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What happened to the real hippies from the 60s?
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Pointy
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 18:03
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Hey mono mono, your post made me smile, very good drawn caricatur and sure fitting for many.
Still I think you shouldn´t forget what the hippie culture brought up and what changes that made also for your life.
Like Spindrift mentioned environmental, social, cultural and issues of personal freedom got adressed and brought into awareness of people. And I think we are still benefitting from this, like from other inventions, that sprang from hippie minds.
About the drug issue, I also think, that psychedelic substances were very much reason why the hippie culture came up in the first place and that other substances were having their well known destructive influence.
And PKS what´s this game "how low can you go" about, any fun?  |
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Infinite_Sun
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 18:50
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Makes me wonder how long I can go?
Most "hippies" I know of didn't sell out, they adjusted to the reality of their surroundings rather than completely dropping out. They have kids that I call friends, they have jobs, cars, houses - watch movies on the weekends and enjoy getaways to the shore. Now me and my friends, have jobs, cars, girlfriends, apartments and we do not see ourselves as slaves to our debt.
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mono mono
Onnomon
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 19:05
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In general, to make an impact in this world (preferably positive), it usually takes some financial strength. You could say "Mother Theresa didn't have anything". She probably didn't have many personal artifacts but she had the assets and backing of the mighting Catholic Church.
Maslow's "hierarchy" implies that it is difficult to save the world when you can't even feed yourself.
With a few ducats in your pocket, you have more options available to save the world. And actually buy some psytrance CD titles. Certainly to raise your kid. I'm sure many an aging hippie has learned this lesson.
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Dopamin
Dopamin
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 19:05
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they all became president in the US or governors.
 For the TT beliver: www.techtrance.2tunes.com
Le S4B0T3UR - Ground Effect (UNRELEASED)
Le S4B0T3UR - HooverKraft (V/A Night Vision compiled by Oscuro)
Le S4B0T3UR - Coroded (UNRELEASED)
Le S4B0T3UR - SumoRider (UNRELEASED)
booking@de-c |
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Pointy
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 19:17
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Hmm, I never heared that Jesus was rich.
He made quite an impact, if he was god´s son or not.
And this world in general excisted very fine for thousands of years without money.
I don´t think the hippies had all the solutions, or always the best way to approach things, but that doesn´t mean the ideas were wrong. |
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mono mono
Onnomon
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 19:47
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Commerce has existed well before mint. In prehistoric times one would have think, for the alpha male, that females are form of well-being aka "money".
Jesus built hot-rods prior to his career as a savior.
The question probably should be "How many hippies of old have renounced those days, or discounted them to nil?" In other words, how strong has the ideal (a whole other discussion, just let this slide for now) pervaded in their later life?
Really, asking "what happened to the 60's hippies?" means that the questioner can't discern their presence, either visually, or by action. For you Europeans, I would have to think that much of Europe's socialism has many similarities, in terms of social justice and a support net for the needy. This probably didn't necessarily form out of 60's itself Alot of us American "hippie-types" are fighting for that kind of justice against our consumption and asset-oriented society that it keeps greedily gravitating towards, not unlike a rats that keeps administering narcotics to itself. I'm not saying being rich doesn't prevent you from these ideals too, wealthy people tend to donate a lot of money to the needy, and there are certainly wealthy hippies. Plus, they've breeded the next generation of hippies, perhaps they're called psytrancers, among others?
Infinite_Sun, perhaps you start the trend of the Wall-Street-cyber-hippie-trancer. We need operatives in that world. Change doesn't happen if we stay cloistered together, all alike, saying the same thing.
so shut me up! and sue me!
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rodram
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 20:23
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Most of the "old" hippies in my environment, were very educated people. The intelectual type if I might say so.
A big part of them became managers or business owners, but still carry some of the old spirit somewhere deep down in their heart...
Some of the most inteligent ones died on overdoses, or some other kind of suicide...
Some continued and are on wellfare....
Some just put it all behind them and became "regular" people...
and some.... are on this forum...
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Pointy
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 20:39
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@mono mono:
First of all, I don´t believe in a darwinistic evolution. 
"Jesus built hot-rods" ?? My english leaves me here, I don´t get it.
And what he was doing before he showed up again at the age of 33, is very questionable. From what I read and what seems reasonable for me, he was travelling to India and Tibet and learned from the monks there. The first hippie so to say.
Money was invented as a means of exchange and was not privatly owned until a couple of 100 years ago. It was put out by the government (king) to make trade between people easier and it got collected back to the king, just to be put out again.
"wealthy people tend to donate a lot of money to the needy", well, mono mono wealthy people are often wealthy, because they are taking advantage of the poor, so yes, they´d better give something back.
And often enough this so called help is yet another scam to make more money, or save some tax.
And just because Honguito is asking "what happened to the real hippies" doesn´t mean, that he isn´t able to "discern their presence, either visually, or by action", if he would actually meet one.  |
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Dimitri
Inactive User
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 20:56
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Spindrift
Spindrift
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 21:12
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Commerce has existed well before mint. In prehistoric times one would have think, for the alpha male, that females are form of well-being aka "money".
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I would say that money is not at all same as having power or influence.
By todays standards, for sure it is many times.
What you have to remember is that money is really a very young phenomenon in the way it's used today.
Sure, it has been used for trade purposes for a while, but like Pointy said, until a couple of 100 years ago money was not owned by individuals but the king.
The counts etc didn't technically own their land, they was only responsible to look after it.
When they died or or didn't look after their duties, the king would hand over the land to someone else.
Part of that resposibility was to look after the common people on 'your' land so they had food and housing.
They wasn't rich and giving to the needy, they did their duty distributing food and material, if they would not, someone else would take over their responsibilities. |
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Infinite_Sun
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 21:53
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The Wall St. trancer is indeed a unique breed of individual. They go in waves.... working.... partying... sleeping... staying and resting a lot....
An office may drain energy - but never let it drain the spirit.
We understand that parties take money to throw... and that artists invest large sums in the equipment they use to make the music.
We are a new breed of Hippie and we keep moving no matter where the beat comes from. |
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mono mono
Onnomon
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 22:07
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On 2004-10-01 21:12, Spindrift wrote:
What you have to remember is that money is really a very young phenomenon in the way it's used today.
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Sounds like a tautology to me. We can only use money in today's way...well...today. Do you really mean options, derivative, currency trading, etc? Money and bartering are forms of capital, the more general concept, and represent goods/services. The practical effects of currency and barter are the same although legal tender is easier to use. The US used to have a gold standard where the dollar was based on a quantity or gold but this is too limiting; a world without gold still has use for currency.
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Sure, it has been used for trade purposes for a while, but like Pointy said, until a couple of 100 years ago money was not owned by individuals but the king.
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In the United States the currency itself is technically still property of the government and whose holder is endowed with certain priviledges by the King...er ah..government. The King is still in charge here. Try printing your own money, especially if it looks like the King's money. The clever Ben and Jerry hippies are using the King's own money to manipulate the King.
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They wasn't rich and giving to the needy, they did their duty distributing food and material, if they would not, someone else would take over their responsibilities.
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I'm talking about elective giving of disposible income. Of course there are tax incentives but that's not the only reason, you're still giving money away, even with tax savings. That's not as deep as giving you life blood but it's different from a factory owner paying the workers, which is basically the example you've giving.
Was owning property against the prevailing 60's hippie view? Hey! Real 60's Hippies! Stand and be counted!
Ministry anyone?
-D
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Spindrift
Spindrift
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 22:48
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sorry everyone...getting in to a long and detailed  again
The govenment does legally own the money, yes.
For example it's illegal to destroy your own money.
Same in every country I believe.
There is a difference though having no actual use for the money, since you cant buy land as you whish, not being allowed to stockpile the money and not having shops to spend it in.
It was only a tool to ease trade, but the system wasn't built around it.
And I do think it is a huge difference from a factory owner today, and the functions from the people with big responsibilities in the pre-money system.
With the current system, the people running things is not responsible for what they do.
Just look in your own brief history there in the states, and what happened when they abolished slavery.
Before the workers didn't get a salary, but was fed and provided with housing by their 'slave-keepers'.
When the north came down and should abolish slavery, they put paid workers in the cotton fields instead.
It might sound great, but as a matter of fact, the salary was not enough for even the basic needs of the workers, and they started to die from malnutrition, something that was rear among the slaves.
If you have a responsibility, you have a responsibility.
If you just trying to make money, you don't need to be responsible, especially if you can look short term, and jump on to venture after venture.
Just face it, commercialism is bad...it doesn't promote a good society, just greed and rippoffs.
Good society is built around efficient and sustainable management of resources, art, science, peace, and good feelings between people.
Money actually works against all those at the moment at least.
So the hippes was more right than the ones who became normal, and accepted the lies that they feed us about how the system is constanly improving. |
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Dimitri
Inactive User
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Posted : Oct 1, 2004 23:19
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Maybe some of us are fundametalists ? |
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