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DJ SETS NOT LIVE ACTS
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tom anteater
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 11:36
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i have tidy some here..
please, i don't want to do it again. have a nice day 
  >>love will tear us apart...<< |
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Nicc
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 13:17
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I don’t really know how to start saying anything here without stepping on anyone’s toes. Since people are expecting negativity (it seems, I could be wrong though), I just want to say this is in no way aimed at anyone personally, I’m just going to be honest, and whatever I say is just my OPINION, nothing more, I’m no fountain of knowledge or anything, so I’m as likely to be wrong as the next person.
That said… Since so much focus has been placed on Astral Phoenix (as much as I hate to say it, mostly due to Mike’s defensive stance), I’ll follow suite and use AP as an example. I’m not going to claim I know all the artists who played on NYE as well as I’m sure you guys know them, but I’m sure they do have their differences, PsySex and Psycraft I kinda know, and they’re quite vastly different. As I said earlier, I don’t think an abundance of live acts is reason to write a party off (although it would be harder to keep a flow to, but not impossible), but from my experiences at the Rex, a party there with 5 live acts, on New Years Eve sounds like hell to me, I wasn’t there, so I don’t know, but I would imagine it to be packed, and sweaty, and a bit much to handle, every artist would want to rip out their music to the best of their abilities, which is expected and appreciated I’m sure, but so many live acts in so short a night would be a bit much for me, I could handle it at an outdoor party, but NOT at the Rex. I would feel battered by the end of it. I must stress that I would feel this way regardless of who was throwing the party, and it’s also my opinion ONLY. Unfortunately, my only other experience with AP has been of a similar description, the Cosma tribute, also at the Rex, very full, and well stocked with live acts, PsySex, Infected Mushroom, and the Cosma tribute set. I really hate to be negative, but I didn’t find Psysex followed by Infected Mushroom to be a very smooth progression, again just an opinion. It must be said though, that they were both launching albums, and nobody EVER knows what to expect from the next Infected album, so that would be hard to plan.
Mike, since I’m sure you’re going to reply to this, I know you said you never follow a formula, and that you constantly try to push the boundaries on what’s possible, but that in itself is a formula, if you are constantly trying to be bigger and better then that’s a pattern, or a formula if that’s what you want to call it. The only reason I can say that is because the area you’ve always tried to be bigger and better in has been your line-up, if you were pushing the boundaries of a venue one party, then the boundaries of the décor the next, then the music the next, then that would just be a will to improve, not a pattern, but you’ve been pushing the boundaries in the same area for a while, and that leads people to expect things, and once people know what to expect, it means they’ve identified a formula. What must be said though, is that although an AP party wouldn’t ever be considered one of my personal favourites, they have always been unique opportunities to see a lot of amazing artists performing live, and I regret to say I didn’t take as many of those opportunities as I would have liked. AP has definitely brought the artists to people in the UK, and must have been a BITCH to organise, and for that alone I would take my hat off to you. You have all the reason in the world to be proud of the last 18 months of effort, nobody should be able to say differently.
Colin: I like your views man, you seem to have your head on straight, despite your fart fixation. J I like what you said about 5 live acts not being the full recipe for a successful party; there are so many factors in the line-up alone, not to mention the even higher number of factors totally unrelated to the line-up! Which leaves so many areas to push the boundaries in, not just who you’re flying in from where and from which label they’re from.
Yuli: I like that you only reply to/mention things that you know something about, this thread would be a lot more constructive if everyone followed suit and only opened their mouth when they confidently knew something about what they were saying (I include myself in this sweeping generalisation, I know I ramble on sometimes, and base a lot of what I say on my opinions only, but I try and make that apparent).
I must say this is one of the most interesting threads I’ve found on this forum.
Peace and love to everyone…
Nic
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Mad Ron
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 13:47
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I'm glad everyone is making an effort to keep this on topic as I really care about this issue. As a DJ and long-time trancer I want to see as many successful parties as possible. Thanks for putting in such long posts too. Good reading, all of it.
For my part I have had some really great nights at AP events and would not like people to see this as the antichrist to the smooth flow parties I dream of.
I wonder if you could fill the rex and create that epic view of so many people going nuts in one place if you just had djs.
Maybe the next thing on your to-do list of ground breaking promotions Mike, should be to pull of a large dj only party to silence the critics...just a thought...
Keep up the friendly debate if possible
Ron |
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John
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 14:51
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There's been some very interesting replies - but mainly to do with the live act side of things. I'd still be curious to know others views (I gave my tuppence worth earlier!) on the seeming steady decline in importance of DJs in psy trance. |
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humph
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 15:58
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funny you should mention trying to fill the rex with just dj`s mad ron ! was thinking on the bus on the way to work this morning about that very fact. came up with my list for the night, thouhg i`ll come to that later. I think most people will recognise that some of the great dj`s are also artists. They really understand the dynamics of the music - the flow of tracks etc.
I think that perhaps if you haven`t been to a party of 4 dj`s all night of life changing proportions then one can`t aspire to them.
There are many generations of people in this scene and all of them have experienced different parties and atmospheres to dance in. I think that the scene has become more and more self conscious. The last time i went out, it seemed most people were checking each other out all evening instead of getting on the dancefloor - no focus. Things have changed - things go in cycles. maybe we`ll enter a phase again of the focus on dj`s. The dj is not there to fulfill his own ego - you are there as a person at the party - you are part of the party - not some Icon. Sure the artists should get recognition and the Live is a wonderful thing to hear new music from a wonderful artist, but i like this as part of nightly journey. But its up to promoters to do what they feel they want to do. If you want to change things - get on and do it yourself - no point in lamenting the past - you need to get out of the couch and realise how much effort goes into putting on quality parties, its a LOT OF WORK - change things!
well -there`s my lunchtime`s speil - oh yeh, and my perfect night out - 3 dj`s not 4......
Emok(to Start), Frank-e(middle of the night), Serge Souque(to end) - all having 3 and a half hours. with NOS decor........... |
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Mad Ron
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 17:42
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nice line up humph.
maybe if fairytales, mike, liquid con., symbiosis, chichime, etc got together with the isratrance and all put in a day of flyering and a week of good will you could pull it off.
could be just the energy pulse that eeryone needsto get to the next halcyon era of london psy.
ron |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 17:51
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Quote:
| I think that perhaps if you haven`t been to a party of 4 dj`s all night of life changing proportions then one can`t aspire to them. |
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Then lets give people a night to aspire to, then!
I'm sure I'm not alone on this thread in having been going to trance parties for most of a decade now. When did we stop believing that the meditative aspects of trance music can make a difference to people's lives, and stop putting on nights that help and encourage people to lose themselves in trance for extended periods of time? Surely at a time like this it has never been as important for us all to do whatever we can to raise the general level of consciousness and awareness of people to the possibilities inherent in the human species, and to provide environments where personal transformation can take place through the moving meditation we call 'dancing'. Indidginous cultures have been doing it for 1000s of years, and we can help ourselves - as was the original intention of many psy/goa parties in the early to mid 90s - by putting on parties where this is possible. This means taking the ego out of the provision of music and providing as smooth and unbroken flow of tracks as possible, which guide the intensity of the dancefloor so as to enable the trance state.
Maybe the powers-that-be are winning; maybe people's expectations have changed and promoters are putting on nights that reflect what partygoers want. Trance nights seem to have become a 'cool' thing to go to, bringing them more in line with other dance genres, hence the increase in people checking each other out instead of getting on the dancefloor. The spiritual side of trance - getting in touch with aspects of ourselves otherwise only revealed through eg. meditation or guided use of psychedelics - the whole the bit that needs this flow we're talking about has, IMO, become secondary to getting punters in and putting on a night that the most amount of people will enjoy. Don't get me wrong here; they enjoy it because it's a good night out, but I have to ask myself... what's the point?
I think the possible motivations of different party organisations is also an interesting subject to consider. Take a look at the promotional differences between Antiworld and Synergy Project.
[/hippy rant]
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John
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 19:01
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Quote:
| But its up to promoters to do what they feel they want to do. |
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Very true - there is no Govt Dept of trance! I always say to people if they dont like the way things are - go off and do something about it. (...and I've spent most of my spare time for the last 4 years being involved with putting parties on - although trance-techno that is psychedelic rather than what is now psy trance, and in Sheffield rather than London - Dionysus, Destination Venus and then Planet Zogg if anyone is bothered) so am only too aware of the effort that goes into parties)
I just think the question re: DJs is an interesting as there has been such a shift in recent years.
I think its also easy to make assumptions about motivations - without this degenerating into yet another commercial v non commercial thread - if you've ever met any of the folk involved in antiworld - they love their music just as much as anyone else. |
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psy druid
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 19:05
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from a mere layman's stance, i just like good tunes well mixed, be it either a live act or dj. it is the stuff comming out of the speakers that gets the stomp going, be it one of the awsome oood live acts, that quality nye astral p. or simply one of the many nights i have been to with three or so djays who nobody would have heard of playing belter tunes, seemlessly mixed.
variety is nice though, so instead of sitting on the fence, give me christoff and tristan (dj) over absolum and Tristan (live) anyday.
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Mad Ron
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jan 5, 2004 19:36
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I know what you mean about this shift, john.
having seen the process ofn promoters talking to labels/agencies/acts on a number of occasions over the years I have noticed that most of these negotiations move towards the bookingof a live act. Could this stage of the proceedings be relevant?
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time traveller
IsraTrance Junior Member
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47
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110
Posted : Jan 6, 2004 03:15
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Quote:
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On 2003-11-29 19:31, John wrote:
I dont buy the bit about the media - there are plenty of other underground scenes with little media coverage that also have live acst playing but that the DJ is still a big draw(acid techno, trance-techno etc).
I'm also dubious about using CDs per se making you lazy. I've got a friend who started on CDs - just cos he started playing goa stuff. As the years moved on he got more into trance-techno - of which most releases are on 12". But he got to the point where he was a lot more competant on CD decks than vinyl decks - so hes in the bizarre psoition of buying 12"s and burning them onto CD to play out on. But hes one of the tightest and longest mixers I know.
I would say its probably easier to get by on CD decks than vinyl - but its just laziness that stops DJs brushing up on their techniques - and most psy trance crowds no longer seem to expect anything more than competent DJs.
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john name the 3 most popular dance mags in the country ,and how many of them actuallly interview those that produce and play psy trance ......only when a named dj ie sasha named sphongles dorset perception lo step mix as his no 1 tune ..only then there was some coverage ,,frankly that not enough . and how many dj's that play psy trance were named by fergie as the new superstars ........
NONE why is that ????????? |
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Colin OOOD
OOOD/Voice of Cod
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Posted : Jan 6, 2004 04:51
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Quote:
| john name the 3 most popular dance mags in the country ,and how many of them actuallly interview those that produce and play psy trance ......only when a named dj ie sasha named sphongles dorset perception lo step mix as his no 1 tune ..only then there was some coverage ,,frankly that not enough . and how many dj's that play psy trance were named by fergie as the new superstars ........
NONE why is that ?????????
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I think it's a sales thing... when psy-trance compilations start selling as much as your average house compilation, then advertisers will feel it's worth buying space in (inter)national dance mags... and then the mags will start interviewing psytrance DJs and artists to keep their advertisers happy.
But then we have to ask the question - why does psy-trance not sell very much? After all, there are 1000s of people going to the parties all over the world. Could it have anything to do with downloading music?
Either that or the mags can't take the hippies seriously... Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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John
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jan 6, 2004 11:19
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[/quote]
john name the 3 most popular dance mags in the country ,and how many of them actuallly interview those that produce and play psy trance ......
[/quote]
The point I was making - before everyone get too paranoid - was that there are PLENTY of other underground scenes that get ignored by the media - as I said in my post - trance-techno, acid-techno, etc Its not just psy trance then a whole world of commercial music - believe it or not there are lots of other underground scenes.
But as I said - I'm dubious as to what effect this has on the whole live acts/Djs thing ... |
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Nik
Error Corrective
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Posted : Jan 6, 2004 13:47
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this has gone off a bit eh (this aint the first time i seen an ood vs. mike)......getting back to da original post.
lets make the parties worth going to! live acts do draw a crowd but they do cost lots of money....too much IMO.
what do you think would happen if a big party was thrown without a live act with a dj only lineup??
it would certainly be a lot cheaper for the organisers and would also cause less hastle with the line-up times, flights, hotels, equipment hire etc.... all these things make parties really difficult to organise so much so that its not even a PARTY anymore just an EVENT.
oranisers are losing money cause of these w*nkers who turn up to play an audio file then f*ck off with £1500 +. this is a con! theres no talent involved in the performance at all.
so because of this im all for dj only lineups because no one is gonna want to make parties any more if its gonna cost so much to bring these audio file hippies to town and quite frankly at the moment id rather go to a filthfy squat parties than pay £15 plus to get in to a psy-trance rock gig!
yeah bring back the djs and make the PARTY worth going to. yeehaa!
1-0-1-0-1-0-1-0-?-0-1 |
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