i've been with the same woman since i was 17.
i don't take drugs.
i have a career in public service.
i have played vivaldi in the sydney opera house.
i have a postgraduate degree in medieval history.
i love making music and i couldn't care less that it will never make me rich or famous.
there are lots of things in my life which bring me fulfilment. why would i ever be bored of reality?
sorry if this does not fit your preconceptions 
Quote:
| You mentioned 'Maureen Tucker', when you should have seen how many of them are around you. And also check the career history of Moe here- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maureen_Tucker
She was just different than usual. |
|
maureen was indeed different. that is partly my point. would you have described her as a 'professional' drummer? probably not. did she contribute to some of the most important music ever recorded? probably.
genius lurks in the most unlikely places. of all the producers across the world there are some people who are going to achieve the most amazing things. don't you want to come along for the ride?
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 19:46, auralserenity wrote:
And also 'aeon' about learning, I fully agree with you. But friend, thats exactly what my and 'bukboys' point was.
Is it learning when you are trying to find a black cat in a dark room which is not there in the room at all?
|
|
i guess it depends what you find out along the way
the thing is man... musicians are people. one of the hardest things about exceptional people is realising that just because they are talented does not mean they are nice. i'm sure i have CDs in my collection where the singer is a bad person, or the lead guitarist is motivated by greed, or the record producer was a cokewhore who stole money from his friends, or the soloist was a womanising egotist. and you know what? that has nothing to do with my appreciation of their musical output. why must we rank motivation?
vivaldi wrote for a patron; bach wrote for a patron. they wrote 'dance' music. like a gavotte, or a bouree, or a sarabande. music which adhered to a set of rules. music with fixed conventions. music that was laid out and performed so people could dance to it.
how do you know that 350 years from now people won't be listening to Gappeq? or Sonic Species? or Ott? i know that as long as my 4th-regeneration bionic organs and human/machine interface system keeps my brain pulsing in a vat of jelly... i will be
look man, it seems like you posted this because you care passionately about music. that's awesome. but to make this thread in this forum sounds like you are dismissing everything that people here work for, love, live, breathe.  http://www.myspace.com/aeonaeon |
|
|
|
-aeon-
Aeon
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
546
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 22:19
|
|
Dharma Lab
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
342
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 22:28
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
Is it true that all the psy trance producers are nothing but amateurs who are chasing the glamor of being called a genius in music production, and fooling themselves of the reality that all their attempts are futile?
|
|
No, and you've admitted it yourself.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
Are they a bunch of myopic novices who cant look beyond their limited senses and fail to realize that days of psytrance are over?
|
|
"The days of psytrance are over" is just an opinion, and not something really quantifiable. Your question is really just a sweeping generalization based on your experience. To put it in plain words, just because every psytrance musician you've listened to is a myopic novice, does not mean that all psytrance musicians are myopic novices.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
My purpose is not to make a fight club, instead I really was interested to raise this issue of blindfolded approach to stardom that's been followed by majority.
today populance of psy producers is huge and almost ninety percent of them make pathetic jumble of sequences, overcompress everything, talk about equalizers and filters, and dont know the difference between sine and saw.
|
|
Where are you getting this information from? What do you really mean by "blindfolded approach to stardom"? It seems to me you are exaggerating a lot of your statements, and I'm not sure why.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
And my point is that whole approach by few biased novices(they are not few) might not give them, what they expect as their vision is blurred by their own love for the genre.
|
|
If I understand you correctly, you are saying that: the approach to making psytrance music by many 'biased novices' might not give them what they expect.
How do you know what they expect, or what their goals are?
Please correct me if I have this wrong, but you seem to be dancing around an argument that many psytrance musicians do not have a formal music education, or some notion of what you consider a "proper understanding" of music. And you feel this is going to destroy the fan base. Is that right?
Keep The Faith,
Christian K. |
|
|
|
CaptainOats
Started Topics :
3
Posts :
20
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 22:47
|
Oh damn.....what a thread and discussion, Everyone know that psytrance change over the last time, i take a break 2-3 years ago from psy because i listen a lot to tech house and minimal. than 2 years after that i hesr some new psy tunes. and it was a shock ^^ because it was so commercial. But than i search for good artist from the old days and some of them, continues with fresh psychedelic sound and much much better production than 2002-2006.
I dont know why the discussion goes soooooo fucking deeply in some of your feelings, i only read some posts and think, damn what is goining on in his head that he is so pissed of from...YEAH from "WHAT" ?? Because some psyartist make a change in there music ?? because some artist want to pay there bills with his music ?? is this wrong when you travelled and played 10 Years or more from place to place and give the people and themselves big spiritual moments ?? And now some artists want another live ? and not so complicated twisted psytrance ?
Best is Infecte Mushroom, myself was a time also pissed because there musik change after the first albums, but then i think about them a lot of times and realize that they always change the style a little bit more beacuas they was changing themselfs and want every year or two new expermiments making, and everyone FUCKING WORKS for them, they have kids grow up in los angeles, they have a fucking nice studio, they have a big band who performed on a big stage with big audience. And thats what they damn want for them, thats all and that makes them happy and that do a lot of the gold psyartists, they all experiment so many big spirituell partys with drugs without drugs, on beautiful beaches and horror big city locations, they ALL have made what every young Producer, whatever his Genre is fucking DREAMING OF, that his musik will be loved and admired from a lot of people.
And beacause of this changes this and also new Producers bring is psytrance Dead ???
There are so many good psytunes out there, there not sounding like a lot of it and i listen too so much cds over the years and i know in the future is a long long ong future for psytrance and proggressive also.
And when you think psytrance is Dead....why the fuck you dont sit you down on your ass and make some good big tunes without reproducing all the psy sounds ?? make a new rubbery pitched psy sound, make a new "vibe tribe" lead that touches sooo many people out there in the old days, make something NEW in Psytrance,and dont use all the fucking Libarys and VST Presets that everyone uses, thats also a BIG BIG thing why everyone have the same sounds, no bla bla Vengeance make it easy for a lot of them.
when you dont like the changes the last time, BE the NEW change...AND Please dont post in this forum where some noobs searching for some tips for a fucking bassline and CRY and distribute this bad and too much thinking about psytrance is Dead. Some of the poster really go to deep with this, why ever, DAMN its music, music makes happy and is for a lot and most people one of the importent things in there lifes, dont waste the time with thinking about what other artists do....DO your thing as an Artist and make what makes YOU happy as an Artist, and let the other artists happy with some commercial psytunes make there thing.
cheers and see all the happy people on Boom 2010 to enjoy the good musik and vibe
....psytrance is Dead hee |
|
|
|
CaptainOats
Started Topics :
3
Posts :
20
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 23:09
|
I forgot....about the sound design, compress bla bla....
I dont understand what some of the posters want ??
when they over compress....let them over compress
why you get so..dont know.....when some artist over compress
they make musik and touches some people with it, thats what they want and when this happened...The Artist WIN, and i think the artist reach his goal with it. and take in mind that 90 % of the listener dont no a compressor hahahha soooo...there we are, make music and i think some of the posters dont get, big tracks out of the sequencer and thats the ground why they must talk such a shit aboutother artists, about over compressing, same sounds in every track, they are noob producers, there dont know notes, talk about a FL studio producer that cant understand cubase and chords, about you make know money with psy, about learning how to produce psy sounds is he wrong way...all this bla bla bla is in my opinion all because they are jealous and fucked about them self, and dont know why they dont get a big unique track out of the FL, Cubas bla bl WHAT ever.
|
|
|
|
SineFreq
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
139
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 23:17
|
Let this thread die please
Thanks<<< w/smug |
|
|
|
auralserenity
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
63
Posted : Jan 20, 2010 23:45
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 22:28, Dharma Lab wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
Is it true that all the psy trance producers are nothing but amateurs who are chasing the glamor of being called a genius in music production, and fooling themselves of the reality that all their attempts are futile?
No, and you've admitted it yourself.
|
|
-Yes I admit that.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
Are they a bunch of myopic novices who cant look beyond their limited senses and fail to realize that days of psytrance are over?
|
|
"The days of psytrance are over" is just an opinion, and not something really quantifiable. Your question is really just a sweeping generalization based on your experience. To put it in plain words, just because every psytrance musician you've listened to is a myopic novice, does not mean that all psytrance musicians are myopic novices.
|
|
You are still not understanding the purpose. Read on I've explained this further.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
My purpose is not to make a fight club, instead I really was interested to raise this issue of blindfolded approach to stardom that's been followed by majority.
today populance of psy producers is huge and almost ninety percent of them make pathetic jumble of sequences, overcompress everything, talk about equalizers and filters, and dont know the difference between sine and saw.
|
|
Where are you getting this information from? What do you really mean by "blindfolded approach to stardom"? It seems to me you are exaggerating a lot of your statements, and I'm not sure why.
[/quote]
Information is all around you, can search online. By blindfolded approach to stardom, I meant for those who aren't formally trained in electronic music, and just because they can fiddle few knobs they start looking ways to produce their creation. Here I'm not referring to Lo-Fi artists. I'm talking about some odd hundred thousand youtube videos and some odd million forums and some odd maybe zillion posts linking to some of those hundred thousand youtube videos.
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-19 16:00:48, auralserenity wrote:
And my point is that whole approach by few biased novices(they are not few) might not give them, what they expect as their vision is blurred by their own love for the genre.
|
|
If I understand you correctly, you are saying that: the approach to making psytrance music by many 'biased novices' might not give them what they expect.
How do you know what they expect, or what their goals are?
Please correct me if I have this wrong, but you seem to be dancing around an argument that many psytrance musicians do not have a formal music education, or some notion of what you consider a "proper understanding" of music. And you feel this is going to destroy the fan base. Is that right?
[/quote]
You know what! Bullseye. That's abso-fukin-lutely correct. But the last part about fan base getting destroyed is not correct, actually its preposterous for you to conclude it like that.
By proper understanding of music I meant a proper understanding of electronic music. I do not understand the idea of "so what if you dont know what to shoot and where to shoot, just keep shooting, you might hit the target".
I dont intend to discourage those who are starting up. I was a novice too. In many little things I still consider myself a novice. But I am not a myopic one. I had never ever gone in the scene with such a mindset.
Let me explain: If I ever wanted to cook, I didnt threw all the fukin spices in the pan to wait and find out what turns out. No one is stopping me from doing that as I am doing that in my own fukin kitchen. And even if I'm experimenting in such a way(which is rare) in my kitchen, I wouldnt serve all such devastated products to the people. And lets assume I ever want to be considering myself a CHEF who cooks amazing ratatouille, then it will be a blunder if I do not know that zucchini is must for ratatouille, or else I'll be a chef but not the one who knows how to cook a fukin ratatouille. And in that case if I join as a head chef in a restaurant where they only serve ratatouille, they might serve my head instead.
If this explanation doesnt ring bells, then check your battery.
And as for 'aeon', its not that I choose not to answer you, In my country its fukin late at night, we'll talk about this tomorrow. Just wanted you to know that one of the most interesting facet of this thread was raised by you- "vivaldi wrote for a patron; bach wrote for a patron. they wrote 'dance' music. like a gavotte, or a bouree, or a sarabande. music which adhered to a set of rules. music with fixed conventions. music that was laid out and performed so people could dance to it." - wow. I truly mean wow. I rarely find people in trance forums to talk like that. On that wavelength.
Aeon that is my whole point, people outhere and other trance forums and youtube videos(you can figure out from the comment window) try to seek wisdom in one gulp. I still remember when I learned about the sidechain compression for the first time, and this friend of mine showed me what it can do, I was totally awed. I kept on playing with this technique for days and more than once told myself that- that is how pro does it. I mean it wasnt till I realized that I need to learn how to fish, instead of borrowing one. If I need to eat everyday. And a different fish everyday.
And by the way, when I spoke about those groupies and drugs, I wasnt even trying to be personal, I was just trying to make a point. I dont bother what people live like, but it was really great to know that you've played vivaldi in the sydney opera house. And again I disagree about Maureen. Find out, she knew how to play a drum, but in a unconventional manner. Even if you are correct, does it make any sense that hundred thousands are banging the drumsticks on the snare, thinking that they may reincarnate as another Maureen who never knew how to play drums.
-------------
Aeon our debate is not over, I'll be back tomorrow. I'm really tired.
|
|
|
|
master bud
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
144
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 00:09
|
|
Brain_Train
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
84
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 00:18
|
"Is it true that all the psy trance producers are nothing but amateurs who are chasing the glamor of being called a genius in music production, and fooling themselves of the reality that all their attempts are futile?"
@auralserenity:
it's been a long time since i've seen bullshit like this topic...
we all make music just because we have fun doing it...i give a fuck about glamor and being called a genius...
everybody needs some kind of a hobby, and that is why we do it. point.
get a life, man.
|
|
|
|
Obelizk
Amoeba
Started Topics :
115
Posts :
836
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 05:43
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 20:03, auralserenity wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-20 19:51, Obelizk wrote:
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say one day it will pay. There's a lot of great psytrance music. I don't think populations have grasped how great it is yet. It was 'big' before, but not really huge. I think psytrance is going to play a big part as 'music of the future,' with the new technologies coming out every year that keep making it easier to make insane, disorienting sounds, and awesomeness.
I see clubs of the future playing psytrance, raves at night in major cities. You could say that's naive, but who knows. Especially with the community of people that make psytrance and listen to it. There's a lot of collaboration that leads to creative ideas and innovation.
|
|
C'mon 'Obelizk', thats already happening. And in abundance. Where do you live to not notice it?
|
|
C'mon, 'auralserenity.' Besides Infected Mushroom, and a few other artists, there's not a huge amount of money being made in psytrance at all. I wasn't referring to Tiesto or Paul Oakenfold. And there's virtually no psytrance music playing clubs in Detroit. And i'd like an update on when you start seeing golden bidet's in goa.
www.musicproductionnatural.com || www.facebook.com/djamoeba | facebook page |
|
|
|
auralserenity
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
63
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 08:18
|
Whatever guys! I must have stepped on someone else's tale. Now even I am finding this thread a lame one. Bored and bugged. I think I'll depart to -- http://forum.isratrance.com/circuit-bending-a-twisted-art-of-sound-synthesis/
And to 'Obelizk', thats good for Detroit, but Goa has enough psy to lose the line between psy and other trance style sometimes. And 'Obelizk', from where do you suddenly jump to 'huge amount of money'. You mentioned all the clubs getting zonked out on psy together. doesnt necessarily bring money in. Its underground genre for fuk's sake.
'huge amount of money'
- Are you fukin kidding me? |
|
|
|
auralserenity
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
63
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 08:19
|
Mods please kill this thread. Brutally. No point. Its a lame topic discussed with lame folks.
|
|
|
|
Obelizk
Amoeba
Started Topics :
115
Posts :
836
Posted : Jan 21, 2010 08:52
|
Quote:
|
On 2010-01-21 08:18, auralserenity wrote:
Whatever guys! I must have stepped on someone else's tale. Now even I am finding this thread a lame one. Bored and bugged. I think I'll depart to -- http://forum.isratrance.com/circuit-bending-a-twisted-art-of-sound-synthesis/
And to 'Obelizk', thats good for Detroit, but Goa has enough psy to lose the line between psy and other trance style sometimes. And 'Obelizk', from where do you suddenly jump to 'huge amount of money'. You mentioned all the clubs getting zonked out on psy together. doesnt necessarily bring money in. Its underground genre for fuk's sake.
'huge amount of money'
- Are you fukin kidding me?
|
|
If you actually read my post, and obviously you didn't, you would see what i meant. big business = big money. Don't try to be all high and mighty with your "oh mods please kill this post." You're the one who started this 'lame topic'. Calling everyone else lame doesn't make you seem any more intelligent. Look for an excuse to argue with people elsewhere.
www.musicproductionnatural.com || www.facebook.com/djamoeba | facebook page |
|
|
|
|
