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Trance Forum  Forum  Music Reviews - V/A- SET 8 "Electronic Ballroom" - Iboga rec. feb. 08
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V/A- SET 8 "Electronic Ballroom" - Iboga rec. feb. 08

Shahar Indepth
Indepth
Started Topics :  16
Posts :  416
Posted : Mar 15, 2008 01:03
Quote:

On 2008-03-14 19:50, Yuli wrote:
To all those that "wouldn't play any track of this compilation" because they prefer to stick to the source...

I wish just for fun, one day to take off the names of the artists from the tracks, and make you decide what you play without seeing the names. Remove the name Deadmau5 from most of his tracks, and you may find an excellently produced, but completely empty generic and bland music.

So basically what all of you say -

"Progressive artists, you are simply not good enough, please stick to your Dum-Da-Ga-Dum basslines with occasional stabs, minor synth chords, simple rhythm and keep it psychedelic. Let the real artists to do the other kinds of electronic dance music, it's too big for you.."

And personal word to Shachar Indepth ( and definitely NO OFFENCE here yo, but I have the feel that you are not completely honest here ): Shachar, 3 months ago you would be extremely happy to get couple of tracks from this compi, to play out. Its just now when all is released, it's easy to badmouth.. Because in any case the released tracks have 2 months to live and that is it.







Hey Yulski, not to turn this into a personal discussion , but i think you misunderstood.

if there is 1 thing i was NOT, is dishonest.
i stated exacatly how i felt about this compi, even though i guessed it would probably get exactly this kind of reaction.

what i said is a matter of taste and thats all. if youve listened to any DJ set ive ever playd youd hear that "names" are the last thing that matters. but ill leave that for you to judge when you hear me.

as for the personal note - no offence taken. we talked a while ago, and since you are one of my fave musicians in this scene i was happy to receive ONE of your tracks , as a matter of fact it is not from this compilation, but from a different one (PM me if you need the exact name ) ,
and i was happy to receive it because i like your music. if i didnt like it , i wouldnt play it.

released / unreleased is the exact LAST thing i ever cared about. i still play tracks released in early 2007 (SHOCK) , i really couldnt care less.

and finally, i was not bad mouthing : maybe my opinion wasnt a 100% positive, but its only 1 opinion out of many. what reason would i have to badmouth this label or any other?

i still stated my big respect for Iboga and its releases, which for me are some of the highest quality standard in our scene.

so - you dont have to agree with me, but i hope now u understand better what i was sayin

---------------------------------------------
http://www.myspace.com/depthsof
SONNENVAKUUM
Sonnenvakuum

Started Topics :  7
Posts :  33
Posted : Mar 16, 2008 16:38
Quote:

On 2008-03-13 12:14, constantin sankathi wrote:
Quote:

On 2008-03-12 18:20, SONNENVAKUUM wrote:
Hello

OK, you all think its necessary to argue and critisize about music / art.

So lets start argueing about a red dot, a yellow square and a blue triangle on a piece of paper ..... some will see more then others, cause they use their imagination....some will just see colored objects ! Dont waste your time to explain Art to those people.

Create your own Hapiness ......



sorry but IMO this conception is bullshit. if you are not willing to have some altercation about music / art / culture - there will be no development and no improvement. that told us whole art history for example. or what do you think how stuff like impressionism, expressionism, minimal art or what else was growing?
thats a fact man.



Create your own piece of art / music and try to express your feelings trough it....the rest are only words..........

..You realy think if artits like Picasso, Dali, Pink Floyd or whoever listened to the critics and changed therefore, became what they are today ? Go think and leave people their own interpretation of art....there is NO TRUTH !
Sandoz


Started Topics :  5
Posts :  81
Posted : Mar 16, 2008 21:42
Well, I'll have to agree with the majority here. It's a fact that the artists on the psytrance scene are trying to develop new sounds. The other fact is that they have culture and history in the psytrance scene only, and not on other electronic music genres (of course apart from guys like MidiMiliz/Extrawelt, Son Kite/Minilogue and alikes that always did different stuff even with their psytance projects).

So, it narrows down to the biggest problem that keeps most psytrance artists to develop new good music: the lack of a general electronic music understanding and culture. They know shit about the roots of electronic music and do think that minimal is a new thing and that electro is also new, when they have been around for many years now (go back to the 80's and 90's and see what I mean). So, their entrance gate to this kind of sounds is from psytrance perpective and not the other way around. So it's easy to know why the results come out so poor...lack of research and knowledge. Don't anybody take it personally, because I'm speaking about the majority, and you cant hide from facts. If you want to be respected, do learn about the kind of music you wanna make. Because even really well-known and respected people on the psytrance scene, and I'll have to mention who to picture what I mean - Velkro (Wrecked Machines + VOR) simply copy-pasted the pads from Nathan Fake's Outhouse track on their latest release on Sprout, on the specific track named Symphony. How can you be respected if you are just trying to copy...it's the easy way to hit their new goals, but certainly not the smartest and creative way. So, yes, be prepared if you want to be respected.
full_on
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  278
Posts :  5469
Posted : Mar 16, 2008 23:31
I tend to agree with some parts of Sandoz post here. A similar analogy is that generic full on or proggy will please the crowd, but probably will not please those who are into it for a long time.

It turns out that I really liked at least a couple of tracks here.

"My guess is that certain problems cause dancers to get stuck in a loop. The loop leads to meltdown, but just before they crash they become aware of..."

Respect!           .
...Be gentle with the earth...
...Dance like nobody's watching...
.
...I don't mind not going to Heaven, as long as they've got Coffee in Hell...
Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 04:29
Quote:

On 2008-03-16 21:42, Sandoz wrote:
Well, I'll have to agree with the majority here. It's a fact that the artists on the psytrance scene are trying to develop new sounds. The other fact is that they have culture and history in the psytrance scene only, and not on other electronic music genres (of course apart from guys like MidiMiliz/Extrawelt, Son Kite/Minilogue and alikes that always did different stuff even with their psytance projects).




I must say something here concerning this part of the message + quite a few of you guys here mentioning those projects as the RIGHT way to do different music than psy trance. Before I continue, I must state that I really like what both bands doing and play some of their music in my sets.

Sandoz you were mentioning the Velkro track, as a ripoff from Nathan Fake's melody, but you decided not to mention that Extrawelt's fame came to them after they were seriously "inspired" by Holden's remix to the same old Nathan Fake's The Sky Was Pink.. It is very hard not to notice the similarity between Holden's remix ( from 2004 ) and the biggest hit of Extrawelt - Soopertrack.. Having said that Holden loved the work of Extrawelt and signed it immediately to his label, which says that he wasn't as harsh on them as some of the users here are harsh on artists that "borrow ideas" one of each other.

About Minilogue, and totally on different subject, some ppl here claimed few pages before that there is no need for patience ( as I asked for a year of it.. ) and gave example of Minilogue and Extrawelt, to show immediate success of those bands.. As far as I recall, Minilogue exists for at least 5 years, and I would say even more, and only in the last year, maybe year and a half, they have started to rip the seeds they planted for many years. So nothing comes just like that folks, it takes time and a lot of it. Lot's of studio work, lots of mistakes and lot's of tracks that one makes.

These were my 5 cents to clear the picture.

And @ Full On.. Does the "dancer" you mention after he melts down also "prints his ingredients"? That could be funny in the middle of the dancefloor
          A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
Sandoz


Started Topics :  5
Posts :  81
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 09:30
Ok, fair enough to bring this up. But in my opinion it is alot different to be influenced by something, than to go and "sample" something. Bottom line is that it has trademark Border Community style, just like Mistress Barbara release last year or many others, so it was even natural for it to be picked up by the label. Now do ask if Holden would want to release Symphony on his label...that's what I mean. And to me Extrawelt's biggest hit is Titelheld

But the thing is, if they wanna produce this "neotrance" style, go and listen to what was being done by Eye Q and Harthouse on their early releases instead of Border Community nowadays or whatsoever, because once you have figured where something comes from and where it's going, it's easier to set a path to follow...one that preferably is your own.
Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 12:23
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 09:30, Sandoz wrote:
Ok, fair enough to bring this up. But in my opinion it is alot different to be influenced by something, than to go and "sample" something. Bottom line is that it has trademark Border Community style, just like Mistress Barbara release last year or many others, so it was even natural for it to be picked up by the label. Now do ask if Holden would want to release Symphony on his label...that's what I mean. And to me Extrawelt's biggest hit is Titelheld




Well we get totally carried here but this discussion is really interesting.. There are few ways in my book to copy a song.. You can copy the actualy leading melody of a song ( which was done in the Symphony track ) but you can also copy the structure and the trademark details from a song, while the main melody will be "inspired" by the song.. If you note well, then you will find out that Soopertrack has almost one to one the same small breakdowns and rhythmic games as the Holden remix.

For me it's the same thing to tell you the truth, but I don't really care about it since it is produced in a top notch form, and played both tracks as a DJ more than once.

To go completely I would add that in the case of mr. Holden, The Sky Was Pink was sort of a greatest achievement, not only for Holden / Fake, but for the whole Techno scene that fed on that track and it's children for few years till these days really.. And in a way Holden will always look for these "Children" to collect them to his label, and I believe that if "Symphony" wasn't as straightforward dance floor track, but more deep and bassy growling thing, he would definitely consider taking it too to his label. But now I am not only totally but also heavily speculating.

Good day           A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
olivier
Side-A

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1303
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 14:15
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 04:29, Yuli wrote:

I must say something here concerning this part of the message + quite a few of you guys here mentioning those projects as the RIGHT way to do different music than psy trance. Before I continue, I must state that I really like what both bands doing and play some of their music in my sets.

Sandoz you were mentioning the Velkro track, as a ripoff from Nathan Fake's melody, but you decided not to mention that Extrawelt's fame came to them after they were seriously "inspired" by Holden's remix to the same old Nathan Fake's The Sky Was Pink.. It is very hard not to notice the similarity between Holden's remix ( from 2004 ) and the biggest hit of Extrawelt - Soopertrack.. Having said that Holden loved the work of Extrawelt and signed it immediately to his label, which says that he wasn't as harsh on them as some of the users here are harsh on artists that "borrow ideas" one of each other.

About Minilogue, and totally on different subject, some ppl here claimed few pages before that there is no need for patience ( as I asked for a year of it.. ) and gave example of Minilogue and Extrawelt, to show immediate success of those bands.. As far as I recall, Minilogue exists for at least 5 years, and I would say even more, and only in the last year, maybe year and a half, they have started to rip the seeds they planted for many years. So nothing comes just like that folks, it takes time and a lot of it. Lot's of studio work, lots of mistakes and lot's of tracks that one makes.





Hello Yuli,
In my opinion , there is a big gap between beeing inspired by someone and copy pasting someone.
Noone ever talked about a ripp off holden concerning Soopertrack because it's not a basic "copy pasting", it is not obvious as it is with symphony's melody
About the small details you recognize from holden into soopertrack like the small breakdown and rythmic game, this goes back much further than extrawelt's music as this has almost always been midimiliz and spirallianz traditional style,so the influence goes way back in time... wich seems to be quite different concerning wrecked machines, imo

olivier
Side-A

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1303
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 14:20
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 09:30, Sandoz wrote:
And to me Extrawelt's biggest hit is Titelheld




definitely !
Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Mar 17, 2008 14:42
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 14:20, olivier wrote:
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 09:30, Sandoz wrote:
And to me Extrawelt's biggest hit is Titelheld




definitely !




I must agree btw, but the breakthrough was Soopertrack.

Back to reviews on Iboga compi now!!!           A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
hkghost
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  10
Posts :  150
Posted : Mar 18, 2008 00:21
Personally, it wasn't what I expected and I know banel wont take this to heart when I say this wasn't my favorite piece of work from his label.
But saying that I'm certianly going to be in the front row when he comes to tour in brasil.
Pavel
Moderator

Started Topics :  311
Posts :  8629
Posted : Mar 18, 2008 07:22
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 14:42, Yuli wrote:
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 14:20, olivier wrote:
Quote:

On 2008-03-17 09:30, Sandoz wrote:
And to me Extrawelt's biggest hit is Titelheld




definitely !




I must agree btw, but the breakthrough was Soopertrack.

Back to reviews on Iboga compi now!!!




Yes please, reviews!           Everyone in the world is doing something without me
aje
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  99
Posts :  1145
Posted : Mar 18, 2008 14:15
Just to play devils advocate, when Titelheld came out one common criticism I heard was that it is Anthony Rother's "Father" without the vocals, and I must agree that is not too far fetched...

Anyways, I love Extrawelt, they are always gettting better and absolutely rocking live.

About Minilogue being around 5 years, that project also took a sharp turn 2 or 3 years ago from english-inspired prog. house to german-inspired minimal sounds, and it only really took off once they turned towards the german sound and started releasing on classical techno labelsinstead of prog. house ones.           Check out my album: http://www.ektoplazm.com/free-music/gay-satanic-hippie-tiefenrausch
aden
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  81
Posts :  212
Posted : Mar 18, 2008 14:38
Quote:


About Minilogue being around 5 years, that project also took a sharp turn 2 or 3 years ago from english-inspired prog. house to german-inspired minimal sounds, and it only really took off once they turned towards the german sound and started releasing on classical techno labelsinstead of prog. house ones.




Very true. The change in their sound is quite radical. I wish only they would release a couple of more track like "spam" or "little sister". Awesome tracks, second to none, and with a more dance floor perspective than the excellent stuff they do now.

Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Mar 18, 2008 14:59
Ufffff finally some support... I started feeling really lonely here, thanks Aje and Aden, I appreciate.

So we can try to vote for patience after all..           A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
Trance Forum  Forum  Music Reviews - V/A- SET 8 "Electronic Ballroom" - Iboga rec. feb. 08
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