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dj skills and software ?

Jester Records
Jester Records

Started Topics :  24
Posts :  254
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 01:18
first we get fake lives, and pretty soon we will get fake Dj sets..

great.. the future looks sooooooooo promising..

          www.jesterrecords.ca
John
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  76
Posts :  768
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 15:20
Technology cannot (yet...) tell you which track should best follow another given that particular party atmoshere or where to bring it in for best effect. Its what come out of the speakers that is important and if technology allows people to spend more time doing creative things and get the dancefloor moving - then great.
Magox
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  20
Posts :  2095
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 17:35
Quote:

On 2007-06-16 15:20, John wrote:
Technology cannot (yet...) tell you which track should best follow another given that particular party atmoshere or where to bring it in for best effect. Its what come out of the speakers that is important and if technology allows people to spend more time doing creative things and get the dancefloor moving - then great.



Agreeeed!!

As a lover of music, people, smiles and trance festivals; I always thought it was about the music and not about the dj. I am grateful for the music that they shared with us, and I recognize who they are for it, but that is about as far it goes about that.

I would much rather hear continous flow of music that I like, no matter how it's done, as opposed to music that is mixed without flow.

To call someone a fake dj for using some of these dj'ing software programs is about as ludicrous as a house dj that mixes with vinyl records calling trance dj's fake and less talented because they mix with cd's. It was another evolutionary step up when we moved up from vinyls to cd's, and now we are moving another step up with many of the Djing softwares, thanx to technology.

First it was many of the dj's that used vinyl records that use to criticize everyone who uses cdj, because they thought that the essence of mixing was lost. Now some of the same people, that were part of that new wave, using cd's to mix are criticizing people who want to use some of the people that are using newer djing software.

I don't have a problem how anyone want's to mix the music that they share with us, the most important thing for me as a dj, is someone who recognizes the ambient that we are in, and doesn't force the music that "HE" wants to play, and that they provide continous flow of whatever madness that it is that they want to share with us.

I always thought that we have the choice to either embrace or resist change. In my experiences, embracing what lies ahead of us, proves to be much more gratifying than resisting the future.

           "On the path of spirituality, one ventures to vanquish one’s own faults rather than to judge others"
DJ Buju
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  70
Posts :  1334
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 19:31
It is a vital part for the DJ to take the crowd on a journey and to have a good selection and flow with the music but still it does not overcome the need to MIX and not letting some computer mix tracks for you.
I would feel a bit weird mixing from computer.
Gotta have the feeling in my hands, to touch the record and feel what im doing

Look around, search and the answers are there.
the movie Scratch comes to mind...
Allegoric - Psynce
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  61
Posts :  1453
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 20:52
@ DJ Buju : allrite naw let's see some other things also except for ur touching and feeling the things......

some points on comp....

2 or more tracks can be played from the same cd with a computer

u can have billions of effects on a comp if you know how to use them which will definitely help the crowd to go on a good journey.
instead of limited effects on some hardware

you can play at a better bitrate {48/24} with the comp which will give better sound and will again help the crowd to get a better journey ofcourse


the main aim of a dj is to play music in a party and make it sound good no matter what......
it doesn't make a difference if it's hardware or a software
music is the only priority !


respect !            Truth will always guard our souls......


http://www.myspace.com/allegoricpsynce
Pavel
Troll

Started Topics :  312
Posts :  8634
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 21:33
Quote:

On 2007-06-16 20:52, Allegoric - Psynce wrote:

you can play at a better bitrate {48/24} with the comp which will give better sound and will again help the crowd to get a better journey ofcourse




CDs are manufactured at 44.1 @ 16. You can't play it with better quality than that.           Everyone in the world is doing something without me
Allegoric - Psynce
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  61
Posts :  1453
Posted : Jun 16, 2007 21:42
^^ you can if you have a good sound card which supports 48/24
!!!!!

i recently played my tracks on 48/24 in kodai party            Truth will always guard our souls......


http://www.myspace.com/allegoricpsynce
orange
Fat Data

Started Topics :  154
Posts :  3918
Posted : Jun 17, 2007 00:45
yes if u play ur music it can be in higher bit rate but playing commercial music in wave thats ripped from original cds it cant go higher than 16/44

orange           http://www.landmark-recordings.com/
http://soundcloud.com/kymamusic
Spindrift
Spindrift

Started Topics :  33
Posts :  1560
Posted : Jun 17, 2007 14:50
Some points why I think software DJ'ing is superior to CD's/Vinyl:

1) Ability to instantly trigger loops and fx in sync with the music.

2) Good overview of your collection and not having to make considerations like if next track you want to use is on the same CD as your currently playing.

3) An enormous selection of fx available to spice things up and make interesting transitions.

4) No time spent cueing and beatmatching means more time to do creative stuff and focus on track selection.

5) Graphical waveform display is a great aid in making good transitions.

6) It keeps you busy in the DJ box....no waiting for the right time to kick in next track...instead you mess around with some fx or play around with a loop.

7) You can get very nice converters for your laptop that will beat the ones in a CDJ.

8) Hard Drive jockey sounds a lot cooler than Compact Disc jockey

To me those are more important points than the arguments for CD DJ'ing that has been presented here.
If you love looking thru your CD case and cue/beatmatch by ear it's possible also if you use a computer.
Pointless, but possible and you still get some advantages that software brings.

That the computer would mix for you or that software DJ'ing would be fake is hardly worth commenting on.
Sure you could use Traktor in auto mode to have it do basic intro-outro mixes and that would be fake indeed, but I don't think any computer DJ does that.
It would be boring and result in bad mixes.
          (``·.¸(``·.¸(``·.¸¸.·`´)¸.·`´)¸.·`´)
« .....www.ResonantEarth.com..... »
(¸.·`´(¸.·`´(¸.·`´``·.¸)``·.¸)``·.¸)

http://www.myspace.com/spindriftsounds
http://www.myspace.com/resonantearth
Allegoric - Psynce
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  61
Posts :  1453
Posted : Jun 17, 2007 18:36
Quote:

On 2007-06-17 14:50, Spindrift wrote:



4) No time spent cueing and beatmatching means more time to do creative stuff and focus on track selection.

5) Graphical waveform display is a great aid in making good transitions.

6) It keeps you busy in the DJ box....no waiting for the right time to kick in next track...instead you mess around with some fx or play around with a loop.

7) You can get very nice converters for your laptop that will beat the ones in a CDJ.

8) Hard Drive jockey sounds a lot cooler than Compact Disc jockey







           Truth will always guard our souls......


http://www.myspace.com/allegoricpsynce
Pavel
Troll

Started Topics :  312
Posts :  8634
Posted : Jun 17, 2007 23:33
Quote:

On 2007-06-16 21:42, Allegoric - Psynce wrote:
^^ you can if you have a good sound card which supports 48/24
!!!!!

i recently played my tracks on 48/24 in kodai party



If those are your own tracks than yes. If they were ripped from CD then not.           Everyone in the world is doing something without me
Jester Records
Jester Records

Started Topics :  24
Posts :  254
Posted : Jun 18, 2007 00:28
Quote:

On 2007-06-17 14:50, Spindrift wrote:
Some points why I think software DJ'ing is superior to CD's/Vinyl:

1) Ability to instantly trigger loops and fx in sync with the music.

2) Good overview of your collection and not having to make considerations like if next track you want to use is on the same CD as your currently playing.

3) An enormous selection of fx available to spice things up and make interesting transitions.

4) No time spent cueing and beatmatching means more time to do creative stuff and focus on track selection.

5) Graphical waveform display is a great aid in making good transitions.

6) It keeps you busy in the DJ box....no waiting for the right time to kick in next track...instead you mess around with some fx or play around with a loop.

7) You can get very nice converters for your laptop that will beat the ones in a CDJ.

8) Hard Drive jockey sounds a lot cooler than Compact Disc jockey

To me those are more important points than the arguments for CD DJ'ing that has been presented here.
If you love looking thru your CD case and cue/beatmatch by ear it's possible also if you use a computer.
Pointless, but possible and you still get some advantages that software brings.

That the computer would mix for you or that software DJ'ing would be fake is hardly worth commenting on.
Sure you could use Traktor in auto mode to have it do basic intro-outro mixes and that would be fake indeed, but I don't think any computer DJ does that.
It would be boring and result in bad mixes.




You bring forth some interesting points and it really puts pressure on ignorant people like myself who don't see the advantages of using a computer.

I have never used software to mxi music (except before i started up as a Dj, i was using MJ Studio to mix with two soundcards on a crappy PC) so i have no idea really what additional effects they might be able to bring forth to the table. I had no clue you could loop segments of tracks using software in direct time without it lagging (i mean, the computer playing the music).

i guess it all comes down to this :

do we really want to have music destroyed by extra effects added by software ?? i mean, we could always just load up music into soundforge before hand, modify the song by adding cool effects and "creativeness" until you don't even recognise the song anymore. Techno is already loopy music and is adding extra loops really going to make things more interesting ?

I mean hey, you could also add as advantages to using software for djing, taht you can sitdown durring your whole set smoking fatties since there is alot of extra time saved from not having to find cuepoints or even think about where or when you should kick in your next mix. You also don't sweat as much from the "on the spot" pressure of having to improvise and flip through your CD case to find the next best track (that also mean's your cloths will be dry after your set), find the cue point, pre-beatmatch to ensure presision and then finally Eq the next track in properly using a, hardwear mixer... sounds hard?? yeah, tell me about it..

Call me wierd, but i like to "feel" the Dj as he works, while he works, noticing the smile on a succesive beatmatch and a long mix that he had to keep adjusting to ensure perfections. Maybe i like people who work hard to get results, who know's really ??

Hey, its a free world in the end and people can use whatever they want to get the "job" done. But i honestly don't think we can compaire Vinyle Vs CD's to CD's Vs PC's because there is a huge difference.

But hey, like i said, im an ignorant guy i guess. Maybe one day i'll just throw on a pre-mixed CD since people only care about what comes out of the speakers!!!           www.jesterrecords.ca
John
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  76
Posts :  768
Posted : Jun 18, 2007 00:46
Quote:

On 2007-06-18 00:28, Jester Records wrote:

But hey, like i said, im an ignorant guy i guess. Maybe one day i'll just throw on a pre-mixed CD since people only care about what comes out of the speakers!!!




I think you missed the point... a good DJ should be able to read the crowd/party/vibe and select tunes & mix accordingly - no software can do that...
Spindrift
Spindrift

Started Topics :  33
Posts :  1560
Posted : Jun 18, 2007 02:42
@jester

Don't you do an EQ sweep sometimes when mixing CD's?
I guess you would think it would be a bit pointless to make them in soundforge beforehand?
And if you mixer could load any plugin as an effect, would you only use EQ's then as well?
Sure you are right that one can go overboard with too much fx, but if you use them the right way they can add to the set, especially in transitions.

And I don't see the problem with if a DJ would modify the material if the result turns out good.
But it's even better if he can do it live.
It's IMO very nice with the current technology that the borders between DJ and producer gets blurred and that you can do so much live with electronic music that used to be impossible/expensive/hard.

And sure you COULD use the extra time to smoke a fatty and if that helps you get into the mood then it's time better spent than digging through a CD case IMO.
You still have to choose where to kick in the next track though, unless you play back a ready made set.
Sadly enough I've seen people do that with both CD's and computers and I find it disgraceful, but I think that the subject is about mixing with computers, not people editing sets beforehand.

As long as you actually are mixing live with the computer I can assure you that you'll get sweaty as well if you try to do the best job you can.
The difference is what you will feel is an achievement or a failure, but for sure you'll get both also with a computer.
Sure the basics is easier on a computer, and if you settle for simply fading and EQ'ing one track into the other it will be a lot less work.

But if you try to do the best you can with the equipment available it's a lot of work.
I been spending ages with preparations like configuring my controllers, warping tracks in live and writing scripts to have mouseless control over the software.
When playing I have on top of what's available on the DJ mixer 24 knobs, 9 faders, 48 buttons and 37 to keep track of and it's enough to keep me sweaty at least.
And the real skill in DJ'ing is not to be able to find a track in a case or to beatmatch...it's knowing how to weave tracks together in a way that works for the crowd...and software will never make someone who can't make good track selection and transitions to a good DJ.

I'm not really disagreeing with any of your points...there is plenty of lazy CD DJ's in this scene that give the impression that they don't do the best they can...and there will be computer DJ's like that as well.
If using a computer makes their mixes a bit better then I think that's positive, but they way I think about is what's can be done with the technology when it's put to best possible use.

Beh...now I've been writing too much again.
Anyway...whatever floats you boat is fine with me...I just like to clear up what I perceive as misconceptions of how computer DJ'ing works.
          (``·.¸(``·.¸(``·.¸¸.·`´)¸.·`´)¸.·`´)
« .....www.ResonantEarth.com..... »
(¸.·`´(¸.·`´(¸.·`´``·.¸)``·.¸)``·.¸)

http://www.myspace.com/spindriftsounds
http://www.myspace.com/resonantearth
Jester Records
Jester Records

Started Topics :  24
Posts :  254
Posted : Jun 18, 2007 21:01
i guess where i get jammed is because it seems to "make the job easier" by using a computer. That is the way i see it and probably why i have such a wierd impression on mixing with computers.

I have seen people pre-load entire playlists in there so called mixing application and then, yes, they make the transitions well but it just seems weird to have all the tracks laid out perfectly beforehand..

like you said though, it still depends on the user rather than the software !!           www.jesterrecords.ca
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