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-- Freaky dragons festival -- 7 / 14 August 2007
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anam
Started Topics :
2
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426
Posted : Aug 18, 2007 20:10
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On 2007-08-18 19:29, DETOX wrote:
I wasnt there and i dont know what kind of warnings they gave to the people
--- no disrespect but...so why r u up for?
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second and most important is that the police wasnt brutal in the first place and the video shows that only when that stupid officer decided to attack things got out of hand so its not fair to characterize all the officers there just because one of them is stupid.
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--- police was not brutal for 8 fucking seconds...they could explain things before all that shit.
that's just brutality my brother.
u'r right mate...that's where we live...but i WONT be agree.
loveandlight.
om namah shivaya |
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anam
Started Topics :
2
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426
Posted : Aug 18, 2007 20:14
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pretty confusing quotes  |
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anthony
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71
Posted : Aug 18, 2007 20:29
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I understand your point of view Detox, but once again:
-we all came for a legal festival from all over the world.
-the orgz told us to wait for a solution.
-We never block the road, and even help to regulate the traffic.
-we were waiting (no protesting!!!) pacificly at the entrance gate, we were sitting to do not express any menace to the authorities.
-The guardia civil arrived without any warning and beat us with an incredible rage.
It seems obvious they had order to use the force, and I can assure ALL of these dogs were there to beat some hippies...
So I find it really rude to read it's normal and we are a bunch of idiots who deserve their treatment.
at the end I feel to have been used as a human shield for an unresponsible organization.
PEACE |
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Meik
Started Topics :
3
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14
Posted : Aug 18, 2007 21:55
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[/quote]
It's not about trustin in HIM but i think he needs a real crew and not some fuckers around him like the danish ones who left with the cash (8.000 euros) without sayin thank u to anybody and created more fights than good vibes sorry to tell it
I hope this is not true! If so, i am ashamed of being Danish!
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tajmahal
Tajmahal
Started Topics :
3
Posts :
73
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 05:09
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Well this is just really SAD !!!
I just watch the video now,where you see party enjoyer waiting for plan b festival.
And beeing hitten by police ,don t ask to police to be peace and love in a case we are not respecting their rules.
To organize a festival is not to organize a free party,need a bit of serious in here !!!
By lacking communication, poeple were waiting and expecting that it will happen for real.
Even me in barcelona airport i was expecting a plan B.
That was the only info i got.
Noone spoke to me about a festival without autorization.
So personnal message to christophe it s maybe time to communicate and assume a bit.
Silence kill,facing reality show a bit of honour and good intention at least that.
Thanks for all of us.
Taj ;-((((
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gaspard
Yab Yum
Started Topics :
50
Posts :
641
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 13:28
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Greetings DETOX
No-one mentioned anything political, true. However this situation here does bring up some political reactions. We re all positioned somewhere on the political spectrum, and when I read your opinions on quite a few subjects (on which we've crossed swords before), I do find you to be on the right of things (at least compared to where I am!). I'm not saying its right or wrong, I'm just pointing it out. I never said anything about extremist or fascist which is quite a different kettle of fish.
I'm sorry to hear that you've been gassed and beaten. i don't wish this treatment on any person. But would you say that you deserved it? And how would you react if people sat here telling you that the police's actions that day was justified and that if you hadn't done something wrong then it wouldn't have happened. We are party people, not terrorists, there are ways of dealing with people in a much more appropriate way. And as Anthony pointed out, the road was not blocked as traffic was getting through.
In your answer to Anthony, you say that you obey Greek laws, well how come your party got busted??? Isn't this a contradiction in what you've been saying above?? Obviously you don't obey the law that well, as certainly the police was right, no??
I do agree with you (it does happen) that when visiting another country you have to obey the laws of the land. However, again, there are ways of warning people about violent action, and again the people on the road hardly constituted a threat. Moreover, no matter what the law is, I still think its WRONG to beat unarmed people, whoever they are and whatever they are doing. And the fact that other countries have even harder police forces doesn't make this ok!
I totally disagree with you on the point of sufficient warning and reason to use force in such a way. In my eyes, there was no warning! I'm actually wondering if you've been looking at the same video as we have.
Finally, why is it so hard for you to believe people that were actually there? You'd rather believe that the cops had reason to do this??
About settling in the north pole... the thought has crossed my mind, but i've heard that polar bears are right bastards, and internet connections are shit..., so for now i'll stick with Sweetsourland!
 Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Terry Pratchett |
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DETOX
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
296
Posts :
6194
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 16:20
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
We re all positioned somewhere on the political spectrum, and when I read your opinions on quite a few subjects (on which we've crossed swords before), I do find you to be on the right of things (at least compared to where I am!).
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Exactly on the point,just because i might be a little more right than your position in the political spectrum doesnt mean that i am right wing at all 
Just for your info my life and views on it are not based on politics at all and i judge each situation and action based on my own experience,knowledge and beliefs which means that on any subject my opinion on it could sound righ,left,center or whatever.
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
I'm sorry to hear that you've been gassed and beaten. i don't wish this treatment on any person. But would you say that you deserved it? And how would you react if people sat here telling you that the police's actions that day was justified and that if you hadn't done something wrong then it wouldn't have happened. We are party people, not terrorists, there are ways of dealing with people in a much more appropriate way. And as Anthony pointed out, the road was not blocked as traffic was getting through.
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Each and every time i had problems with the police it was on my own knowledge,i could avoid all this trouble just by not being there where i was or by just walking away from the 'crime scene'.I dont know if i deserved those problems or not but for sure i could avoid them if i wanted and thats the situation also with this festival,i dont say that the police acted on the right way but i say indeed that the people that were beaten could have avoided such a situation by just walking away.They didnt,they risked and got what they should expect to get.Oh and by the way based on the videos the road seems preety much blocked to me but thats just a detail anyway.
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
In your answer to Anthony, you say that you obey Greek laws, well how come your party got busted??? Isn't this a contradiction in what you've been saying above?? Obviously you don't obey the law that well, as certainly the police was right, no??
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I thought you were smart enough to avoid such a question.As everybody knows a trance party even with all the licenses one can get can be busted for a thousand reasons.First and most important reason is the fact that in trance parties many people consume drugs that the organisers cant always spot or find,if the police has an undercover in the party then he can give a signal to his boss and have the party busted in zero time.There are a thousand reasons for a party to get busted even with all the licenses acquired,in my situation since you asked the party was busted due to problems that the owner of the place that i was holding my events had with the tax authorities,lets say that i was paying to him some money that he had to pay to the government and he didnt,i did my obligation towards him and the government but he didnt and when the party was busted he didnt only had problems but i had too.And like you can understand when a party gets busted many many accusations can come up many of them just fictious and funny.I mean its easy for an organiser to get accused of drug trafficing just because the party people drop their stuff on the floor when a party gets busted.How can you prevent such a thing?Well you cant obviously i guess.
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
I do agree with you (it does happen) that when visiting another country you have to obey the laws of the land. However, again, there are ways of warning people about violent action, and again the people on the road hardly constituted a threat. Moreover, no matter what the law is, I still think its WRONG to beat unarmed people, whoever they are and whatever they are doing. And the fact that other countries have even harder police forces doesn't make this ok!
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The amazing and very interesting thing with different countries and cultures is that different people react differently on the same situations.When i was in Ukraine last year for a football match and we were having some problems with the local fans the police authorities were just standing near us without doing anything,when the same thing happened in Madrid and in La Coruna the police reacted instantly and brutally.The people got attacked in the festival in Spain,in Scandinavia they might got more warnings in order to leave the place,in Japan they would probably tolerate them even more,in USA they would probably get arrested immediately,in another country the police could even open fire at them who knows,different countries,different laws,different cultures,different ways of acting and behaving,thats why i insist that you have to be very carefull when being on a foreign country because what seems unlogical to you might seem very logical to the local people
Quote:
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
I totally disagree with you on the point of sufficient warning and reason to use force in such a way. In my eyes, there was no warning! I'm actually wondering if you've been looking at the same video as we have.
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Same videos different minds
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
Finally, why is it so hard for you to believe people that were actually there? You'd rather believe that the cops had reason to do this??
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I do believe the people that were there but every coin has two sides and lets say i like being devils advocate especially in a situation where i suspect that things werent exactly the way party people describe them.
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On 2007-08-19 13:28, gaspard wrote:
About settling in the north pole... the thought has crossed my mind, but i've heard that polar bears are right bastards, and internet connections are shit..., so for now i'll stick with Sweetsourland!
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Heard Eskimo girls are very friendly though
Toodaloo Motherfuckers!!!!! |
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Rene Kiff
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
4
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 17:35
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[quote]
PSY SPIRIT
It's not about trustin in HIM but i think he needs a real crew and not some fuckers around him like the danish ones who left with the cash (8.000 euros) without sayin thank u to anybody and created more fights than good vibes sorry to tell it!!
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Sorry but i do really have to come my self down right now, after reading this crap..
What the f... are your building that thing on...
1.the danish team work they asses off too make the festival come true, some off them been there for
3weeks or more trying to make the hole thing happen, they were only surpose to do the progressive stage, but in the end the have to help/do anything becouse ther were to many lazy people not doing there job...
2. was it the danish team´s job to get the permissions, and talk to the town hall before making a festival ???
NO!!
3. i have AFTER you wrote this talked whit the most of the danish team (the rest is in france together whit chris and the littel money there were left ) so your dont know what your TALKING ABOUT..
so stop accusing people and talk to chris before you writing something like that... all becouse you have lost money.. we all have.. but that not an excuse for your accusation!!!
i was surpose to do the progressive stage manegment, but i ended up whit working my ass off (becouse others dont like to) for trying to help making a great festival, and then after see the gurdian civil take it all down... borrow money for the flyticket so i could come home and now listning at you..
4. why did you think the danish team create more violence.. what are you talking about??
Becouse some of them were big guys or what, becouse non of them were making fights only the police did...
????????
Rene´ |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 18:25
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very sad story
im sorry for all involve
i cant see how anyone even think the might be any justification for this robopigz beat up peaple who are sitting down on the gorund! with no weapon! with nothing!!! only with plan to dance 3 days... scary ha! call the police!
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Sunrise Emotions
Sunrise Emotions
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
32
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 22:11
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See at youtube the sad videos..
Keep it underground..thats the only way for us to live in peace
All the rest is pop culture...bang bang ..fu*#ing bastards |
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Aida Noridania
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
126
Posted : Aug 19, 2007 22:23
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very easyly said: detox is 100% right i haven't been there but been a lot in Spain. Enough to know it's laws and structure:
Spain has two "police forces" one is the "policia" and is very polite and troublesolving and use rarely violence except in cases of being agressed.
the guardia civil is for things that you better stay out of: if those appear and you sit with the belief the party is legal then be sure it isn't if they don't let people on the site: the "guardia civil" is compareable to the national guard in the USA. If they are called for that means two things:
1 whoever has been organizing the event, it means that he already received warnings from local and authority instances, even most likely from the police! that means those warnings and requests to leave the site or to not organize the festival has been ignored... when one ignores warnings they get out the stick and that explains the "guardia civil". they have by law the right to "act in violence" if their work is stopped or hindered they mat repel by force even if the hinder or blockade is pacific and with no violence it's their job to "clear the road" for further activities even if that are the destruction of the so beloved artworks they are just executing the orders of which the organizers were warned from.
2 as foreigner inform: the "guardia civil is not a simple police corps: they are called to clear area's and when other instances weren't effective. see it as a last resort move. If friendly communications fail, they clear it by force how sad it may be for the people handling in good thrust, without knowing the precedents, those guys don't talk anymore as it was thus the last resort to clear an illegal activity. if it were cars and buses with "Policia" written on it it would have worked, there would have been communication, but not with the guardia civil see point 1 guardia civil is between the army and police force: if you got those on the back you LISTEN especially if you don't know the country's uses
so now blaming the police for violence won't help: the organizers fucked up big time to get the guardia civil there, blocking access means you ignored friendly way brought warnings. (as the authority has the duty to warn they will send the guardia civil to clear the problem situation and restore the "normalized situation"
remember that in all this they don't come with no reason: there was a definite reason for them to be there! and if you give a festival in a country, you abide by the laws and possibilities of that country! i am sure it would have been as easy to set up a legal freaky dragons festival, with no mess then how it was done. Especially if such line up and such success was present.
but either way ignoring the authorities is like slapping them right in the face...
no surprise they slap back
simple karma: action brings reaction and as foreign organizer ignoring local authorities is making things worse.
so how absurd it may sound it happened on the territory of Spain, and on that territory the actions of the "guardia civil" is legal and supported by law. even if in your homecountry this would be unthinkeable...
but be sure that if the guardia civil appears on the scene that there is a serious trouble: they never are called for banalities! (and yea i know a festival like freaky dragons is a union of peace and love and light and respect, but when the local authorities their words are simply been ignored...
where's then the respect?
if that respect is gone will they then respond with respect?
you harvest what you sow unfortunately it weren't the people responsible for this that did harvest the disrespect the organizers made towards the local authority
and again the organizers may have been ignoring it with a mindset that says "earth is from everybody so we just continue" but how noble and idealistic (and even 100% correct as well) this may be, there are others to take in account. when that's not done well then it is asking for this mess...
edit: oh yes i also believe earth is there for everybody but if i would organize a festival like this one i would at least take care that the official part of it is done. in the end it isn't a big effort...
my two cents
no situation is stronger then a heart that dares to love
so may the force of life light and love be with you |
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MadScientist
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
97
Posts :
1220
Posted : Aug 20, 2007 02:08
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wise wise words...I think you summed it up
https://soundcloud.com/hazak
"Have you ever had that feeling where you're not sure if you're awake or still dreaming?"
"Hmm, yeah... All the time, man - it's called mescaline. The only way to fly!" |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Aug 20, 2007 12:31
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whatever "if they called guardia civil be sure its cirious situation"
real big problem , peaple wanna dance.
a person beating some other human with sticks on his head, while he is sitting down and do not act violent , is to be asshole , or just ass.
even if ur job is in the guardia civil (either the nazi troops...) the fact u believe u have good reason to smash someone head doesnt make it right.
they treated peaple (DANCERS) like the israeli army treats arab (prooven to be) active terrorists.
well maybe abit nicer i admit  but still thats the first association i got. and its bad.
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Justin Chaos
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
117
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3086
Posted : Aug 20, 2007 12:48
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You're missing the point dude...the Guardia Civil wouldn't have to do anything if the organizers had the homework done.
My fake plants died, because I did not pretend to water them. |
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sue
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
261
Posted : Aug 20, 2007 17:28
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and if i get it right: the ppl were not "just dancers" sitting peacefully on the road and suddenly getting hit by police walking around... come on, they put up a resistance against the local police force! if they did not know that it could be very-very dangerous for them, than i have to say that they were absolutely out of their minds.
hitting peacefully sitting ppl is BAD (with huge capital letters) for sure.. nobody questioned that i think. but the situation is far not the same if you are a police force trying to do your job and the other person is a foreign hippie trying to hinder you doing your job..
they wanted to block the entrance so that the guardia civil could not enter the area. right? it sounds like an illegal demonstration for me, but correct me if i am wrong. no wonder if you get in trouble at an illegal demonstration... and as detox said wisely the trouble can be different in different countries, all of the ppl could get arrested right away in the USA and they might also be shot in Columbia, who knows? one thing is sure: it was dangerous to do what they did whatever license they were hoping for because of whatever promise they got from the organizer..
if blaming somebody (besides the ppl themselves who got in trouble cause they wanted to 'save the party' on their own against an ARMED LOCAL FORCE) blame the organizer...!
very sad story anyways, indeed.
www.psylife.net |
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