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S O U N D

Allegoric - Psynce
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  61
Posts :  1453
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 12:53
Quote:

On 2007-01-20 22:29, rich wrote:
I said I was yawning, not on LSD.

Still waiting for somebody (janux or t_o_a) to confirm this:

Quote:

ok, let me know if I'm mistaken. So yawning affects the space in the middle ear. Contracting it. thereby compressing the sound and effectivly 'speeding up' the tempo of the music?










@ rich: mate i have discussed it with many people and they gave me a proper reason for that which was really simple but i think we all got in very much depth of janux's theory
which is 100% right and tried to solve our problem with that without thinking properly

well the reason u feel a pitch change when u yawn is that when u yawn your ear drum gets dislocated from it's normal position and there are hair covering it and when the hair also gets dislocated from their normal position our ear drum takes sound completely in a different way altogether..........

anyone else with more conclusions ?

i think this has to be right because i discussed it with many friends and then in he end i asked my lecturar and he also gave me the same thing....

@ rich : i hope you are satisfed with the answer brother
           Truth will always guard our souls......


http://www.myspace.com/allegoricpsynce
dE.Tonatik
Detonatik

Started Topics :  83
Posts :  2374
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 14:17


Fundamentals of Sound


1. The Elements Of Communication

Communication: transfer of information from a source or stimulus through a medium to a
reception point. The medium through which the information travels can be air, water, space or
solid objects. Information that is carried through all natural media takes the form of waves -
repeating patterns that oscillate back and forth. E.g. light, sound, electricity radio and TV
waves.


Stimulus: A medium must be stimulated in order for waves of information to be generated in
it. A stimulus produces energy, which radiates outwards from the source in all directions. The
sun and an electric light bulb produce light energy. A speaker, a vibrating guitar string or tuning
fork and the voice are sound sources, which produce sound energy waves.
Medium: A medium is something intermediate or in the middle. In an exchange of
communication the medium lies between the stimulus and the receptor. The medium transmits
the waves generated by the stimulus and delivers these waves to the receptor. In acoustic
sound transmission, the primary medium is air. In electronic sound transmission the medium is
an electric circuit, Sound waves will not travel through space although light will. In space
no-one can hear you scream.


Reception/Perception: A receptor must be capable of responding to the waves being
transmitted through the medium in order for information to be perceived. The receptor must be
physically configured to sympathetically tune in to the types of waves it receives.


An ear or a
microphone is tuned in to sound waves. An eye or a camera is tuned in to light waves. Our
senses respond to the properties or characteristics of waves such as frequency, amplitude and
type of waveform.





2. The Sound Pressure Wave

All sound waves are produced by vibrations of material objects. The object could be the
vibrating string of a guitar, which is very weak, but considerably reinforced by the vibrating
wooded body of the instruments soundboard.


Any vibrating object can act as a sound source and produce a sound wave, and the greater
the surface area the object presents to the air the more it can move, or more medium it can
displace. All sounds are produced by mechanical vibration of objects: e.g. Rods, Diaphragms,
Stings, Reeds, Vocal chords and Forced airflow

The vibrations may have wave shapes that are simple or complex. These wave shapes will be
determined by the shape, size and stiffness of the source and the manner in which the
vibrations are initiated.


They could be initiated by: Hammering (rods), Plucking (string), Bowing (strings), Forced air
flow (vibration of air column - Organ, voice). Vibrations from any of these sources cause a
series of pressure fluctuations of the medium surrounding the object to travel outwards through
the air from the source.



( some bits of what i was taught in sae abt the fundamentals of sound )




deton@tik
          out now
http://parvati-records.com/music-shop/cd/out-of-time
Janux
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  97
Posts :  766
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 15:37
[quote]
On 2007-01-21 03:47, full_on wrote:
Quote:

You wrote more in a poetic way than in a scientific way... If I would follow your logic than every kind of movement change the properties of space, and I won't say this is wrong, but just that this change means nothing, it's so small it is just not taken into consideration, and note that, for example even the energy of a bird flying is greater than the energy of most sound waves.





@Fullon. When a bird flaps its wings, it displaces particles. Also, Sound is the displacement of particles.

so a bird flapping its wings, is exactly the same thing as the sound of a bird flapping its wings.

in other words. There is no difference between the the power of a bird flapping its wings and the power of sound as you say.

the power that you say a bird flappings its wings has, is actually the sound of those flapping wings.

i.e the power you were talking about was that a bird flaps--> it displaces particles in the the air--> those particles collide with other particles and make them move, creating a domino effect. (much like the domino effect described by the famous quote "a butterfly flapping its wings in Japan could effect the weather pattern in NY a few weeks later")

now, the sound of those wings flapping are the result of those particles colliding each other as the domino effect occours... so where do you make the distincition between the effect of the flapping wings and the sound of the flapping wings...? they are, in a way, the same thing.

the harder the bird flaps / the more power it uses - the louder the sound --> the more effect it has on its environmnet

wind - the movement of air particles. when you hear wind, what it is, is that you are physically detecting the movement of the particles. which means that wind & the sound of wind is the same thing.

(yes i know if there is no eardrum around to detect those particles moving, then no one hears it, but that does not mean that it is not happening and effecting things)




          www.facebook.com/DjJanux
exotic
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  200
Posts :  5057
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 17:37
A slightly offtopic comment :

Also when i yawn i can see for eg the monitor vibrate in front my eyes for the period i am yawning.. yawning affects both sound and sight.           missing plug-in
v.v2


Started Topics :  9
Posts :  83
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 18:42
crazy topic!

sound is sure physical, and increasingly, emotions too...for eg, we now know what chemical trigger in the brain causes certain kind of emotions; thc, for ready example

everything is physical in a way, or attached to it, just that science has to catch up enough.

everything is not sound however janux, what is everything - is motion, or atleast the best indicator of existence. HOWever, the real point is that absolute stillness is liberation (but maybe thats beyond the scope of this topic)



Janux
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  97
Posts :  766
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 20:19
@V.V2

I dont literally mean that everything is sound, what i mean is that everything is different levels of density and vibration. And since sound is the vibrational movements of these densities... sound applies to everything.

sound is the result of the action of the universe.

absolute stillness is liberation? there is no such thing as stillness. (well i guess thats why you call it 'absolte liberation') every single object / particle in the universe is moving. i mean even when you are not moving its just an illusion, you are on a planet that is spinning very very fast. (and also the particles you are made up of are always moving)

everything in the universe is moving, which means everything is resulting in sound.

thats what OM is... its the overall sound / hum of the the universe.

(you kinda said it yourself... you said everything is motion... sound is the result of motion, infact it is motion)
          www.facebook.com/DjJanux
full_on
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  279
Posts :  5475
Posted : Jan 21, 2007 22:54
Quote:

On 2007-01-21 15:37, Janux wrote:
the harder the bird flaps / the more power it uses - the louder the sound --> the more effect it has on its environmnet



Not true. It depends on a lot of things, and in fact I was refering to the inertial energy of the bird, not to its wings flapping. And also a bird can fly faster while making almost no sound and fly slower making a lot of sounds (and also flapping its wings faster and slower making respectively less or more sound).

Sound is a mechanical wave, which means it needs a physical medium to travel. So there's no sound at vacuum and vacuum is inside the universe, so maybe this can convince you that at least part of the universe is not that much spiritual.

Of course most people hear only sound wave with frequency from 20 to 20.000 hertz, but one can argue that even a cold metal bar is making some sort of sound (because its atoms are vibrating unless they are at zero Kelvin). However, it's not true that even a cold bar make sound, because the movement of its atoms are randomic and sort of are canceled by each other (among other reasons).

But this is my point of view, I'm just giving you food for thought, keep on with this nice S O U N D thread.
Respect!           .
...Be gentle with the earth...
...Dance like nobody's watching...
.
...I don't mind not going to Heaven, as long as they've got Coffee in Hell...
Entheogen
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  10
Posts :  38
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 02:39
So how do you explain synaesthesia? When you actually can see the sound?           Peace, Love, Unity, Respect!
http://soundcloud.com/entheogenmusic
v.v2


Started Topics :  9
Posts :  83
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 06:25
Quote:

On:54, full_on wrote:
Sound is a mechanical wave, which means it needs a physical medium to travel. So there's no sound at vacuum and vacuum is inside the universe, so maybe this can convince you that at least part of the universe is not that much spiritual.



what else u get when u mess with a physics phd
Rah
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  77
Posts :  498
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 06:38
Quote:

On 2007-01-21 22:54, full_on wrote:
Of course most people hear only sound wave with frequency from 20 to 20.000 hertz, but one can argue that even a cold metal bar is making some sort of sound (because its atoms are vibrating unless they are at zero Kelvin). However, it's not true that even a cold bar make sound, because the movement of its atoms are randomic and sort of are canceled by each other (among other reasons).




you and I both know zero kelvin is a theoretical temperature people haven't been able to stop the movement of particles. It is yet another hypothesized theory of how the world should work, which convienty happens to link to another maze of thoughts that hold together a partial view of how we think the world and the things that surround us fit in together.

Linear time is after all a human invention, another concept to keep the clocks ticking... I think what is being discussed here, is reaching far wider than the implications physical laws. It all ties to idea of how perception, like taste, varies from host to host and how each brain works to process information from our senses in a different way. This affects everything, from psysics to freudian psychology. the world might run on a set of rules and concepts, but if your mind perceives them another way, you are looking at things from the other end of the mirror. Here we are still trying to understand how the world works, when we don't even comprehend what's happening inside our minds.

          elementoftime.net
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ZeRo
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  39
Posts :  802
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 06:50
Rah wrote:
"Linear time is after all a human invention, another concept to keep the clocks ticking..."

Hold on. What sort of experimental evidence do you have that time is anything but linear?

Your right that all of science develops within the mind of a scientist. Even when calculating the properties of an electron indirectly by reading an apparatus one is still using our limited sensory systems to derive information about the world. However, dont abandon the material world completely. It still exists as a reflection of our consciousness and just as we can be sure that we are thinking we can be sure that there are inputs (the physical world) to our sensory systems and these inputs obey laws in experimental settings. Our sensory systems evolved in a very specific physical world and as such these systems are pretty good at getting a handle on the laws that such a physical world obeys.
          ein chadash tachat hashemesh. there is nothing new under the sun. --kohelet.
exotic
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  200
Posts :  5057
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 08:32
Quote:

On 2007-01-22 06:50, ZeRo wrote:
Rah wrote:
"Linear time is after all a human invention, another concept to keep the clocks ticking..."

Hold on. What sort of experimental evidence do you have that time is anything but linear?



I dont want to answer for Rah but the deabate about time as a concept is very intruiging so i'll take the bait!
Basically it boils down to objective time and subjective time , objective time being the unit interval that clocks try to measure as a passage of flow or continuity eg like a stream hence we have linear. Subjective time can be made to speed up or slow down depending on the experience of an individual , like you must have experienced this yourself when you're having a good time time flies etc meaning you can alter your subjective experience of time , doesnt necessarily have to be linear..

In essence: Does the notion of time have any meaning or is it merely the concept of the interval that has relevance ? Is time real? Does it flow in one direction only? Does it have a beginning or an end? What is eternity? None of these questions can be answered to scientists' satisfaction. Yet the mere asking of these questions stretches our minds, and the continual search for answers provides useful insights along the way.
          missing plug-in
Janux
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  97
Posts :  766
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 12:19
@ Full On.

my reference to 'science' or 'spiritual' is only to say that if you go deep enough in either area, they both end up saying the same things....

'science' is also a human invention / or rather, humans trying to find some order/sense/patterns in the universe.

A person's 'spiritual' ideas are the same: that person's way of creating a system of order.... to make sense of the known & unknown...

we humans are insecure about not knowing things, so our different systems are always designed to give us some kind of knowldege... (and sometimes what we dont know we assign to the spirit world, it makes us feel safe.... a more religious person's psychology could be something like --> "I don't know everything, but God does, and i know God, therefore i indirectly know everything")

why cant we just be happy with not knowing?

or knowing just that : The more you know, the more you know what you dont know.

in other words. there is no science, there is no spirituality, there is just the universe.

yet we are part of the universe and have come up with these systems... we should just realize that we have created these systems and that they are totally relative to our viewpoint in spacetime.



------ what i am finding really cool is that we are all communicating on these levels

          www.facebook.com/DjJanux
dE.Tonatik
Detonatik

Started Topics :  83
Posts :  2374
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 14:27


make this topic sticky
...
here and in India section


atoms & molecules

boom

detonatik
          out now
http://parvati-records.com/music-shop/cd/out-of-time
Outolintu
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  63
Posts :  1477
Posted : Jan 22, 2007 15:11
Quote:

On 2007-01-22 12:19, Janux wrote:
there is no science, there is no spirituality, there is just the universe.

yet we are part of the universe and have come up with these systems... we should just realize that we have created these systems and that they are totally relative to our viewpoint in spacetime.



i agree! that's why i dropped out of college. no sense in debating science or religion seriously or trying to find the truth. there is no one truth (but perhaps an infinite amount of truths)







          "no one ever sweats on a plug-in" -moby
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