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Son Kite on playing live in trance
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papay
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
213
Posted : Nov 8, 2006 11:01
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actually Squaremeat used violin way before son kite so nothing special about that |
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papay
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
213
Posted : Nov 8, 2006 11:07
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and i agree with ocelot 100% it cant be played live it s a false promise |
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trancescape
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
3
Posted : Nov 10, 2006 06:10
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1. live acts have to start somewhere. they can't be expected to do their first live set to the standards of hallucinogen or son kite. writing 'fuck fake like artists' on your tshirts is not very good encouragement for them to move forward.
2. the artists who wrote this initial article (son kite) have a lot of experience and get paid a lot of money for their sets and have a lot of releases. its no wonder their live is so good by now, they have had practise. they should enjoy this well earned success, rather than write off (literally) \"almost every trance artist\". control your ego. other artists will catch up eventually, try supporting them rather than insulting them. i do agree that each time a live act plays, they should be trying to improve their sets, but judging from this article, it's too late, they're already \"fake live artists\"!
3. the reality is trance cant be 100% live. its not a band. your not pressing every note live. so what you call live, (no disrespect), is not that clever. dropping in samples, or even going to the level of sequencing on the fly (pre-written loops etc) is not that impressive! even using midi unique controllers is interesting, but it's not exactly rocket science.
4. the amount of equipment you take on to stage does not have any bearing on how live a set is. an ableton live set (with or without controller) can be a lot more live than 4 synths, 2 effects units, eq, compressor, 2 pc's etc!
5. the intracacies of trance music gives good reason for tracks to be fine tuned and perfected before the set, rather than trying to do it on stage.
6. what do you consider to be 'live enough' to be a non fake-live-act? can you give us an example of what artists have to do to fit in that 'group'?
7. i think artists who have spent a lot of time writing their music and want to bear their soul to the dancefloor (by allowing their passionate art to be put on display) deserve respect, even if their sets are not yet up to the world-best-live-standards.
7. i think son kite is one of the best live acts in the world. but i am disappointed to see this article.
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Watter
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
12
Posts :
184
Posted : Nov 14, 2006 22:38
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trancescape I think u didn't read all of the posts... so I sugest that before you criticize 'em you read everything they wrote.... I am not here to defend anyone....
Just a quote so that you now what I am talking about
"1. That’s perfectly right … like I said earlier:
“With this I don’t mean that you must get limited while creating electronic music/electronic dance music … rather the opposite! The development of electronic music equipment and computer based music equipment is the biggest revolutions in music making/playing/composing/producing of our time and even though the traps and pit holes are many you also have possibilities to use the new technology in a wise and musically healthy way. Wisely used it also enables you to leave the thought behind and let you play with your feelings even thou you can’t play an instrument or have a musical training. (This is by the way one of the biggest steps in the democracy of the art). There are many artists doing amazing and innovative compositions with only a computer!!!”
by seb
So as you see the discussion here is that you CAN make it as live as possible and not only press play.... and you SHOULD make it as live as possible.....
Thats all that there is to it...
Cheers
 "open your mind....you might just see that there isn't anything to be seen" |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Nov 15, 2006 04:43
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Ocelot - Given what you've said here...
http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/99376/forum/1/start/14
...about live sets, to hear you talking about how you use Ableton 'live' sets my teeth on edge. By your own definition your live sets are not 'live' - yet you obviously bill them as such. To my mind there is a measure of hipocrisy (to use one of the milder terms that comes to mind) in how you present yourself. Perhaps I've got it wrong though, in which case I'd love to hear how you justify calling your performances 'live' ("i make intros, special breaks, outros, and some tracks are only for the live set") when you show such disdain for the term when other people use it.
BTW, before anyone jumps down my throat, OOOD has never made any secret of the fact that there is a strong playback element to our live sets; however when you say that:
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| nobody is making up the music on the spot |
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and:
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| when someone busts out a riff on a keyboard.
etc... great for jams. even spacey psychedeli jams- but not particularly good for making machine like repetitive bleeps and blops. |
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...it makes me wonder if you've ever actually touched a keyboard. You want to stop making such sweeping statements and go and see SUN project, or Star Sounds Orchestra in trance mode, or (heaven forbid, and please forgive me for mentioning it again) OOOD. I should also mention that I'm not taking this personally; it's just the apparent hipocrisy of what you say that bothers me.
As for:
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to DJ my music from multiple cd decks (more than 2- ideally 4 through a nice analog mixer)
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i really like the interface of pioneer cdj100's a lot better than any midi controller with ableton. its more controllable and immediate... i can't explain it...
but i feel it better than playing the same bit from a computer...
so let me ask you- if i do this- with 100% my own music, is it live or is it a dj set? |
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...it's a DJ set, dude, albiet a particularly accomplished one. You're using CD players. 
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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neuromantik
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
28
Posts :
593
Posted : Nov 15, 2006 19:03
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Quote:
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On 2006-11-15 04:43, Colin OOOD wrote:
...it makes me wonder if you've ever actually touched a keyboard. You want to stop making such sweeping statements and go and see SUN project, or Star Sounds Orchestra in trance mode, or (heaven forbid, and please forgive me for mentioning it again) OOOD.
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Don't forget Hilight Tribe, Secret Vibes, Medecine Drum, all great live psychedelic acts which would be unfair to label them as repetitive bleeps and blops. |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Nov 15, 2006 23:51
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illusions
Erebus
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
626
Posted : Nov 16, 2006 06:54
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Posting when your sober usually helps
Colin was actually praising those acts.
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etnarama
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
96
Posts :
510
Posted : Nov 16, 2006 13:27
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Nov 16, 2006 14:13
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Steve - I AM a twat from Bristol And illusions was right - I just put the first three names that popped into my head of psytrance acts who I've seen play live and who (in my opinion) have proper live elements in their live sets. Of course I forgot many others, in particular Highlight Tribe, who are obviously friends of yours, but who - as you rightly say - I haven't seen live, otherwise I have no doubt they'd have been in my initial list.
I find it hard to believe that this is the same Steve Ishwara that started this thread a little while ago:
http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/91884/forum/8
As for Free Range being on dc++, as of about 9am it was still unshared:
http://www.psynews.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=42218
No doubt it won't be long though.
BTW, thanks for giving me an opportunity to plug the album! It' something I don't think I've actually done directly in these discussions because it's very rude, however if I have done so before, then I apologise to the forum.
Mods - if you choose to delete this particular section of the discussion you won't get any argument from me.
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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etnarama
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
96
Posts :
510
Posted : Nov 16, 2006 15:12
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Nov 16, 2006 19:51
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First of all:
Quote:
| Ishwara wrote:
But I still think ur an egotistical turd |
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You're right, I do have an ego, and it's something I try to keep in check on a daily basis. Thanks for being a balancing voice. I'm not being sarcastic here, by the way.
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| Ishwara wrote:
just think as an artist you post alot of crap on lots of forums |
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Why is that a problem? Most of what I post has nothing to do with my own music. Right now I have an album to promote though so there's more promotional stuff in there, of course but maaaan, if it weren't for the internet I'd hardly communicate with anyone lol
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Ishwara wrote:
I just took offence at the sweeping generalisation that people can't do LIVE acts
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...a generalisation that, if anyone actually made it, would have me jumping down their throats for obvious reasons! You took offence at nothing.
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| Ishwara wrote:
As I pointed out - albeit in a rather spannered way - Highlight Tribe CAN do LIVE's |
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As you'll discover when you go back a page and read it, someone else pointed them out as an act who play properly live. It's great that they have someone like you who's enthusiastic about them and willing to push their name forward - every band needs that - but getting into pointless arguments with people about them isn't the best way, imo.
Quote:
| Ishwara wrote:
So - no reputation's have been ruined
Just some acidic comments |
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Your reputation precedes you, Steve. You've already been banned from Psynews and have had moderation issues on Psy-Forum. Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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somarobotics
Somarobotics
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
190
Posted : Nov 17, 2006 22:48
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I think that when someone uses another sound generating device, other than a CD player & mixer, the artist is (or should be) trying to perform with better quality or more improvisation for the public. Therefore, if you are simply mixing tracks or pushing play in a laptop for a big mixed wav to sound, you are a dj. If you are manipulating loops in a laptop and sounding through a sound card with good quality, maybe you are not real LIVE because psychedelic is almost never performed completely live, but you are definetely doing something different... call it live act, live PA, producer set or whatever. You are doing an additional effort than just bringing your CDs and headphones, so you should be "labeled" different. The problem is that label, huh? hehehehe! |
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ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Nov 28, 2006 22:50
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Quote:
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On 2006-11-15 04:43, Colin OOOD wrote:
Ocelot - Given what you've said here...
http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/99376/forum/1/start/14
...about live sets, to hear you talking about how you use Ableton 'live' sets my teeth on edge. By your own definition your live sets are not 'live' - yet you obviously bill them as such. To my mind there is a measure of hipocrisy (to use one of the milder terms that comes to mind) in how you present yourself. Perhaps I've got it wrong though, in which case I'd love to hear how you justify calling your performances 'live' ("i make intros, special breaks, outros, and some tracks are only for the live set") when you show such disdain for the term when other people use it.
BTW, before anyone jumps down my throat, OOOD has never made any secret of the fact that there is a strong playback element to our live sets; however when you say that:
Quote:
| nobody is making up the music on the spot |
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and:
Quote:
| when someone busts out a riff on a keyboard.
etc... great for jams. even spacey psychedeli jams- but not particularly good for making machine like repetitive bleeps and blops. |
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...it makes me wonder if you've ever actually touched a keyboard. You want to stop making such sweeping statements and go and see SUN project, or Star Sounds Orchestra in trance mode, or (heaven forbid, and please forgive me for mentioning it again) OOOD. I should also mention that I'm not taking this personally; it's just the apparent hipocrisy of what you say that bothers me.
As for:
Quote:
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to DJ my music from multiple cd decks (more than 2- ideally 4 through a nice analog mixer)
...
i really like the interface of pioneer cdj100's a lot better than any midi controller with ableton. its more controllable and immediate... i can't explain it...
but i feel it better than playing the same bit from a computer...
so let me ask you- if i do this- with 100% my own music, is it live or is it a dj set? |
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...it's a DJ set, dude, albiet a particularly accomplished one. You're using CD players.
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its ok to unwind the underwear. dont let it get to you.
im being honest.
i make what i feel is the best music possible. thats why i spend my entire life working on making it.
then i go play them.
i play my songs in live.
if you experience an ocelot set you will understand what its about- flow- and mixing.
adding more "LIVE" on top will not make it better. i pack it pretty dense as it is.
i rely on the strength of my music.
i would appreciate support and not such harsh criticism for my honesty.
i can play ANY instrument put in front of me or figure out how to do so in a matter of minutes- i AM a human with opposable thumbs after all. i can read and write sheet music in many clefs. (including alto clef)
i studied music theory for a long time.
etc... i am aware of what others are doing to make their live sets and i dont think its the least bit hypocritical to put my act with the other producers and not the djs
thank you
btw- sun project is hardly making what i can post-edited music. i cannot make my music live. its not possible. i make it with editing. i cant and wont justify this. trust me or not but im familiar with what you speak of. FYI= an ocelot liveset will consist of me playing my songs from ableton and mixing on a real mixer not inside the computer because its better for me and the levels are right.
the antagonism needs to stop. this isnt gym class. please accept the fact that complex post-edited electronic music isn't made live.
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ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Nov 28, 2006 22:53
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As I pointed out - albeit in a rather spannered way - Highlight Tribe CAN do LIVE's
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yes Highlight tribe does live music. i would consider this a warm up to the banging actual psytrance but maybe thats just me.
if you prefer i can just ripoff AB and didge and drum on a handsonic and make it up live... i dont think thats what you want when you book ocelot for a set however.
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