Trance Forum | Stats | Register | Search | Parties | Advertise | Login

There are 0 trance users currently browsing this page
Trance Forum » » Forum  Trance - goodbye progressive! hello crossover!

1 2 3 Next Page →
First Page Last Page
Share on facebook Share on twitter Share on StumbleUpon
Author

goodbye progressive! hello crossover!

russ
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  35
Posts :  275
Posted : Dec 27, 2004 20:14
the progressive trance still might exist, but it sure doesn't seem to be going anywhere. i think the best artists have either left the trance scene, or will leave the trance scene. bye bye space safari, hello frank beckers; maybe even bye bye son kite, hello minilogue. it seems like things have run their natural course. by the time any musical genre has its own very defined section in a record store for such a long time, it can only get boring.

the best music you hear at a "progressive trance" party is mostly from house labels/producers. the trance side of the scene is just too boring--always the same basslines, and the production is too thin. i LOVE the people in the progressive trance scene, but the music doesn't really keep me interested.

I just bought the new Richard Bartz cd, Midnight Man (Gigolo), and there are probably more basslines and wicked ideas on that album than the entire progressive psytrance scene in the past two years (if you don't count Son Kite). It sounds like retro techno, like future disco, like hypnotic electro, and it all sounds nasty! But when you buy a "progressive trance" cd, it sounds like...well...progressive trance. There's not enough money and not enough interest, which means there's not enough talent and new ideas.

But if progressive trance is dying, I'm not sad, because there is life in the crossover! There is so much incredible music out there right now--you just need to find the right dj's to play it for you. For example, I recently booked the Australian progressive house dj Kasey Taylor for a trance festival and he utterly destroyed the floor. We also bookd Llopis to play a tech-house set, and all the ladies were loving it. I think there are no limits at a trance party, because all trance really means is hypnotic, and ANY form of music can be hypnotic.

So in a sense, the progressive trance scene is out of the hands of the producers (who seem to be stuck in a genre) and in the hands of the dj's (who have the flexibility to play any genre). And the good news is that the trance scene I've witnessed is actually amazingly open to new kinds of music. At the end of the day, the people just come to dance.

I might be wrong because I wasn't even listening to electronic music 10 years ago, but it seems like trance started out as a more minimal, hypnotic version of acid-house, acid-techno music, with a touch of melody. (Like Speedy J's track ping pong on G-Spot.) It then went off into its own corner, and certain features became more and more exaggerated, until you get things like Tiesto and GMS (two sides of the same coin to me).

But at the same time, house and techno have evolved in their own ways, and sound much more hypnotic and psychdelic than ever before. Just listen to any track by Mathew Jonson to find out just how hypnotic the "techno" scene can be. Techno is still thriving, because it's so broad that it can really encompass any sound, which means it can always find new blood and stay alive.

Now seems to be the time for "trance" to return to the fold--house/techno--and stop trying so hard to be trance anymore. Son Kite has done much in this direction, reaching out across the scenes to people like Shiloh for remixes, and making an artistic impact on other scenes. D-Nox is another figure who's doing so much to bring "trance party vibes" around the world, while kicking in trance dancefloors with all the latest from his private disco. And trance parties have had an influence on artists "outside" the scene. Infusion, Kasey Taylor, Absolut and numerous others are seeing firsthand just how kicking these parties can be! Connections and friendships are being made across scenes and continents, and the beat goes on...in the crossover.


Tundra
Hydraglyph

Started Topics :  11
Posts :  145
Posted : Dec 27, 2004 21:37
Interesting...           A beer in the hand is worth 2 in the fridge
www.myspace.com/hydraglyph
Igal Magitman
Elec3
Started Topics :  15
Posts :  269
Posted : Dec 27, 2004 21:58
I think you gave an incorrect name for this topic,
its only your opinion, not that it was on the news or something.
if it ment to be it will be. maybe for good.

cheers           http://www.myspace.com/briskerandmagitman
H2O
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :  16
Posts :  352
Posted : Dec 27, 2004 22:02
Wait to hear this one.
krelm
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  67
Posts :  648
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 02:08
While I don't fully agree with your sentiments that progressive trance is fading out, I am definitely in full agreeance with you that the most exciting future lies in crossing over into other styles. Whether it be prog/psy artists incorporating other influences into their own work (ie, Schatsi, Son Kite), labels putting out compilations with different sounds (Hadshot, VP/Domo, Sprout....) or DJs who are pushing the boundaries outside of the typical progressive sound (D-Nox, Yaniv), the fusion of an "entrancing" feel with different sorts of grooves is where things are going to stay most interesting, IMO.

If there is a "death" of progressive trance, it will be more of a loss of the confines of the particular sound, and an expansion to or inclusion of many other styles out there. It is happening to a certain extent already, but my gut feeling is that we'll be seeing much more of it in the next year or two.

Just look at the tracklists of some compilations that are being put out right now - electrO'punk (Hadshot), Inspirazzia (VP/Domo), Groove Control (Nervine), etc... These aren't your typical progressive trance sound, and I do think they will be very influential in giving DJs inspiration of new spices to stir into the proggy pot for a little bit of new flavor.

I still do and always will love a good dose of quality progressive trance - but my heart lies with mashing it up with some good breaks, electro, tribal or something else different yet complimentary. Nobody has complained yet.

Bring on the crossover - I'm waiting.

          -----------------
Dr. Krelm DJ Mixes and Broken Symmetry archives - http://www.krelmatrix.com

Broken Symmetry on MCast - coming in 2007....
hip
Shuma

Started Topics :  12
Posts :  404
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 02:48
very interesting topic

russ, it think you're right, but at the same time wrong:)
btw I have the Richard Bartz album, and I share your enthusiasm about it, really dig the oldschool electro touch of it.

anyway, I'm also playing more and more "nontrance" labels like mutekki, electribe, goodlife etc because I like to explore, expand and find something different. And I also dig more "groovey" and less "trancey" sounds as the years go by.

But people on the psytrance scene are more into trance sounds, and as it seems to me (thats just my point of view, of course) Freq album was one of the most succesful albums of the year, because it is the perfect combination of progressive and psytrance music.

I'm with Krelm on this one about crossover - bring it on!

I'm really happy that artists like Thomas Penton, Fitalic, Infusion and others have started to release on "our" labels.

And I see very much electro influence on the trance scene lately, and it makes me very HAPPY
Basilisk
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  168
Posts :  2984
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 03:39
As mentioned, great topic russ. I've been right into the progressive side of psytrance for about two years now, and have really been loving 2004 for the new material coming out. Many compilations are sporting high quality, many albums (even debuts) are totally rocking out some great styles... so in a sense, I find myself disagreeing with some of your sentiments. I'm trying to find a way to articulate exactly why, but it is purely a personal music taste kind of thing. I go into progressive shops here in Toronto, which is certainly very much into the global movement that includes artists such as you have mentioned... I have sampled so many different big names in that scene and usually end up with the same response - this is okay, and might be fine to dance to, but it doesn't really grab me. I've heard a few from Infusion for example, and thought they were nicely made songs and so on, but they didn't really get to me the way a fine Vibrasphere song does. The psychedelic side of progressive that is coming from "our" side is still producing more engaging music if you ask me. I'm still open to being influences by this crossover slice of prog that you see as being worthwhile and entertaining... with a specific focus on this hypnotic quality you speak of. All I can say from personal experience is that the style you speak of, and the names you reference, in my experience seldom pass the 50% mark on the wow-o-meter whereas producers from Iboga, Digital Structures, Candyflip & ZMA (when they do prog), and so on really get my blood pumping.

I think a good release to discuss in light of this topic would be the recent Nanobeat compilation A Token to Thrill. Junk's song is an appealing and unique piece of more mainstream or non-trance sounding music, the Iboga collaboration is of course great, Llopis has some appeal at the right moments with such a dirty sound, but aside from that nothing really struck me. Thomas Penton composed a good track that I wouldn't go out of my way to play out. You mention the recent Son Kite remixes EP with material from Shiloh and so forth - predictably I only enjoed the Vibrasphere remix. I'll give the rest many more chances because I would actually like to see what the appeal is, but though it may be nicely composed it didn't really reach out and embrace my interests. I guess it really will come down to personal taste and I find myself inexorably tied to the psychedelic side, even when it's as far from the tree as some of the material I've mentioned. Crossing over into house, electro, and techno I tend to enjoy the more "obvious" material such as Eat Static, Kooler, and (respectively). I enjoy subtle music but when it's outside of the psychedelic headspace I really need that hook to distiguish one song from the next.

Well, there's a contrary opinion for ya! I do think that a rather major portion of trance artists are going to head off in directions you describe but I have a feeling it'll be the Pete Martin story all over again... knowing how wild and crazy they've been, how can I accept the "refined" or "sterilised" style (depending on your view) if they choose to go too far from trance?

NP: Prooved vol 2... sounds good to my ears, undoubtably nice on a happenin dancefloor, but it isn't reaching out to me as of yet...
russ
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  35
Posts :  275
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 09:57
another way to put it is this: progressive is simply an adjective thrown on to a genre to say it is "upfront and evolving", but to me lots of stuff being labeled "progressive" is neither upfront or evolving--it sounds quite the same as before. of course some of it still sounds very good, and i enjoy the Iboga releases especially, and there have been a number of other great releases. i am especially excited to see artists from the trance scene have an impact on different kinds of parties+scenes. Atmos, Kooler/Minilogue, Kruger+Coyle, and even Simon Posford have become well-known outside the trance scene. I think it's great the boundaries between trance and house are much thinner than before.

to me, true progressive covers those artists and labels in crossover territory, like the ones krelm mentions, such as Sprout and Hadshot and many others, or others such as Border Community, which are mashing up different genres in brilliant ways.

so i wasn't really talking about the "death" of anything. i just think to call a genre of music "progressive" is kind of silly. by the time a genre has the name progressive, it can't be progressive any more. you can't really have progressive genres. but what you CAN have is progressive parties and progressive dj's! parties designed to showcase cutting-edge materials from any genre that suit the trance floor are happening everywhere now, and these are the most exciting to me, and the way forward.
lokus
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  12
Posts :  684
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 10:08
very interesting           - last possible solution
- trick music
- ambivalent records
myspace.com/lokuz

ps: y trance?
Krell
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  33
Posts :  1114
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 10:12
Hey Russ (I love this topic of yours)

I do agree with you in the way that I also find myself listening to lets say Progressive House instead of Progressive Trance. Still, I dont see Progressive Trance dying as a genre anytime soon.

Instead of going into details of what has recently been released, I will point to a general observation which is that progressive psytrance, since its infancy has (in my eyes) always been about crossing genres.
Also, its not at all uncommon for musicians to switch between producing one style, and starting to produce another... It doesnt nescessarily mean that the genre they are leaving is dying.

What I think we are seeing is a trend towards Progressive House / Techno - However, I think we will see Progressive Psytrance continue to evolve into better production, funkyer rhytms and better ideas in general (+ more trippyness:-). It just needs fresh inspiration.

I do think the Progressive Trance releases are "plaqued" by some of the same problems as lets say the full on releases... and thats more quantity and less quality.

My own experience thus far with Progressive House has been that the first many hours I have spent listening to it - I have been blown away - But once this infatuation gas gone, most of it seems as boring as a lot of Progressive Trance does. Therefore I dont see Progressive Trance dying on that account

Regards

Krell
The Green Channel
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  41
Posts :  1025
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 11:36
Again I agree and I disagree, I rather enjoy, Tech-house for an hour or two in the beginning of a party, but as the party progresses I usually get bored if they continue playing Tech-house (and regular progressive-house is even more boring if played more then an hour). Both Atmos, Son kite, Freq, Vibrasphere, Etnoscope (although I l really liked the shilou remix on the colours remixed CD, I still enjoyed the Vibrasphere remix the most, because of the trancey feeling) have managed in the not so distant past to bring with them a style of Psy-Progressive which I really I enjoy, and so do many people. I don’t see these and many more creative Psy-Progressive producers stopping to produce absolute brilliant tracks.           "Love is a way of life"

(Gaia, Love, Nature, Shamanism (.2A.y.0a.hu.1a.sc.2a.), Terence McKenna)
russ
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  35
Posts :  275
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 12:35
krell and green channel,

i agree, progressive house can also sound very boring! for the same reasons i discussed above (no such thing as a progressive genre etc). and any genre can sound boring if done too much. that's why the "crossover trance" party is more interesting than the "progressive trance" party. just grab the best of all things hypnotic!!!

you can have dj's go from slow tech-house intros into pumping progressive house or progressive trance, or even full-on morning sounds, and then go into some deep tribal grooves, for example, or you can have some massive techno/tech-trance in the night, and then go with something beautiful like Digital Structures/Vibrasphere in the morning, and then have a disco afternoon. this is how i think when I structure my parties.

the progressive trance producers that you mention, like vibrasphere, are wonderful at creating at a special atmosphere, so you can place that "moment" where you think the party needs it.
Since I produce parties (not run a label or actually make music), I am looking at things from the level of the party. And I love the special feeling that the best trance provides. But you shouldn't overdo it, in my book. If you place it just right within a context of other forms of music that also "make sense", then those "trance moments" can be even more powerful.
Zombi
IsraTrance Senior Member

Started Topics :  375
Posts :  5032
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 12:46
i prety agree with russ, for me crossover music is what im living for last 3-4 years and for sure last year and half what so called prog-psy trance became formulated and in many cases boring..
i happy to agree with krelm about djs tht provide real crossover style in their sets, i booked both D-Nox and Yaniv in last month;) Me to plays only those kind crossover sets i mostly use Tribal, Deep and Tech House and some hot Progressive Trance if done in slow bpm...
For me to be on borderline is much more fun, once i play at psy party, once at house party and i dont need chnge my style too much between those gigs..
as label im looking for trancey tunes but with sweet atmosphere, tnats the ones i want release right now, dunno what will be in my head in a year..
tottaly agree with russ on party issue, few years now im trying reach those ones abroad which include in line ups more that just trance acts, Lovefield and Soma this is the parties i truly enjoy.
          Believe your soul !
olivier
Side-A

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1303
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 16:01
Quote:

On 2004-12-28 12:46, Zombi wrote:
for sure last year and half what so called prog-psy trance became formulated and in many cases boring..




it has always been formulated, like every style of music, even the ones u think are groundbreaking...
it's just about enjoying the music u like , or getting bored because u lost the old feeling , that means personnal taste... but music is formulated, everything has already been done long time ago, it's more about pushing your own feelings to show a new vision of these formulas , or even mixing different kinds of formulas (like x-dream did) ...
Justin Chaos
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  117
Posts :  3086
Posted : Dec 28, 2004 17:40
Well,this is nothing new...Mutation it´s the key of evolution...right???
Now the proggy sound is fat as hell with rude artists like sun control species,Sensient,FREq,and so on...years ago you couldn´t consider this progressive may be.
Electro,techno,house...they´re all welcome if you ask me!!!
In the full-on formula it´s a little bit more complicated coz you need to follow some basic patterns but...why not???
Could be nice
          My fake plants died, because I did not pretend to water them.
Trance Forum » » Forum  Trance - goodbye progressive! hello crossover!

1 2 3 Next Page →
First Page Last Page
Share on facebook Share on twitter Share on StumbleUpon


Copyright © 1997-2024 IsraTrance