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Fake live sets
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kowens
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
17
Posts :
218
Posted : May 19, 2004 16:12
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tromesa and bigwigs both rock bigtime live..I got a bigwigs live cd and they definitely change things around live..
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Lauryn
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
51
Posts :
729
Posted : May 19, 2004 17:34
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On 2004-05-18 05:02, drooid wrote:
i know i MUCH prefer dj'ing my own music to playing a semi live set... here in Oz, we are always being thrown on in different time slots, which calls for often different feels to the music. Dj'ing your own music you can read the crowd and drop whatever's gonna do the trick for that instant. I make a folder of one track per cd. so i can always put in whatever i want next...
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I think Drooid has the right idea here...What puzzles me most about this whole 'fake live set' thing is that wouldn't 'faking' a live set for 2 hours get pretty boring after a few minutes??? Even if it was only a partially live set...at least then the artist would be doing something...
The artist is supposed to read the crowd, but even if you are a big name producer and know the crowd is going to have a positive reaction to whatever you do, wouldn't you still be curious to experiment and try different things during your set rather than just pretend to be playing on a keyboard or tweaking knobs?? |
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Surrender
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
506
Posts :
5388
Posted : May 19, 2004 18:37
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I will a few things on the side of the artists.
1. Certain elements cannot be risked to be totally live (sequencer, kick, certain leads)
2. An artist has to risk sounds clipping and distortions that may injure the crowd audiorily. (an actual documented issue)
3. This trance music, any sounds out of place and not in sync may actually destroy the "trance state" which the artist is providing the crowd.
4. There are simply too many things for 1/2 person to do with 2 hands each... come on lets get real here, if Shiva was on the decks we might have a diffrent story.
as i said before, some programs are better then others for live, Abelton live 3.0 is my suggestion from experienced observation of many artists behind the stage over the years.
lets give some credit to those who do not just press play, but lets not be so harsh on the other side.
after all its a show, and they are entertainers just like anyone else.
 "On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon |
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ND
ProSect
Started Topics :
44
Posts :
919
Posted : May 19, 2004 19:23
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maybe to play live for a 99% stoned faces from the crowd not make any difference? 
Without Deviation, Progress Is Not Possible.
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Sound Field / ProSect / Sonify / Radio Mess |
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karnaf
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
1745
Posted : May 19, 2004 19:31
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When it comes to a live set, then since there will always be some background recorded set playing (can't think of anyone giving a totally live act), you can't really tell. I guess it depends on how much the artist is talented and sure of himself on being able to give a live set.
When it comes to a DJ set, there is no excuse for something like that. Yes, I have seen a DJ play with a hidden laptop connected to the system and the CDJs volumes turned off completely. Just acting as if he is actually mixing.... 
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clown
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
97
Posts :
1777
Posted : May 19, 2004 21:21
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On 2004-05-19 18:37, Surrender wrote:
3. This trance music, any sounds out of place and not in sync may actually destroy the "trance state" which the artist is providing the crowd.
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Then why shouldn't a DJ just play a pre-recorded mix just in case he offbeats??? that would ruin a trance state of mind. hehehe..
obviously, i'd never pull such fraud, i just feel like arguing.. 
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www.jesterrecords.ca |
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karnaf
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
1745
Posted : May 19, 2004 21:30
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On 2004-05-19 21:21, clown wrote:
Then why shouldn't a DJ just play a pre-recorded mix just in case he offbeats??? that would ruin a trance state of mind. hehehe.. |
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As I've said, I've seen that happen too 
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clown
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
97
Posts :
1777
Posted : May 19, 2004 21:35
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : May 19, 2004 22:08
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On 2004-05-19 21:35, clown wrote:
the worst is a fake live with a fake guitar.. lol
thats like double fakeness..
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What, like Cosmosis/Laughing Buddha used to do before they split up? Didn't see anyone complaining then - what a show! Billy now uses a laptop with Traktor for his live sets and while I would personally much prefer to see him using more live elements in his sets, it's up to him in the end and I can FULLY appreciate just how impossible it is for one man to reproduce live what takes a fortnight to create in the studio - and if you want the quantised-style precision musical timing that trance needs, as well as a great-looking performance you can forget it.
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Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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timsensient
Sensient
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
438
Posted : May 20, 2004 02:14
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I labour for hours in the studio trying get my sounds and arrangments just perfect, and all the time thinking of how its gonna sound and work on the dancefloor. When i slot this track in my live set im not gonna start stuffing around with the arrangment. I mean what variety can i give - loop a section?...seems a little pointless to me. I will keep the track the same as cd version, program a mix and then add some synth, samples and loops over the top...is this satisfactory?
btw i find this method is given more credit by the fact that my live set is all new KilLah nO wORdZ unreleased music...doing this with old released trax would be a little lame imo
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Biotouch (dj Loko)
Biotouch
Started Topics :
20
Posts :
305
Posted : May 20, 2004 03:09
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On 2004-05-19 19:31, karnaf wrote:
When it comes to a DJ set, there is no excuse for something like that. Yes, I have seen a DJ play with a hidden laptop connected to the system and the CDJs volumes turned off completely. Just acting as if he is actually mixing....
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autch... kill that guy..lololol
i dont want to belive this one..becaus is very bad..the dj cenne is so bad that most of them simply dont know how to mix or think they know.. we see big names on big partyes doing so bad mixes that you think "even i would do better"... who should we blame? i think is the dumb and druged people but with money to do parties...(not all off them offcourse)
as a live i dont think its possible to do all 100% live set....
why producers that dont know to mix perform as dj? because we cant say "you have funking great unr tracks but you are a very good shit as a dj?" dont you ppl know any off them? tell them why not? because we cant...
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essbee
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
20
Posts :
196
Posted : May 20, 2004 18:26
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I agree with the majority of what has been said here, but ask around most "LIVE" acts and whether they play live is a little shortsighted. I was told many years ago, that "LIVE" meant:
A live personal appearance by the artists, playing their own songs. It did not mean that they would totally reproduce from their equipment the track in its originality, but simply that they would be there, playing their own tracks.
It was seen by promoters as a crowd puller to have a well known artist - me I prefer the journey capability that an excellent DJ can create, with little or no breaks in between sets, and people dancing with each other as opposed to staring at the front, as per a rock concert!
Just my two cents worth - cheers me dears!!
Big love! |
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PRAECOX
Bigwigs
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
346
Posted : May 20, 2004 19:06
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On 2004-05-19 18:37, Surrender wrote:
I will a few things on the side of the artists.
1. Certain elements cannot be risked to be totally live (sequencer, kick, certain leads)
2. An artist has to risk sounds clipping and distortions that may injure the crowd audiorily. (an actual documented issue)
3. This trance music, any sounds out of place and not in sync may actually destroy the "trance state" which the artist is providing the crowd.
4. There are simply too many things for 1/2 person to do with 2 hands each... come on lets get real here, if Shiva was on the decks we might have a diffrent story.
as i said before, some programs are better then others for live, Abelton live 3.0 is my suggestion from experienced observation of many artists behind the stage over the years.
lets give some credit to those who do not just press play, but lets not be so harsh on the other side.
after all its a show, and they are entertainers just like anyone else.
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!!!!!!BULSHITS!!!!!!!!!!!
artist always risks! cause he is the creator.
live is live and please dont tell me about distorted kiks and cowbells cause it's not laboratory - hope that audience will forgot us distorted cowbell cause we give the emotions and IMPROVISED music.
...hands? the live performance is about IDEA and not about the hands!!! if iu have the one hand on one leg then yo life will be diffrent than other but still it's not the point. it's all about concept and IMPROVISATION.
...we as the bigwigs had a big disasters playing live:))
BUT it happens:) and now i can laugh listening some moments of my extasy when pushing some wrong buttons:) i don give a shit ! u want laboratory? by the cd.
live is live and f***x the donald dux!
"Soft as possible" - Morton Feldman
http://jurekprzezdziecki.net/ |
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ecnalab
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
49
Posted : May 20, 2004 20:12
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Traktor is almost the same as spinning CD's... I don't want to over-analyse what "live" playing is... but i just thought I'd throw that out there. Regardless, I'd still dance my ass off if I heard Cosmosis blasting on a nice soundsystem.
Ableton Live is the proper "live" tool because it allows you to improvise and change arrangements. I remember I saw Atmos and he played off a laptop with aguy hitting samples off of a keyboard. But he was just running tracks off of Logic Pro. I was disappointed because the nerd in me, would love to see Atmos improvise and change arrangements, but at least the music was good!
I can understand why an artist would like to keep his arrangements intact. They spends so much time perfecting them...everybody is different! -xo Truffle Radio ox-
Waves of Psychedelic and Progressive Trance
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playing : FREq ~ Human Blue ~ Son Kite ~ Prometheus ~ Vibrasphere ~ XV Kilist ~ Ticon ~ Atmos |
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filter
Moderator
Started Topics :
87
Posts :
703
Posted : May 20, 2004 20:52
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hello
im not an old time artist and i dont have the total truth but let me tell you what we do with megalopsy, whichs a live act from argentina i belong to.
first we have our tracks, these are the "studio" versions of the songs. when we play live what we do is split the songs into 3 elements and use Abbleton Live to recombine them into a "live" version.
the elemtents are:
1)kick & bass. trance scene depends on the constant bubbling of the bass, so there is no way you can improvise this, this is the platform for the rest of the things we do.
2)main melodies. these are not played because its physically impossible to play complex melodies at 145 bpm, but what we do is modulate, transform and distort them with different effects, which with enough practice gives you the chance of changing them completely.
3)fx, percs. these are all the secondary melodies which play around with the main melodies. these are all heavy transformed with effects, so this also gives you the chance of making a live version of this parts.
we want to play the tracks we composed, but we also want to be able to adapt to the crowd. with Abbleton Live, we can have full control of the track, so we can decide when to extend a break, we can decide how long a build up will be, and especially we can decide when everything will explode and added to all this we can transform the track completely using effects.
making music with machines, its not the same as making it with classic instruments. so you basically have to adapt to the media you are using, trying to play 100% live as a rock band its impossible, its far more better to use your energy to explore the possibilites of the media you are using.
personally i recommend abbleton live, a track is basically several elements put together, with this program you can take those elements and recombine them in any way you want and modulate them with effects, so you are not only deciding how the track will go on you are also transforming it with modulation. for me that is live, a live with machines and all the great possibilities this media gives you.
<shameless self promotion>
megalopsy night trance from argentina
www.megalopsy.com.ar
</shameless self promotion>
Psychedelic Trance from Argentina
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Megalopsy Travel Blog
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