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Freedom of Speech? pffft....

pr0fane
Moderator

Started Topics :  418
Posts :  3816
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 19:48
Quote:

On 2005-03-09 14:31, Madpup wrote:
I don't think your individual opinion of that topic being pointless is sufficient reason for locking the thread. I am sure there are plenty of users who saw the point in a topic like that.



Yes, it was surely my own opinion, and I’m sure there are plenty of users who think it wasn’t the right decision to lock the topic, but on the other hand there would certainly also be users who found the topic pointless. We can never satisfy everyone, just make the decisions we think is for the best of the forum.

Quote:

On 2005-03-09 14:31, Madpup wrote:
I can not believe you tried to justify it by your fear that topics like that will overrun more serious topics. Do you have anything to back that up other than your unqualified (IMO) opinion.



There are regularly new “best of” threads, ranging from “best of 2005” to the more obscure “best goa track for doing LSD on a Tuesday morning”-like threads. I can’t prove that they’ll overrun more serious topics (never said I could) it is just my personal impression, that more lenient moderation would cause more of these threads, attracting a lot of fast “killah” replies, and degrading the overall experience of the forum (especially after the new rules in the Top10).

Quote:

On 2005-03-09 14:31, Madpup wrote:
A prime example of ridiculous over moderation. See my earlier post about egos.



Once again I’m sorry if I might seem offensive and egoistic to some users, it is not my intention. All my decisions are based on what I think is for the best of all users here.          DJ pr0fane (Iboga Records) | Multiphase
www.sunrisesupplies.com | www.iboga.dk | www.soundcloud.com/pr0fane
ShivaS
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  51
Posts :  861
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 19:51
well the root of the problem are guidelines and of course israteam itself. Profane is a good moderator and shares our thoughts;)
          I may rise, but I won't shine ...
sherlockalien
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  629
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 21:58
didnt convince me, sorry...

you try to put this 'whats in your playlist right now' in the same league as 'what are you listening to on sunday morning when making breakfast'...
those are two totally different topics..

if you cant see that, im very sorry...

if you can, then you should see why locking it was not necessary...

and shivas, I dont think the problem are the guideliness themselves.. I think the problem is in some moderation, which are overly done, and the 'Im a moderator therefore I have to use my power' seems to be a great factor in this... Now, its pretty hard for people to acknowledge that they may be mistaken, and the ego, social games and role status play a big part in this.. I dont expect anything to change, and I dont think that its anybody's obligations here to change, specially because as I said before, people are paying for this forum and using their time to provide people for an opportunity to speak about certain things.. So we are already being provided something for free, and this is not nobody's obligation to give us that..

I am stating my opinion though, since this is the first thread in this community I feel I can somehow say..

I continue thinking that this is way too moderated, a lot of status games preventing them to realize they are mistaken.. This is a great forum for the number of people and artists that you can speak directly to, lots of info on upcoming and existing releases, but when it comes to freedom of speech and funny and interesting different topics, its not the forum where I go to...

I dont understand why there isnt an off topic forum here.. that is one question I always had.. couldnt you guys make an off topic forum?
full_on
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  279
Posts :  5475
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 22:48
sherlockalien, come on...

The database is full of garbage like:

"what's in your playlist right now"
"what was in your playlist yesterday"
"what was your best playlist ever"

We are full of "best of" threads over and over again.

There isn't an off topic forum because this forum is about PSYTRANCE.

IMO an off-topic session even has potential to mess up with this forum.

It's very difficult to moderate an offtopic session.
People will write all kind of stupid bullshit there, the good posts will be so diluted in the bullshit that it will be almost useless.

Also the number of posts in the offtopic session soon will be more than the sum of posts in all other sessions.
That's my two cents...
Respect!           .
...Be gentle with the earth...
...Dance like nobody's watching...
.
...I don't mind not going to Heaven, as long as they've got Coffee in Hell...
sherlockalien
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  629
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 23:30
again thats judgement.. I dont consider a 'whats in your playlist right now' garbage, and I already explained why it may be much more interesting than top10 topics or anything of the sort.. but who am I to say anything, right?

so what this forum is about psytrance? Thats a very fixed and rigid mentality imo... The world is not so black and white.. where is the dividing line between whats psytrance and whats psytrance culture, and what is opinions and what is some joke that is connected in some way, or whatever... Thats why imo things are always repeating and boring many times here (no offense), because of this 'rigidness'.. People dont want to fit in a box, they want to spread out.. I believe in being a little more open.. and pleased dont mistake 'being a little more open' with 'no moderation at all'....

plus, you say that an off topic place has potential to mess up the forum.. Well why not give it a try? How can you say before a try has been given? Maybe it has potential to save the forum, heh? I know another forum, lets not mention it, that the off topic sub-forum in a psytrance forum that is one of the funniest and interesting places on the net, where you can talk about spirituality, other genres of music, get to know people a bit more, etc, AND about psytrance too.. it always come back to something related, freely , and not because of moderation... and it doesnt get out of line (of course you need a little bit of moderation.. but not much)


again I say: This is nobody's obligation.. its just suggestions, and Im happy that at least there is some space here where I can get a lot of info and talk to many artists... but imo it would be even better if a few changes were done

just my 3 cents (haha, I beat you )

Madpup
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  21
Posts :  174
Posted : Mar 9, 2005 23:55
Sherlockalien...your two posts sum up exactly how I think.

Also one man's garbage is another man's treasure, For example it amazes me that for Istratrance moderators how a topic 'What is in your playlist right now?' can be considered more of a useless thread than "Animal's reaction to psy trance'.
KakoOlalaJwal
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  116
Posts :  2565
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 00:42
Quote:

On 2005-03-09 23:30, sherlockalien wrote:
again thats judgement.. I dont consider a 'whats in your playlist right now' garbage



Yes it is.. Definitaly.. As long as it is ONLY a list of artists/tracks/albums/whatever without any SINGLE explanation from the user about why he posted this or that : yes it is !!

Sorry for the caps, but it was (once again) the case in that thread Pr0fane locked..

List of names, I can find some much more longer on any database (psymindexpander, discogs, shops, and so on)...

At least, one have to suggest something to explain his choice or selection in order to make his statement interesting, basta..


          .
.
"Get your dose of BoOgie !"

http://www.bunkum-records.com
http://www.myspace.com/zekakoo
ShivaS
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  51
Posts :  861
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 09:01
exactly, sorry guys but i am also wasn't convinced by reasons and explanations you brought. i am still sure that it's nonsense to have posts with long track listings. just put some signature with "n.p. track"

Madpup, and Animals has more meaning since it's a funny and imho interesting topic to dig into just for reading, rather than page down track lists.
I personally read through ALL Animals posts and in these "what do u liste and best of" u usually read some 1st posts and last as well before you post without getting deeper.
          I may rise, but I won't shine ...
ShivaS
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  51
Posts :  861
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 09:04
but at least as you see we may discuss it and topic won't be locked or deleted. It is important topic but seems we have different points of view. Anyhow i don't think that changing rulez in top10 or locking these kind of topics like "best of" and "what do u listen while.." is a main thing that brought all of us here. There are other much more interesting things to discuss and to read about.

I'd still say: Enjoy your stay and we will try to make this world better (together)
          I may rise, but I won't shine ...
darkiller
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  15
Posts :  324
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 09:06
shallow threads r only for your fingers
sherlockalien
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  629
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 15:00
I guess we have to agree on disagreeing then

(and please kakoo, dont make it seem as if something, like that topic, IS ABSOLUTELY OBJECTIVELY uninteresting.. its YOUR subjective point of view, shared by some, and not by others )
full_on
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  279
Posts :  5475
Posted : Mar 10, 2005 18:46
Quote:

On 2005-03-09 23:30, sherlockalien wrote:

but who am I to say anything, right?



Wrong idea... You are important to this forum, all users are. That's why we are replying to you.


Quote:

On 2005-03-09 23:30, sherlockalien wrote:

plus, you say that an off topic place has potential to mess up the forum.. Well why not give it a try? How can you say before a try has been given?



Well, I said that because I already did it many times before (I was Admin in lots of forums), and always with the same result.
I was the Admin of PSYBRASIL, and our off-topic session lead to so many fights that I decide not to put the forum online anymore. Much more trouble than joy.
Just look at the plurall forum, it has so many bullshit (IMO) that I can't stand that place.

I know it's a matter of opinion, but we want to keep this forum as a psytrance forum, with infos and useful threads related to psytrance.
Hope you all understand we are doing our best and that we always take users opinions in consideration.
Respect!           .
...Be gentle with the earth...
...Dance like nobody's watching...
.
...I don't mind not going to Heaven, as long as they've got Coffee in Hell...
sherlockalien
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  629
Posted : Mar 11, 2005 00:37
the off topic in psynews (or sonic blend, when it was more active) runs perfect and as I said is one of the most interesting places... Just to show how I can pick examples to show the opposite of what you say..

you cant generalize what happened in one forum and say it will happen in all forums...

since it wasnt tried here, I dont think its right to say it WILL ruin the forum.. thats pure expeculation, with no objectivity at all, and the exact opposite is just as true...


but yeah, I guess its pointless now.. seems the veridict has been given, and to give more arguments would be a waste..

at least Im happy that this thread wasnt locked

let me go do something we all enjoy here, and listen to some music
jaramogi
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  15
Posts :  918
Posted : Mar 11, 2005 13:53
one thing i cannot understand - why the mod's delete for exem. posts which have not enough words in it,
is there any minimum of words i must post?

ShivaS
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  51
Posts :  861
Posted : Mar 11, 2005 14:16
sherlock: we had already offtopic in the beginning.
You missed it since we are more year on the www than anyone other forum.
As result (and it also happens in psynews now) that offtopic forum has more posts than other sections.
so we removed it and so shell be.
          I may rise, but I won't shine ...
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