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Son Kite on playing live in trance
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labyrinth
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
37
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275
Posted : Sep 1, 2006 07:19
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yes, this music can be played live. remember when laptops weren't even part of the live set? it was all done with synths, drum machines, and a hardware midi sequencer. the best performance i've ever seen was by The Light (uk breaks project, hooj choons) in like 2000. 2 guys, no laptops, 4 keyboards, drum machine, sequencer, mixer. i brought a friend to the party who didnt even like electronic music at all, listened to country and rock bands. while the opening djs were on, he was just walkin around looking bored, then The Light came on and he's bouncing around the place hands in the air with his shirt off. will never forget the energy in that place.
i know times have changed and it's not logistical to lug around an entire studio, but would love to see some performances like this again. much respect to son kite, their live is amazing as well, definitely my second most memorable live show.
hope to catch the OOOD live show someday, sounds like an impressive live setup.
i think we'll see some innovation and creativity soon, thats what this music is all about.
  Ovnimoon Records
http://soundcloud.com/labyr1nth
http://facebook.com/labyr1nth
http://labyr1nth.com |
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Sunrunner
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
17
Posts :
47
Posted : Sep 4, 2006 03:10
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interesting thread 
i really enjoy a good live act and get disappointed when i see an artist not playing live... it's a sad fact that i've gotten used to this and no longer expect anything great from visiting live artists. being so far away from europe it's a lot more special when a big artist visits the country, but sadly it's not usually that exciting in terms of it being a 'live' show.
personally i don't think the excuse of being a 'technician' and not being able to play an instrument is a valid one - lots of people have said this and that it restricts what you can do live, but i don't agree. if you can mix a track in your studio, why can you mix or remix it live through a mixer? split the channels out and do it? create loops in ableton live and build the track on the fly?
what about tweaking cutoffs on your synths, modulating effects and parameters, triggering samples??
there are limitless options, which son kite mentioned in their post.
i hope that more and more artists start doing live performances - whether you can play an instrument or not there are so many options for what you can do live, there's really no excuse except that you couldn't be bothered 
all artists have to start somewhere - and to me i find a playback liveset + minimal live elements acceptable when you're doing your first few gigs, but it should quickly move beyond that. constant development and change in your performance keeps it interesting for you AND for the crowd.
that's my thoughts on the issue anyway... |
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Sandoz
Started Topics :
5
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81
Posted : Sep 5, 2006 17:04
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I've seen a real live: Highlight Tribe. |
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Kitnam
Mantik
Started Topics :
110
Posts :
1151
Posted : Sep 5, 2006 18:30
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Quote:
| Sunrunner wrote:
if you can mix a track in your studio, why can you mix or remix it live through a mixer? split the channels out and do it? create loops in ableton live and build the track on the fly?
what about tweaking cutoffs on your synths, modulating effects and parameters, triggering samples??
there are limitless options, which son kite mentioned in their post.
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its not that easy, even son kite has a lot of fixed elements in their liveset, i dont want to guess here how many percent, lets answer them on their own.
a mix in the studio takes a few days. remixing it live is nearly not possible, you can only re-arrange it a little bit or adjust the eq a bit to the circumstances but remixing is for sure not possible. about instruments and modulating effects. you can modulate everything, but the question is how good this will work on your track? if such modulating would be that good, you would have allready made it in the production, so every new parameter contains a risk of beeing more worse as the original files.
constant development and change in your performance keeps it interesting for you AND for the crowd.
you are absolutly right!
next year i gonna play some sets. every track is splittet into 4 tracks. means 8 faders to (playing 2 tracks together) control + 8 knobs for eq and effects. even with this very minimal live"set" i need to ask shiva to spend me a few of her arms. |
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Sunrunner
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
17
Posts :
47
Posted : Sep 6, 2006 04:12
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Quote:
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On 2006-09-05 18:30, Kitnam wrote:
a mix in the studio takes a few days. remixing it live is nearly not possible, you can only re-arrange it a little bit or adjust the eq a bit to the circumstances but remixing is for sure not possible. about instruments and modulating effects. you can modulate everything, but the question is how good this will work on your track? if such modulating would be that good, you would have allready made it in the production, so every new parameter contains a risk of beeing more worse as the original files. |
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i see what you're saying, but i still think you can do a fair bit of 'mixing' live. by mixing i don't mean changing eq's, etc. i mean basically having each track as a seperate audio file and using a mixer or midi controller to change the volume levels - bring layers in and out on the fly. this is what i meant by live remixing, and since each layer is already eq'd and sitting in its correct space from when you mixed and mastered the track, it allows you to create a 'new' version of the track 'live' on the fly but still keep the high production and feel of the original track
add to this some additional melodies or effects over the top and it's getting more live |
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Magox
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
20
Posts :
2095
Posted : Sep 9, 2006 13:38
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so much negativity..........just go and have fun......wether its "live" or just mixed......
peace
bOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOm.... |
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Kitnam
Mantik
Started Topics :
110
Posts :
1151
Posted : Sep 9, 2006 14:06
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On 2006-09-06 04:12, Magox wrote:
so much negativity.
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negative offers positive in return.
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On 2006-09-06 04:12, Sunrunner wrote:
i see what you're saying, but i still think you can do a fair bit of 'mixing' live. by mixing i don't mean changing eq's, etc. i mean basically having each track as a seperate audio file and using a mixer or midi controller to change the volume levels - bring layers in and out on the fly. this is what i meant by live remixing, and since each layer is already eq'd and sitting in its correct space from when you mixed and mastered the track, it allows you to create a 'new' version of the track 'live' on the fly but still keep the high production and feel of the original track
add to this some additional melodies or effects over the top and it's getting more live
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thats conceptionally a nice idea. the problem ist the limits of the equitment and physical limits of a human. a song out of my sequencer consists of maybe around 20-50 different tracks. even if you would split and group it into 32 different channels for live-arranging (as far i know sonkite uses 32 tracks) i would need to control 16 tracks with each hand, and each track has a minimum of parameters like 3 eq-knobs, 1 level, 1-3 aux, etc.
at this sum of tracks for my 2 hands and one brain i have to ask how i am able to perform fast switches like breaks and quit element-changes which sometimes are important and necessary (depends on the party and crowd) with 32 tracks you are just overxtented to realise a break which could be sound cool. u usual break consists of many many many different changing parameters like pitch volume, rythm, etc. at the same time. especially breaks are very hard to edit live and for sure you need to prerecord them to realise them as your whishes.
so my decision is, i only use 4 tracks of each main-tracks. which ends up in playing 8 different running tracks together maximum. so i have enough human ressources free to have an eyes on the crowd and feeling for the mood and modulating/arranging the tracks.
another good way to compress a song of 50 tracks into usefull 4 tracks for playing live is to split it into themes. means not exporting and rearranging live every hihat-line for example, but therefore preparing different hihat-sets which include all different combinations you want to have.
the overall question is not, how can i do it all as much live as possible. the question should be: how can i have to most flexible setting to interact with the crowd with the less technical effort. my current set consits of 2 hardware-components: a notebook and a controller. |
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sophicos
Triac
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
161
Posted : Sep 9, 2006 16:49
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just saw this today & haven't read the whole topic actually.
but I'd like to add some feelings about the quote from newsletter.
fake live acts sux.
sorry but it's the ugly truth, i just hate to see flayers and people get excited about some other "live act" and actually what they get is a nice hair-do and a shiny laptop with a 2 chan sound card a phat play button.
the sad part is i see now that it's a global issue.. and i know I'd hate the lack of support just like son-kite had. and hopefully won't again
we can't blame the majority of people that cannot understand the difference, and cannot change the fact that the electronic scene is really open to newcomers & it is quite easy to take-off nowadays... i won't expend this anymore.. we cannot fix everyone or anything that is twisted and corrupt in our small world.
FFLA.
Check triacs myspace page for The next TRIAC LIVE - near you !
http://www.myspace.com/triacs
http://triac.isratrance.com
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Spectron
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
53
Posted : Sep 9, 2006 21:49
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yo cool looking hot |
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Nobita
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
30
Posts :
371
Posted : Sep 10, 2006 04:21
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Jeto
Jeto
Started Topics :
258
Posts :
3252
Posted : Sep 10, 2006 21:47
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jeremy_starseed
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
19
Posted : Oct 18, 2006 12:39
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wOw.
BTW Mantrix from Australia do a old-school live set. They use MIDI to the fullest, but then purists could argue that MIDI is cheating...
BTW Swedish synth company Elektron have released a MIDI interface which speeds up MIDI 10 X.
Then there's the question of music for people on psychedelics - being made by people who have never taken psychedelics -
Or,who have, but have taken up cocaine instead, finding safety in its' ego-bloating effects.
--------------------------------------------http://www.myspace.com/mothershipmastering |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Oct 19, 2006 04:11
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I almost read the whole thread, very interesting indeed... Some great discussions i must say..
i hope lots of people read, cause its been educating 
mantik i like your rational mind
Seb and/or marcus, you wrote some beautiful words, very inspiring.
great thread!
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Janue
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
514
Posted : Oct 19, 2006 06:44
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Wooow amazing thread im happy to see opinions from all people , really respect what seb have to say about the fake lives i totally agree.
I think ok you make the music you spend hours,days,months in the studio maybe not whit the intention of making a live act but to maybe just do music, then u have the chance to begin playing it on live act and the easiest way for maybe all people is make a mixed stereo file,drop some Vst on Live,cubase,logic etc and make some ambient sounds, im not saying that this way sucks no no no, there is some peoeple out there that actually sweat their asses making good things on the play.
My point is that if we spend hours and days and months in making good music, why not to spend a few hours also developing a more interacting live act like drop some loops ,new bass sequenses,some melodies, i dont know is just that in the end it's so easy to say "mmm yeah i will do the mixed stereo file and earn the bucks and maybe later il will try to make this better" but some times that later never comes people start to love money and get used to have easy access to the money just for pushing play on the laptop.....
I hope i can start see more people getting more interesting ways to play their live act, i dont care if they dont bring a fucking band or a effects processor or what ever.... u can do a lot of things just with a keyboard,your laptop, a bunch of loops and some imagination and most important determination to bring something different for your music.
Respect to all the people who have posted their opinnion the common factor that i see here is progression and im happy to think that maybe the next time i see, Phony orphans or Behind blue eyes or Son kite or Sun control species i will now that this guys are breaking their asses to give something appart from the usual stuff.....and thats something to smile about y preffer this any day of the year that see another wanna be kid that jumps behind their laptops thinking they are the big shit!!!(Coff*Coff*eski......o)
Peace!!!!
If u are Something, Dont ask for nothing
If u are Nothing, Dont ask for something |
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zeb nation
Started Topics :
5
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31
Posted : Oct 19, 2006 15:15
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Quote:
| You should print t-shirts with the slogan "FFLA" fu** fake live artists! |
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Seb, bring to Brazil next month some t-shirts, I will sell all for, people will love !!! hahahaha
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