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Labels slowing the evolution of psy?
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Kaz
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
90
Posts :
2268
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 17:24
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On 2007-11-05 17:04, Krell wrote:
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On 2007-11-05 16:20, Colin OOOD wrote:
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On 2007-11-05 14:17, Krell wrote:
If you want your releases brought to the commercial market, it needs to have commercial value.
Innovation is the term used, for describing inventiveness which creates more profit for already established commercial entities. In this case, your friends music is not considered innovative ENOUGH to warrant investment. |
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I have to disagree with this... an innovative artist will find it harder to get released, as his music won't fit into most label's styles.
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I think you are understanding what I wrote the wrong way. Commercial innovation is about creating profits through product development.
If a label hears something, and really thinks it kicks ass, Im sure they will release it - IF - it fits the label profile - AND - it truely is THAT good.
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Umm... That's exactly what Collin said, only taken to the opposite conclusion. "IF - it fits the label profile" is a huge mother-f$#@ing "if", since the labels out there don't really cover most of what you can do with psytrance. Hell, Green Nuns of the Revolution - Rock Bitch Mafia, which is widely considered one of the best albums ever in the scene... find a label that would release it today (Hint: NONE). The whole point of innovation is doing things that other people don't, otherwise that's called "adaptation" and not "innovation". You do something outside the label's taste - and it usually can't be released, no matter how good it is.  http://www.myspace.com/Hooloovoo222 |
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Fragletrollet
Fragletrollet
Started Topics :
111
Posts :
1748
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 17:59
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kriz
Horrordelic Records
Started Topics :
25
Posts :
1247
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 18:35
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As i see it: Much of the most interesting music i have, have never
gotten released..
Its abit sad.. But these days the artist can do so much himself,
release on net labels (free tracks), web releases, mixes and so on.
I hope you get stuff released or atleast availible to buy soon!! And
also more gigs for you please hehehe.
Best of luck 
3o~ kriz aka krize 3o~ ....Horrordelic Records.... http://www.horrordelic.com
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- Think for yourself -
http://www.goatrance.de/goabase/member/profile/lkkkaKhOQP |
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Yidam
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
144
Posts :
3171
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 19:46
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Don't believe a good album can be ignored in this day of digital exchange be it released or not. One of the most talked about psychedelic albums this year by Atriohm was unreleased & not hosted online. The power of P2P is actually on the artists side if you look at it from the perspective of original sound. Just a matter of patience, waiting for the right ears to find it.
Heck, after listening to some of the alternative chill and breaks thrown into breakdowns in tracks, its even more frustrating knowing that the talents being limited to your generic 'psytrance' or 'darkpsy' ... wheres the freeform twisted sound?? forget labels and bring it on please!!! |
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Basilisk
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
168
Posts :
2984
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 19:58
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I hear about this all the time--artists make something a little unconventional and the labels simply aren't interested. This notion that the evolution of psychedelic trance music is stifled by commercial concerns seems to hold true.
What can be done about it? Well, if you're an artist, it depends on how invested you are in the idea of commercial return. I put a great deal of effort into promoting free music as a viable release strategy for a number of reasons--and creative freedom is right near the top of the list. If you aren't attached to the idea of commercial return for the sub-segment of your work that doesn't seem to appeal to labels due to style, length, or some other characteristic, I would suggest putting together a promotional release to give away for free online. This is fairly easy to do yourself (and I don't mind providing some tips and general know-how), or you may wish to contact one of the other netlabels on the market to see if there is an interest. When you give music away for free on the 'net--either as a netlabel or independent artist--you don't need to abide by expectations of commercial return.
If you still hope to make at least a little money from your unconventional material and you feel it has some commercial potential, try signing up with a site like Cytopia.org where you can sell your own material direct to the public.
There are solutions... but they will require you to think outside of the tired and outmoded distribution hierarchy that the psytrance scene has been running with since the pre-Internet days.
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Krell
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1114
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 20:21
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On 2007-11-05 17:24, kaz wrote:
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On 2007-11-05 17:04, Krell wrote:
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On 2007-11-05 16:20, Colin OOOD wrote:
Quote:
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On 2007-11-05 14:17, Krell wrote:
If you want your releases brought to the commercial market, it needs to have commercial value.
Innovation is the term used, for describing inventiveness which creates more profit for already established commercial entities. In this case, your friends music is not considered innovative ENOUGH to warrant investment. |
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I have to disagree with this... an innovative artist will find it harder to get released, as his music won't fit into most label's styles.
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I think you are understanding what I wrote the wrong way. Commercial innovation is about creating profits through product development.
If a label hears something, and really thinks it kicks ass, Im sure they will release it - IF - it fits the label profile - AND - it truely is THAT good.
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Umm... That's exactly what Collin said, only taken to the opposite conclusion. "IF - it fits the label profile" is a huge mother-f$#@ing "if", since the labels out there don't really cover most of what you can do with psytrance. Hell, Green Nuns of the Revolution - Rock Bitch Mafia, which is widely considered one of the best albums ever in the scene... find a label that would release it today (Hint: NONE). The whole point of innovation is doing things that other people don't, otherwise that's called "adaptation" and not "innovation". You do something outside the label's taste - and it usually can't be released, no matter how good it is.
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Again, I agree... and like I wrote, I agree with Colin as well, I just elaborated on it.
The question is however, whether or not this hampers the evolution of "psychedelic trance", and I dont think it does.
The music, which is not adaptation as you call it, is just not good enough for people to buy it when it competes against the full on, progressive or dark psy recipe. "Good Enough in the commercial value sense, which matters to labels who need to sell CDs and create careers).
Consumers will end up with a bunch of tracks, to which they think "what the fuck?" lacking the PUNCH they would otherwise get from the more formulated recipe stuff... With stiff competition, labels have to make sure their releases are bought... why release if you dont sell ?
Many of us know label people selling sub 500 copies of their releases. Thats not because people dont like psy anymore, its because there are so many releases... so, unless you have a product which people want, you dont get sales.
Getting back to the core of the matter, does this slow down "psychedelic trance" evolution ? I think not, I think it forces producers to become independant and forget about being bound by label expectations.
The creative labels are almost gone, still in business are the style labels. Labels which guarentee/indicate a style of music, rather than an act of fresh creativity.
Good musicians will create their art no matter if it will be put on a CD or not... So, evolution is not hurt I think. Not unless you create to release on CD, but arent we just facing a paradox there ?
I can see good things in changing the way music is distributed / published as well as how we listeners obtain it.
Producers just have to start realizing, their worth is not what it used to be. 10 years ago, if you had the gear, you most likely got the releases. You would maybe also get bookings and if you kept it up, you could be a star.
Now, so many people produce, its just as with the Djs... When everybody can call themselves a "producer", the craft and term looses its worth commercially.
The effect of this is, that you cant expect to have your music released unless it has commercial value.... Innovation IS a commercial value, but its only one of several... and for innovation to be relevant from a commercial standpoint the music has to WORK for enough people to buy it.
Artists should pay notice to what Basilisk wrote earlier, in regards to the release strategy they choose to follow.
Else, accept being commercial puppets ;-) (With which I personally am FINE).
- Krell
Label DJ>
www.jesterrecords.ca |
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shahar
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
155
Posts :
2035
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 20:48
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hmmm... didn't read it all. But how about: "bad Labels slowing the evolution of psy?"
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Krell
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1114
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 22:03
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On 2007-11-05 20:48, shahar wrote:
hmmm... didn't read it all. But how about: "bad Labels slowing the evolution of psy?"
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Or whattabout, wasting too much time in forums, slows the evolution of psy?
- Krell
Label DJ>
www.jesterrecords.ca |
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~:MuZiK
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
13
Posts :
133
Posted : Nov 5, 2007 23:18
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Maybe it's not a problem of labels slowing the evolution, but the artists which just go up and wanna release something as fast as they can?
They think they are making really good music, but in most times, the tracks i receive are bad. Poor arrangements, easy fx's and so on, etcetera...
Also if i am compiling the VA, i have some idea in my head and tracks which i choose, have some kind of styles which i prefer, playing good together.
And of course i think that i will be releasing first of all music which i like and prefer, not something which i don't like. It's easy as....
Regards
Medulla Oblongata & Xibalba Festival Crew |
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mk47
Inactive User
Started Topics :
118
Posts :
4444
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 06:07
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theres still a few labels (just a handful though) ..that either .`don't stifle creativity` or `are into weirdo beats` and `don't follow pop trends` .. u have to know where to look .. 
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Outolintu
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
Posts :
1477
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 09:34
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On 2007-11-05 22:03, Krell wrote:
wasting too much time in forums, slows the evolution of psy?
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one can't argue against this statement 
"no one ever sweats on a plug-in" -moby |
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Dennis the menace
DevilsDennis Sparris McHilton
Started Topics :
128
Posts :
2899
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 14:40
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To make a good compilation you need a "story" and to make a "story" you need tracks that would fit in that "story", or it would look like Absolute Sallad 2007
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~:MuZiK
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
13
Posts :
133
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 14:57
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Dennis 100% right
No need more to say.
Medulla Oblongata & Xibalba Festival Crew |
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Spindrift
Spindrift
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1560
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 15:39
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On 2007-11-06 14:40, Dennis the menace wrote:
To make a good compilation you need a "story" and to make a "story" you need tracks that would fit in that "story", or it would look like Absolute Sallad 2007
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IMO very few compilations actually tell a story.
Using similar tracks is a way to put tracks together so it doesn't sound like a complete mish-mash, but to tell a story properly you have to have diversity and to do that you need a lot more skill that being able to find tracks that fit into a certain mould.
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Fragletrollet
Fragletrollet
Started Topics :
111
Posts :
1748
Posted : Nov 6, 2007 16:42
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