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How much you get (or pay) for play at the chill area???
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Josko
Started Topics :
4
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119
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 22:22
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I want ot really ask sorry to Nanda and to all the chillout djs not considered. We made some mistakes and i assume all the responsability about chillout stage. I use to play chillout around and i know what we are talkin about..
We can just learn from organization such the Voov..it was our first time and for sure we can do much better.
Anyway i want to ask again sorry to Nanda and PKS. I have a lot of respect of you guys.
Ciao
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www.myspace.com/giorgiogatti |
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Kyma
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
260
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 23:21
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I have been playing downtempo for about 5 years, in the beggining in Brazil and for the last 2 years in the US.
For what I heard from friends in Brazil , the chill-out scene is much better now, since the brazilian trance scene has seem a huge boom in the last couple of years. The reflection of that is more live acts and djs being recognized and paid(I hope) and international artists being part of the chill line ups.
When I was there one night parties didn't care about chill-outs same as I find here in NYC. WIth the justification that doesn't bring any public. So if there was one we would play for free or even produce it ourselves to have the chance to spread the sounds and energy....(I talk about Belo Horizonte, not Sao Paulo, where the scene was much more developed). We had a weekly for sometime there, but very little $ and lots of effort....it was worth it, since money wasnt our main objective......
Festival's were wonderfull....most of the main ones in Brazil had a very good production(deco, artist treatment, sound....) even tough , normally, the only monetary return would be to cover costs of traveling(which already made me happy) and tix for food/drinks. For me the best one I ever played was at Trancendence's Oca. Unbelievable in all aspects....cant think of one issue.....
Moving to the US (NYC) I found a very small scene on this side of the country, festivals normally dont even pay for the travelling costs and local one night parties ignore downtempo....
We did some events focusing on downtempo, bringing Ambient Alchemy Tour, Waterjuice and Pitch Black. All of them wonderfull events, but always with a reduced number of people from 100 to 300 lets say.....making it hard to bring artists....so now we decided to focus in more local movement and see what happens through that....
We have thought about doing a weekly, but a chill night wouldnt attract that many pople in such a full-on environment...preparing now a more lounge/jazzy focused set to find some spots on the city to play that dont depend on the trance scene to work out.....
I believe that even the chill out needs some upbeat downtempo music depending on the time....it's definetely a place to rest and relax, but it's not made for just sleeping....as i said....depending on the time....if the dj is there really feeling the energy of the environment he will figure out what to play....but we know how hard it's to please all ....
a human's mind, once stretched, cannot go back to its old way
http://kymastream.com
http://myspace.com/kymastream
http://realityengine.org
http://interchill.com
http://cosm.org |
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nanda
Started Topics :
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20
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 23:39
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Josko my friend.. all the appologies accepted and yes. I really know that Sonica was the first time of that magnitude of fest. in Italy.. and I think as my personal experience ::: except for the one at the chill area ::: that it was great fest.!!
Of course there are MANY things you will have to make MUCH better. but its also clear for me that if i went it was bcz i wanted (always part of my mission) and in some how i coud imagine the mess from b4.... no worries.
If I have mentioned my experience of Sonica; in this forum; it was bcz its not the first time that it happen.... and after so long time that the chill have been part of the Festivals.. i think we must have sometings clear.. specially how to treat the artists.. we are humans and yes.. they are the GUESTS and make differences with the ones you pay more.. SUCKS!.
Its like make a dinner at your place and care that everybody is happy... and not just give all the attention to the one who brought the best wine.. same same but different  .
Josko I am offfering to you all my knowledge in this area in case that you need it. Happy i could give you some advices and ofcourse to help you to manage the stage in case that you need it. I remeber to have said to Valentina the same thing when i saw all the mess over there --- wishing you all the best and yes.. no bad feelings to anybody.. no worries.. nothing personal.. indeed.
One Love
Nanda |
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Michael H
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
69
Posted : Sep 10, 2005 16:15
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it is important to let party promoter know how you feel about things so they can make the changes and learn from their mistakes.
sometimes they are not even aware of these things happening so it is important to tell them,this is what these forums are for.
upbeat music in the chill;i'm not saying DON'T play it
,i'm saying don't play it ALL the time which is happening a lot at parties in England.
it was so nice at The Voov & Wonderland parties in Germany to hear a diverse section of music that wasn't completely upbeat or the usual same artists..
unlike the dance rooms we can play right accross the board in the chill....we can play so many styles and genres so hey let's keep it that way
keep it fresh
and keep it real
xXx |
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Nini
Started Topics :
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21
Posted : Sep 10, 2005 17:14
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Nanda-ji,
It is always good to get these issues out in the open and start discussing the problems and solutions. The chill scene needs people like you who keep improving and questioning. Personally I love the chill and I wish I had more time at the Voov.
The chill out is for me the place where I can find myself again, where when the moment is right I find healing and I appreciate it. I find chill out djing is such an art and I can't quiete understand why the party goers don't. Why are there so few people in the chill out (Omni 2004 e.g.) when their was the most amazing music playing?
I hope that as this scene grows and get more and more professional ( but I have heared many people also saying they don't want it to become more professional because the spirit gets lost...) all DJs get paid a fair return for their efforts.
Nanda i love your music and I hope you feel supported by these messages. I think it is important to have people who are living from DJing because you will see any changes happening. You will be the first to tell us when things are getting better...
Take care love nini |
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brij
Started Topics :
9
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204
Posted : Sep 11, 2005 19:18
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It was three or four years ago I went to the Voov, and like I say I was little disappointed by the set up of the chillout, but I did really enjoy the music. It was just a shame that during the quiet moments you could hear the beats from the trancefloors. For instance, many tracks such those by Carbon Based Lifeforms' would be completlely lost. Well it sounds like I shall definitely be going back to the Voov next year.
Seagoblin, what did you think of the chill music that was played at the Baraka Chillathon outside Oxford a few weeks ago, as the majority of the music played was chillout. I think that we managed to have quite a wide range of chilled music, in between the trance.
I would love to see a festival with only one stage, that has a progression. Such as trance at night, chillout during the late morning and afternoon, maybe with prog in the evening (and early morning) and then full on at night. That way the promoters would have an equal budget for all musicians, regardless of the style of music they play. It also means that you do not have the problem of having to choose between two artists who you equally like. Because otherwise both artists would only have an audience half the size they rightly deserve.
Nini, I think you'll be pleased to hear that at this years Omni the chillout almost always had many people in it. ALthough part of the reason for that was when the sound system on the main dancefloor broke down. But it just showed how many people really enjoy chill when they take a break from the trance.
I don't think that as things become more professional that the spirit will get lost if the right sort of people are running things....... it is just that often lots of money attracts the wrong sort of people, or makes the right sort of people lose sight of why they starting organising trance parties.
www.BarakaRecords.com/brij.htm
www.myspace.com/djbrij |
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Nelito
Started Topics :
1
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188
Posted : Sep 11, 2005 23:28
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hello folks.my name is Manny and I'm from LA.I will be short.I'm doing this for years,since before chill out areas, tends and etc.WE HAVE THE MUSIC...the most bealtifull.parties,festivals are a great way to get your name and music (style) out,but as money goes ...we are on the low buget area.
now...I do survive(actually pretty good)'couse I can use my music(And also pay the compousers)for comercials ,fashion shows,art shows,privat partys,after partys and that list goes.
the party is my hoby,the music is my love. you all have a great sunday.Manny. |
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andrew interchill
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
435
Posted : Sep 12, 2005 01:45
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I reckon it is best to focus on quality over quantity and not to put too much pressure on gigs to support your lifestyle - unless you are happy to take the rough with the smooth...
i have to say that anyone who wants to do an ideal job in the chill area should follow the example set by Arash Atman at samothraki ...
he succeeded in obtaining and managing an adequate budget to manifest his vision..., and the vision was wonderful whatever anyone else may have to say
we played on a surround sound 37k rig brought from the conservatory in Athens, next to the beach, under the shade of the plane trees... lovely decor too...
flights paid for, proper payment, and a welcome by people who were happy and proud to welcome us to their country...
i think pks was there... it was fun .... fantastic line-up too
either organisers should go large and try to invite the best the world can offer, or they should keep things small, intimate and local...
trance areas do get a far greater allocation of resources, but as time goes on this will change...
musically the chill zones have greater freedom and are far more interesting
out here in BC, there is almost an equal interest in danceable downtempo as there is in psy/progressive or whatever... notably the Invision festival...
humph put on the breathing space events in UK... people loved those...
there is more room for community, seeing friends, hanging out ...
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organisers can be cynical ; they know people are hungry to play... so they take advantage of that.
the result is very average line-ups...
if you want the likes of gaudi, kaya project, greg hunter, bluetech, shulman, ott, ishq, simon posford, nova, youth, gio, hiyoshi, adham shaikh, suns of arqa, brother culture, toires, shakatura, solar fields, aes dana, and others of this level...
then you're going to have to do things professionally and pay the going rates...
you could add to this list, and pad it out with a few dj's and you'd have a line-up that would be genuinely interesting AND likely to bring people to the festival...
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perhaps the best way forward is to encourage organisers to book more chill live acts...
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Justin Chaos
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
117
Posts :
3086
Posted : Sep 12, 2005 13:30
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On 2005-09-12 01:45, andrew interchill wrote:
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organisers can be cynical ; they know people are hungry to play... so they take advantage of that.
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Indeed they do.
The thing is...what's the reason why they start to spin chill in the first place???
I know plenty of cases of people who started just because of the lack of chill DJ'S...this way they just can get free entrance and a couple of drinks for a couple of hours of mixing the 10 chill records they own.
But I don't think this guys are the one to blame.
The promoter/organizers mostly consider that there is no need to pay a chill act when you can have another one for free.
As well the budget in soundsystem is often waaay lower than the dance floor.
What can we do???
Well, for my part I just don't play if I'm not happy about what I'm getting.
My fake plants died, because I did not pretend to water them. |
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delay
Started Topics :
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4
Posted : Sep 12, 2005 17:30
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On chills.....
Well, a huge post with lots of scope nanda....!
I've been involved with music, touring and djing since the early 90s - mostly in Australia and mostly bands (downbeat ones -hahahah!).
With pay for perfomance, it always pays to look at the show as a whole - good crew? good location? a lineup you like? good deco? good reputation(festival/party crew etc) free food/drink? place to sleep? free ticket/s? paid transport to the show? then...yeah, what's the pay?
There is also the other side of the coin - a large festival thats complains "oh, we haven't got the budget" should really consider downsizing some part of their personal profit or general costs. Doesn the soundsystem company provide anything for free? what about the decor? stall holders? and so on...
22 djs getting a token 100 euros for a 3 hour set makes just over 2000 euros. hardly going to break the bank for a 15,000 ticket selling festival. if it does, then the message being sent out to the chill djs is that we're simply not worth paying - chilling isn't important to the success of the festival. we know this isn't so.
fortunately, many chill djs seem to have a large amount of love for what they do.
There is the old chestnut "you pay peanuts, you get monkeys". Are we monkeys?? hahahah. well, cheeky monkey maybe  but seriously...
my voov experience was one of really good organization, good crew... well looked after artists, but there were still sound system quality issues in the chill. i had a great time and it does match up with the 5 years of australian / japanese outdoor parties' organisational skills. except one thing - all the other ticket parties i've played at have paid the chill djs. the bigger parties in australia have been getting people to do things for free the last couple of years (they provide a soundsystem+tent (infrastructure) and a party crew plays for free. generally, when money starts to be made, organisers go looking to cut costs in the easiest places - new djs/crew/deco/helpers are the softest targets. cynical, but *generally* true. the best australian parties i've played at are free soundsystem parties (hat gets passed around for generator fuel) and tranceplant (ticket price goes to buy trees, which the party goers actually plant themselves in the day, and party at night - true!. djs play for free)
(one point to make here is that Germany is famous for treating musicians well in general (food, accomodation, meeting artists at the airport/bus station etc). )
live? dj? "lively"? first, people generally don't care so much if they like the music, but if someone's performing it adds an extra dimension to the show. "lively" is a joke in my opinion. booking artists on their name as a producer, then seeing them dj their own tunes off CDR under the line-up name of "famous musician"-lively set is a bit desparate and an obvious budget corner-cut.
more live shows - yeah!
less, ahem, "lively" or "famous dood" DJ set (own music) - yeah!
more chill music.... of course, yeah.
it's been great to read about some parties that worked well and gave the chill spaces what they needed, so lets make sure we put our energies in that direction - not sniping at things that went wrong in the past....!
one of the answers to the (usual) chill dilemma is to put on yr own chill festival. most festivals start off with 200 friends or so... which reminds me - is there an online list of worldwide chill festivals? someone let me know (i just joined here...so apologies if it's in the FAQ).
one last thing...nanda asked what we spend on music ourselves. i've never kept count and i think it'd be a little shocking if i worked it out. now i just have to work out how to ship it all to australia next month!!!
ok, keep the chill flag flying y'all.
peace...
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Michael H
Started Topics :
5
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69
Posted : Sep 13, 2005 13:08
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On 2005-09-11 19:18, brij wrote:
Seagoblin, what did you think of the chill music that was played at the Baraka Chillathon outside Oxford a few weeks ago, as the majority of the music played was chillout. I think that we managed to have quite a wide range of chilled music, in between the trance. |
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i thought the music was fantastic all the way through,yes it was varied which made a nice change |
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Michael H
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
69
Posted : Sep 13, 2005 13:15
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if you want the likes of gaudi, kaya project, greg hunter, bluetech, shulman, ott, ishq, simon posford, nova, youth, gio, hiyoshi, adham shaikh, suns of arqa, brother culture, toires, shakatura, solar fields, aes dana, and others of this level...
you could add to this list, and pad it out with a few dj's and you'd have a line-up that would be genuinely interesting AND likely to bring people to the festival...
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these people might make great music but it doesn't they will play great sets,i've heard quite a few of them 'live' and apart from Ott none of them have excited to me,i definately wouldn't pay money to hear them out again,
i would rather spend it on a cd instead.
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Michael H
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
69
Posted : Sep 13, 2005 13:18
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Quote:
| live? dj? "lively"? first, people generally don't care so much if they like the music, but if someone's performing it adds an extra dimension to the show. "lively" is a joke in my opinion. booking artists on their name as a producer, then seeing them dj their own tunes off CDR under the line-up name of "famous musician"-lively set is a bit desparate and an obvious budget corner-cut.
more live shows - yeah!
less, ahem, "lively" or "famous dood" DJ set (own music) - yeah!
more chill music.... of course, yeah. |
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brilliant,thank you xXx |
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andrew interchill
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
435
Posted : Sep 13, 2005 23:08
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I think i would buy their cd's and go and see them perform...
they are often the creators of the music that we play... we are selectors and mixers...
i think, in comparison to the artists, people shouldn't get too precious about being dj's...
it does make a difference if someone is actually mixing their tracks live, like ott, or collaborating with virtuoso musicians [like greg hunter, adham shaikh, suns of arqa], or playing live keys in a live mix [like ishq, bluetech and others], or just blowing us away with unreleased music played straight from the source...
gaudi can play it totally live... [if you can afford to book the full band] - i saw him maintain a beat on a handsoniq and theramin in front of 300,000 people -nothing to fall back on apart from his own confidence and ability...
there's a lot of mediocrity out there... so anything that is less mediated, more immediate, more authentic, actually played live impresses me much more than the same music played on a cd...
part of what impresses me is that a live show is often evidence of vision, organisation, budget and a desire to do it the best way possible... whenever people go the extra distance when they could have just cut the corner we all benefit.
I agree that producers booked as dj's and just playing cd's can be a disappointment... i guess sometimes it can be a way to hear unreleased material...
as we all chill out as time flows by, I'm going to much prefer to see someone like greg hunter play live with a collection of musicians on stage than i am going to want to hear some dj present a seamless mix of unreleased tunes... [no matter how good the dj may be]
In a way, i want to hear the mistakes... the ones that make the perfect moments mean more...
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John
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
76
Posts :
768
Posted : Sep 13, 2005 23:34
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as we all chill out as time flows by, I'm going to much prefer to see someone like greg hunter play live with a collection of musicians on stage than i am going to want to hear some dj present a seamless mix of unreleased tunes... [no matter how good the dj may be]
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I’ve never understood the obsession the psy trance world has with unreleased tunes. Maybe its because everyone is a DJ and not many people are actually very good that one way of marking yourself stand out is with tunes that are unreleased (but actually sound just like all the others that have been released…) I knew a guy who was quite a big trance-techno DJ for over a decade and he’d always have folk asking him about the “unreleased” tracks he was playing – but they were often tracks from years back that no one picked had up on at the time – but played put in their right context and made special –and that’s what DJing is all about (oh, and he was technically brilliant as well which helps!)
At the end of the day (brian), most of the audience who have paid their cash (instead of blagged in on the guest list) don’t care whether a track is unreleased or not, or played from a CDR or laptop not – they just want to be entertained (in its broadest sense). So if a tune is good or if someone is putting a great show on then they are doing what they should be doing…
End of rant!
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