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Traders & Fackers
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Lithium
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
646
Posted : Jul 14, 2005 21:25
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i´ve seen some fighting against traders and against what traders do, at a point that one of the reasons isratrance crew pointed to close the top 10 section would be that it was a place were traders exanged usefull information for their dutties.
now my question is what or who is a trader?
i don´t believe that artists are the ones who actually give the tracks to traders so they can exange them with other traders in the internet. this makes actually little sense if we consider that most of the times full compilations are availiable way before they are actually released. now also considering that labels in a direct way are the ones who have the most to loose cause when a compilation is in the internet and most people already have it way before released, it leaves 2 possibilities of who is actually providing the tracks to the traders, or the labels themselves or distributers like psyshop or wirikuta who also have those tracks before they are actually released.
now i don´t have anything against internet virtual cds shops, and i can also see that "trusted labels people" also get those tracks and pass them to other people when they are instucted the other way round, but as far as i can see labels could, and there are some labels that actually manage to do so, to reduce traders activity by reducing the amount of unreleased tracks availiable in the hands of less trustfull people.
what do you guys think of this?
i know that politics are not allowed here in isratrance, but this reminds me the iraq issue, americans provide iraq with weapons, then they fight iraq because they have those weapons!!! |
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clown
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
97
Posts :
1777
Posted : Jul 14, 2005 21:37
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I like your ending comment very much and it show's alot about society.. but lets not get into that or this thread will get locked.. hehe..
About the traders, i also thought it could be the distribution companies that put the full albums in mp3 and share them with the world, but i have no proof so i stoped thinking about that. Maybe it is the label people who share there music, but then again, i doubt label managers would just hand out full albums to people.. maybe its the people who recieve the promo CDR's before the stuff is released..
there is no way people can really point fingers at others, all we can do is be more careful with our unreleased stuff and never trade in the first place. 
 "VA - REWIRED" OUT NOW !! (techtrance invasion) ---> http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/86303/forum/9
http://psy.techno.fm <------- Jester Records's Internet Radio channel
www.jesterrecords.ca |
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Surrender
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
506
Posts :
5388
Posted : Jul 14, 2005 21:59
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it all depends on which viewpoint youre taking and timing as well.
first lets take artists: i dont wanna make a general statement for them so i will only speak about the ones i know and how the deal with this. as long as a track is unsold it is regarded as highly sensitive. at this point in time most artists will be very upset if their tracks will end up on the net. this could mean that there is a smaller chance to release it (sell it) since it is already out. yet after the point of sale - i dont think artists mind so much what happens with it... it is no longer their property anyway and is up to the label to keep underwarps if they wish.
labels - again i cannot talk for all so please dont quote me on this... some labels are not very good at about keeping their material to themselves. this might be a marketing strategy to spread their tracks, might be a loose organization... hard to tell sometimes. label dj's get music - they trade it with other label dj's from outside labels.... and tracks get on the net eventually since everyone of us has a dj friend 
dancers - again and again, not all, but some get their music from label dj's, people who are friends with label dj's or those release groups that are readily available to anyone with internet access. who are those groups? i dont know... what do they get out of it other then pride? not sure.... but they do exist in all genres and in all types of "soft" releases - from music to computer games to vst technology.
i know some artists that take their music very seriously and do not give it to anyone (me for example) since i am not in their label or am not one of their highly trusted friends. i respect that actually - it makes me think highly of them as indiviuals who care about what they do and wish to do in the best most proffessional manner. if more artists were like this - we would be seeing tracks on the net being traded at the point of "irrelvancy" which is after the sale.
"On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon |
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Pavel
Troll
Started Topics :
312
Posts :
8646
Posted : Jul 14, 2005 22:16
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I knew a girl that dated a very well known producer. And even she didn't get hot unreleased tunes from him when they were seperated physically and chatted only online. Now that's what I call a proper material keeping.
Everyone in the world is doing something without me |
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full_on
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
279
Posts :
5475
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 00:43
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Traders are the guys who call you at MSN asking if you got something new...
I always answer: yes, I have those two new released albums that just arrived at my mailbox.
They reply: This is sooooo old.
And I reply: It won't make any difference, since I'll not send you even a single byte of it.
I agree with surrender. Anyway, their existence will make no difference anyone unless you're dealing with them (or unless they keep asking you for Killargs on MSN).
Just ignore them and keep your conscience clean.
Respect!
.
...Be gentle with the earth...
...Dance like nobody's watching...
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...I don't mind not going to Heaven, as long as they've got Coffee in Hell... |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 05:44
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and some very well known artist started their way with spread their music on p2p, which is also very leagle.
i like soulseek (more for chat) and yeah u see trading shit.. but fuck it.. no one have to be part of it.
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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mouka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
383
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 09:17
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There are some ways to reduce the risk of a coming release or tacks ending up in p2p. As a label we never give any unreleased material out, if we don't use it will not be given out to anyone (including our label dj's).
To promote upcoming releases we make promo cd's for the distributor but only with samples and not full length tracks.
We never send out any upcoming releases for promotional use, only days before the official releasedate.
Even our artists have to wait untill it is released to get their copies.
So this is our concept to keep all the material safe untill releasedate.
Mouka
www.ajana-records.com
www.trishula-records.com |
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Mat N
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
272
Posts :
1211
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 13:51
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Quote:
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On 2005-07-15 09:17, mocca wrote:
There are some ways to reduce the risk of a coming release or tacks ending up in p2p. As a label we never give any unreleased material out, if we don't use it will not be given out to anyone (including our label dj's).
To promote upcoming releases we make promo cd's for the distributor but only with samples and not full length tracks.
We never send out any upcoming releases for promotional use, only days before the official releasedate.
Even our artists have to wait untill it is released to get their copies.
So this is our concept to keep all the material safe untill releasedate.
Mouka
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sounds like the best and the simplest way to deal with the problem
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HandA
Inactive User
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
890
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 15:09
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Quote:
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On 2005-07-15 09:17, mocca wrote:
There are some ways to reduce the risk of a coming release or tacks ending up in p2p. As a label we never give any unreleased material out, if we don't use it will not be given out to anyone (including our label dj's).
To promote upcoming releases we make promo cd's for the distributor but only with samples and not full length tracks.
We never send out any upcoming releases for promotional use, only days before the official releasedate.
Even our artists have to wait untill it is released to get their copies.
So this is our concept to keep all the material safe untill releasedate.
Mouka
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I wish all labels would work like this. |
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mubali
Mubali
Started Topics :
71
Posts :
2219
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 21:34
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Another thing that I know of is some labels have a clause in their contracts with the artists where if their tracks that were licensed to the label appear on the internet prior to the release of the compilation, the artist receives 0 money... Nada, nothing...
I personally think that it's a great idea and respect the labels that take the professional route and encourage the artists to be just as professional...
An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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ND
ProSect
Started Topics :
44
Posts :
919
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 21:45
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mubali > yep, i met labels like this too, respect!
ND
Without Deviation, Progress Is Not Possible.
www.andivision.com
Sound Field / ProSect / Sonify / Radio Mess |
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Lithium
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
646
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 22:14
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yes mubali, i can see your point, but i guess that is assuming that it´s the artist who puts his own track on the web, but what about if its someone else, or from the label, or from the internet virtual shops? if that rule is "implemented" i guess there are some chances of less respectful labels that deal with financial problems to claim that the track is in the net cause the artist put it, when someone else has done it, just to avoid paying the artist... hmm maybe i´m going too far on this, i shall step back |
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mubali
Mubali
Started Topics :
71
Posts :
2219
Posted : Jul 15, 2005 22:38
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I could see where that would be an issue... It really depends on the label and as an artist, you really need to pay attention to what type of things good or bad that have been said about the label. I did some research on the label before I signed the contract. I talked with artists that have previously released on that label and got their perspective... If it's someone else who puts the track out on the net, it should be really easy to find out who has done so, sometimes artists give their music to too many people and things end up online... I have quite a few tracks that ended up that way and it was a big wakeup call for me to be a lot more careful.
Personally, I don't write music to get paid... it's a bonus to get money for it, but the sheer enjoyment of the song getting out farther than I could send it myself is all the payment I really need....
An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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Salamandrill
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
49
Posted : Jul 21, 2005 02:05
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On 2005-07-15 00:43, full_on wrote:
Traders are the guys who call you at MSN asking if you got something new...
I always answer: yes, I have those two new released albums that just arrived at my mailbox.
They reply: This is sooooo old.
And I reply: It won't make any difference, since I'll not send you even a single byte of it.
I agree with surrender. Anyway, their existence will make no difference anyone unless you're dealing with them (or unless they keep asking you for Killargs on MSN).
Just ignore them and keep your conscience clean.
Respect!
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i don't get people nagging me on MSN to trade... my guess you have to know them first
Quote:
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On 2005-07-15 09:17, mocca wrote:
There are some ways to reduce the risk of a coming release or tacks ending up in p2p. As a label we never give any unreleased material out, if we don't use it will not be given out to anyone (including our label dj's).
To promote upcoming releases we make promo cd's for the distributor but only with samples and not full length tracks.
We never send out any upcoming releases for promotional use, only days before the official releasedate.
Even our artists have to wait untill it is released to get their copies.
So this is our concept to keep all the material safe untill releasedate.
Mouka
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thats goo initiative, more labels could abby by these rules instead of blaming other people for their own leaks...
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----Dawn----
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
19
Posts :
789
Posted : Jul 21, 2005 03:09
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If rough copies of an unreleased album really needed to be given out for promotional reasons, wouldn't it be possible to make a number of promos with one track on each slightly different to the ones on the others. Nothing major, just a very slight difference that only the people who made the copies (and their lawyers) would notice. Each person gets roughly the same promo and for all they know it is exactly the same promo that everyone else got but if one copy gets ripped and leaked onto p2p, the label would be able to know exactly who leaked it by checking the 'marked' track and take whatever action they thought necessary. It may stop promos being handed out to a friend of a friend of a ripping group etc.
I know it would be complicated and time consuming but if your music is constantly being leaked weeks or months before release costing you a fortune in sales, that little bit of extra work could make a big difference for future releases.
Am i the only one who believes in solipsism? |
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