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what is psychedelic trance?
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tom anteater
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Posted : Aug 29, 2002 16:04
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so, what is it then?
what intrigues me is what in fact causes tune x to be called a psy track and tune y not to be so. is it the fact that they are realeased on some label that is known to release psy tunes, or because dj z plays it. at the end of the day this is not really necessarily a question specific to the psy scene (i am reminded of the louis armstrong quote, he sadi when asked what jazz was "if you have to ask you'll never know") and along these lines i'm sure that most of us here in this forum instinctively know that a given track is psy or not, but in terms of the development of the scene etc i think it would be interesting to see how we take our cues as to whether a certain record 'has it' (the psy sound) or not.
since psy clearly exists within a framework delineated by various other distinct styles of music, there must be some 'key' points that make a track psychedelic - clearly containing psychedelic sounds would be one such.
as an analogy one could consider what causes the impressionists to be considered a definite school of painters amongst all the other people painting at that time.
bom
  >>love will tear us apart...<< |
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Gilad Refael
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Posted : Aug 29, 2002 16:25
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yea i'm pretty interested too 
i heard here sometimes that some minimalitic artists aren't pschedelic and for ex. Shiva Chandra is combining psychedelic elements. i could never figure this out
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Kaz
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Posted : Aug 29, 2002 16:37
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Trance music is music that gets you into a trance. Psychedelic music is music which is psychedelic in atmosphere (in other words, drug friendly/surreal). So - psychedelic trance music is drug friendly/surreal music which gets the listener into a trance. The 4/4 beat isn't part of the definition, neither are the samples.
BUT, psychedelic trance is NOT what it's definition is. Today I would define trance music as atmospheric dancefloor music. Different than techno where the games are in the power of the track or house where it's the grooves - the only thing trance offers that is unique is it's atmosphere which is much more complex in it's games and subtleties than even Plastikman's music (the greatest master of atmosphere outside the trance world IMO).
Psychedelic trance today does NOT have to be psychedelic. I don't consider Yahel's music (or Parasense's, The Delta's or Ticon's, as other examples) as psychedelic, but it's considered psytrance since it's atmospheric dancefloor music.
Again, definitions are tricky and not accurate. Hope I've been of some help.
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Gilad Refael
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 00:18
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Quote:
| I don't consider Yahel's music (or Parasense's, The Delta's or Ticon's, as other examples) as psychedelic |
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so my question was why isn't it psychedelic and how do u decide weather a track is psychedelic or not
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Kaz
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 00:49
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Psychedelic is a subjective term. It has a lot to do with being unexpected and deep, but more importantly it has to go deep into your brain. Just like someone says "I don't think this movie is good", I can say "I don't consider -----'s music psychedelic". Some people will say that electronic music isn't psychedelic. Some will say that The Doors' music isn't. It was just an example of how this definition leaves a lot of grey areas.
In short - a person can't decide whether something is psychedelic or not. Just like the debate of "what is progressive music" - when Indoor (not Atmos) were considered the first progressive psytrance act. Fassion, public opinions, wild guessing.
No one has a monopoly over defining something that is 100% abstract.
http://www.myspace.com/Hooloovoo222 |
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PsyTom
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 04:28
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Psychedelic means mind liberating, right? So since everyone has a different mind it's up to one's personal point of view to determine what's psychedelic. I find Son kite to be psychedelic while other will say it's proggy/techy/whatever. And we're all right.
However, the main thing in psychedelic music IMO is the full the lush sonic image. That can be achived in many ways, from reverbarated and delayed sounds to a sound packed and densed image, like Texas Faggot's stuff. This way, an environment seperated from reallity is achieved, thus causing the mind liberation.
PT |
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A.Rosengren
Solid Snake
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 05:03
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one word: Posford
A
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Wako Jako
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 07:35
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thats two words...
hahahahahahhahaahhahaahahaha !
SMILE ! and the whole world will smile right back at you ! |
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tom anteater
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 12:27
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but look, what i want to know is what are the factors that do define the music, as a genre or whatever, who does decide? and even if only loosely there is some kind of consensus as to what constitutes psy trance and what does not. since the scene has clearly eveloved over the ten or so years it has existed, it is clear that somehow it has maintained its identity despite the change and whatever enables this (and it seems to me mostly to be the purveyors rather than the consumers to be honest) has got to be the key ingredient defining the psy trance scene.
(and btw kaz, imo an abstract definition is likely to be a lot less contentious than one that isn't - eg the set of integers)
>>love will tear us apart...<< |
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A.Rosengren
Solid Snake
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 13:03
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jon
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Posted : Aug 30, 2002 19:07
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yeah it's funny that Psychedelic Trance is certainly _not_ 'trance music which is psychedelic', as Kaz says.
I claimed to tom in lisbon that this kind of question is much more general and is like 'what is art?'. There's probably books of philosophy about this kind of question. Well I havent read them.
I guess it's a matter of consensus: 'experts' decide what is counted as psy trance, and experts are people who know about psy trance. It is indeed a recursive thing.
Anyway what does psychedelic mean? I mean the dictionary definition? I have no idea...
ok some dictionary says:
Of, characterized by, or generating hallucinations, distortions of perception, altered states of awareness, and occasionally states resembling psychosis.
Of course this is more referring to drugs. And Psychedelic Trance was certainly born in close proximity to psychedelic drugs (I know I am not allowed to talk about these). But then I guess the music grew in various different directions, so that some aspects of it no longer sound trippy at all. My point is that of course the sound of what we call psychedelic trance is varied and changing all the time.
sorry for rambling on a bit... just my 2 euros.
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Ananda604
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Posted : Sep 1, 2002 23:11
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thalaron
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Posted : Sep 2, 2002 14:34
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i think that is what so unique about psychedelic music... the fact that it envolves individual emotions and states of mind and thus obviously there will be no one defenition about psychedelic
to take from a dictonery :
psychedelic- (of visual and sound effects) acting on the mind like psychedelic drugs.
psychedelic -( drugs) causing very strong feelings of excitement, fear, etc.
unfortunatly psychedelic is still not independent a defenition from psychedelic drugs (although i believe that we already know better )
but the defenition is still quiet good to my opinion which is : causeing very strong feeling of :emotions (whatever they may be)
and so i think that the defenition for psychedeilc music ( that includes psy trance) will have to remain an individual taste of what makes u'r mind go places.
personaly to me it is interesting music that makes me think feel and flow on diffrent levels and which i can always (upon a more deep listening) find new levels of connections and sounds inside each track ...
sorry for mumbling on like this
it seems that i tend to do that too much
i think it is the mind's right to die befor the body, but alas it is the body who is stronger in its will to perish... |
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Kaz
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Posted : Sep 2, 2002 15:45
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Actually, I think that atmospheric is much more accurate than emotional - there are times when the music doesn't create strong emotions of excitement/fear/etc but it's flow is very dominant (XV Killist for instance). Still I think that trying to define psytrance is like trying to dissect a brain with a fork.
If you really understand the music - you'll never be able to describe it with something as limited as words.
http://www.myspace.com/Hooloovoo222 |
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thalaron
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Posted : Sep 2, 2002 22:26
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yeah thats what we have to contend to kaz
simbolic langauge
could someone out there pls make a better way to communicate...!!!
but : "what can we do" !
i think it is the mind's right to die befor the body, but alas it is the body who is stronger in its will to perish... |
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