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Reviewing / commenting on your own stuff

----Dawn----
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  19
Posts :  789
Posted : Aug 14, 2005 23:08
I’m totally against artists reviewing their own stuff but personally, i do like them 'dropping in' on reviews from time to time... especially when it's more well established ones that i have been listening to for a while. It's something you don't get very much of in more mainstream music.

As long as it's not just blatant promotion or a bump every other post, it's good to hear from the people behind the music.

I think the only problem is if they come across as a bit of a dick ... sometimes it can really put you off their music in the future. Like the saying goes... 'you should never meet your 'heroes', you will only be disappointed'.

Speaking of which, i recently met one of my favourite authors and asked him for his autograph, and to my astonishment he just said no! It wasn't just that he said no, but the way that he said it, in a really arrogant, patronising voice. I was really pissed off so i asked him again 'please can i have your autograph' and again he said no! I just lost it and punched the guy... and i said to him 'i won't be buying 'A Brief History of Time Part 2'!’
          Am i the only one who believes in solipsism?
shahar
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  155
Posts :  2037
Posted : Aug 15, 2005 20:37
Quote:

On 2005-08-12 21:18, clown wrote:
Hell, i've posted many times in my own topic to help promote my upcomming VA. Am i lame for trying to ensure that people hear about my release?? All the artists on my compilation aren't good friends of mine letting me release there tracks for free. There is some money that gets put into this scene, most of which gets lost because of lack of promotion, lack of suport, lack of quality, lack of whatever..



Yes- you are lame if you do it in the reviews section. You might be lame to an extent even if you do it in the promotinal section- but that's your own choice as it is ok to do it there. It's a promotional section.

And as for money- well... go put some money into promotion, then. Don't flame a review section with empty meaningless posts just to bump a tread up- in this case from a member of a community, or a user in a community, you have turned into an abuser of the community and that suck big time and will make people not like you, and make me and some others point to the other users how lame you are

And talking about money, always remember the people who run this forum and started it as a community and not as a promotional tool- they actually spend money on this place- so respect that as well.
          ---------------------------------------------
"Be the change you want to see in the world!"
M.K. Gandhi

"There is only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving, and that's your own self."
Aldous Huxley

electroporn


Started Topics :  1
Posts :  60
Posted : Aug 17, 2005 05:02
Quote:

On 2005-03-28 13:14, Yuli wrote:
Shahar u know what I think of it hehe,

I would advise u to stick this thread up so it wont go down and for everyone to see. I doubt tho that it would stick some sense into everyone, but hell - it might do the trick for those that are willing to see things that maybe eluded them for some strange reason.

Guys and Gals, blue or green color except for the 'r.e.s.p.e.c.t' comes also with certain dose of dignity of self..? When some ppl of these colours are going like in market place here, it looks a bit awkward and so easy to see...




hehehehe

it's so F' funny yuli man
but this forum is all about promotion !!!
u yourself mention all of your upcoming releases down under the line !!

and pretending 2b an objective membre !!
lets stop it !!
there's nothing wrong with promotions !
may be it can even help this lame scene !

good music will alwyas raise up no metter what "they say " like bad music will go down !

stop being so clean yuli !!! u know how 2 promote yourself perfect !!! (stranger) if many ppl' like Yotopia ...so this is it !!!! they f' good !!
1 can lie,1 can be a close friend but where all the other 2000 ppl' ????
are they all bullshiting ???

when there R many lables n artiest there's a competition if u like it or not !
everybody do their best to promote it !!
because for some of tham its sell\play or u won't be able to pay the rant !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Aug 17, 2005 09:48
Quote:

On 2005-08-17 05:02, electroporn wrote:
Quote:

On 2005-03-28 13:14, Yuli wrote:
Shahar u know what I think of it hehe,

I would advise u to stick this thread up so it wont go down and for everyone to see. I doubt tho that it would stick some sense into everyone, but hell - it might do the trick for those that are willing to see things that maybe eluded them for some strange reason.

Guys and Gals, blue or green color except for the 'r.e.s.p.e.c.t' comes also with certain dose of dignity of self..? When some ppl of these colours are going like in market place here, it looks a bit awkward and so easy to see...




hehehehe

it's so F' funny yuli man
but this forum is all about promotion !!!
u yourself mention all of your upcoming releases down under the line !!

and pretending 2b an objective membre !!
lets stop it !!
there's nothing wrong with promotions !
may be it can even help this lame scene !

good music will alwyas raise up no metter what "they say " like bad music will go down !

stop being so clean yuli !!! u know how 2 promote yourself perfect !!! (stranger) if many ppl' like Yotopia ...so this is it !!!! they f' good !!
1 can lie,1 can be a close friend but where all the other 2000 ppl' ????
are they all bullshiting ???

when there R many lables n artiest there's a competition if u like it or not !
everybody do their best to promote it !!
because for some of tham its sellplay or u won't be able to pay the rant !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





Well electroporn, I have an answer for u

First - it would be nice that u use your real name. Just to put yourself out to the light as a man/woman that have little respect for himself/ herself.

Second - What I write in my signature, is irrelevant since there are no rules or guidelines about what to write in signature. If there were rules not to put promoltion in the signature I wouldn't do that

Third - It is indeed very lame to promote yourself or your friends in reviews section that belong to ppl that ( hopefully ) buy and hear creation of an artist. if I am not mistaken you been writing a CD review in 5 SPLIT PARTS for a certain CD here and it is LAME.

Fourth - Why is this bad that I prefer to play it straight? It hurts u that I dont participate in the bull shit u make out of music?

Fifth - I dont know how Yotopia came into your message, but hehe well I in fact wrote quite an extensive review in their CD topic, and if u try to make connection between me and certain dude that was thrashing them personally u r barking at a very wrong tree. But it doesnt surprise me a lot.

Sixth - Competition can be fair!!! It doesnt have to be like the middle east my man. And bottom line what kind of competition? who sells more CD's? Still even for this there is the PROMOTIONAL section

Seventh and last - Shahar wrote really nice post just above yours. The man put a lot of time and money into this site and so quite a lot of ppl with him - Maybe u should listen to what he has got to say, altho I bet u wouldnt give a rotten fuck about that. Would you now?


          A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
electroporn


Started Topics :  1
Posts :  60
Posted : Aug 17, 2005 15:28
Quote:

On 2005-08-17 09:48, Yuli wrote:

Well electroporn, I have an answer for u

First - it would be nice that u use your real name. Just to put yourself out to the light as a man/woman that have little respect for himself/ herself.

Second - What I write in my signature, is irrelevant since there are no rules or guidelines about what to write in signature. If there were rules not to put promoltion in the signature I wouldn't do that

Third - It is indeed very lame to promote yourself or your friends in reviews section that belong to ppl that ( hopefully ) buy and hear creation of an artist. if I am not mistaken you been writing a CD review in 5 SPLIT PARTS for a certain CD here and it is LAME.

Fourth - Why is this bad that I prefer to play it straight? It hurts u that I dont participate in the bull shit u make out of music?

Fifth - I dont know how Yotopia came into your message, but hehe well I in fact wrote quite an extensive review in their CD topic, and if u try to make connection between me and certain dude that was thrashing them personally u r barking at a very wrong tree. But it doesnt surprise me a lot.

Sixth - Competition can be fair!!! It doesnt have to be like the middle east my man. And bottom line what kind of competition? who sells more CD's? Still even for this there is the PROMOTIONAL section

Seventh and last - Shahar wrote really nice post just above yours. The man put a lot of time and money into this site and so quite a lot of ppl with him - Maybe u should listen to what he has got to say, altho I bet u wouldnt give a rotten fuck about that. Would you now?






wooooooooo

what's that... ! the 10 commandments ?
look Mr..perfect !!

my real name is completely not relevant here , its my words ! this is not a dating forum and it got nothing to do with respecting myself ! or you !

as i said ! there is nothing wrong with promotion....and what u got there in your signature is nice and interesting ...but it shows that u do promote yourself in your own style and ways....as i said i find it ok !

now here u going too fast stranger ! there is no lame ever with promoting yourself and your art, no one would ever know who you are if u won't .... i agree that you can't reviewing your own stuff
this is lame !!! my review you were talking about was splits into parts , just because it took me some time to hear the music few times and to write it ...as u must see, its very detailed and informative.
if you think my review is lame...cool ! i wont reviewing your stuff - promise !

" It hurts u that I dont participate in the bull shit u make out of music? "
(yuli, lets say you did'nt wrote it ok ?)

about Yotopia ...it was'nt meant for you and it's just an example of a big reviews full of different ppl'
with different motives and style ....not everybody can write a full page of review...so some just say a few words ...but it still the right place for it !

the competition is about everything ,cd's, shows,rating and whadever !
lets leave the middle east out here !

" altho I bet u wouldnt give a rotten fuck about that. Would you now? "

i respect shahar a lot !! and this forum ! i think he got a strong point !
and i do think this site is very important and useful !

what i don't like is you making me a don't give a f' kind of dude !
and this time !! i will bark and trust me man ..its the right high tree you claimed on !
so ....come down to earth man



Yuli
Retired

Started Topics :  40
Posts :  1660
Posted : Aug 17, 2005 16:32


hmmm the only thing I have got to say is it's too bad you are a little shady about your name, since u are accusing others, at least do it in your own name.. I wont continue this tho, u got a personal message in your inbox because since I do know who u are better not making it nasty in the open

          A man with a "master plan" is often a woman
clown
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  97
Posts :  1777
Posted : Aug 17, 2005 23:44
Quote:

On 2005-08-15 20:37, shahar wrote:
Quote:

On 2005-08-12 21:18, clown wrote:
Hell, i've posted many times in my own topic to help promote my upcomming VA. Am i lame for trying to ensure that people hear about my release?? All the artists on my compilation aren't good friends of mine letting me release there tracks for free. There is some money that gets put into this scene, most of which gets lost because of lack of promotion, lack of suport, lack of quality, lack of whatever..



Yes- you are lame if you do it in the reviews section. You might be lame to an extent even if you do it in the promotinal section- but that's your own choice as it is ok to do it there. It's a promotional section.

And as for money- well... go put some money into promotion, then. Don't flame a review section with empty meaningless posts just to bump a tread up- in this case from a member of a community, or a user in a community, you have turned into an abuser of the community and that suck big time and will make people not like you, and make me and some others point to the other users how lame you are

And talking about money, always remember the people who run this forum and started it as a community and not as a promotional tool- they actually spend money on this place- so respect that as well.





Yeah, i guess too much self promo in the review section is irrelevant.. im sorry, i didn't realise that you were referring to specifically this section when i wrote my last post.. I now totally agree with you on your points about over abusing promo in the review section.. after all, that's the whole point in having seperate sections and its not like people don't have the chance to over promote stuff in another section (thank you promo section lol)..

But, for instance, as a label, people would see it as LAME is the label manager writes a detailed review on his latest release?? or is it just lame to say "thanks for the comments" and "glad that you enjoyed the music" split up in 12 different replys??

sorry for thie slight misunderstanding..           "VA - REWIRED" OUT NOW !! (techtrance invasion) ---> http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/86303/forum/9
http://psy.techno.fm <------- Jester Records's Internet Radio channel
www.jesterrecords.ca
Surrender
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  506
Posts :  5388
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 00:22
Quote:

On 2005-08-17 23:44, clown wrote:
But, for instance, as a label, people would see it as LAME is the label manager writes a detailed review on his latest release?? or is it just lame to say "thanks for the comments" and "glad that you enjoyed the music" split up in 12 different replys??


those kind of comments are being deleted now.           "On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon
Madpup
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  21
Posts :  174
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 12:30
Promotional comments disguised as reviews are surely wrong, but I dont understand what is the problem with comments like 'Glad you have enjoyed the music' or other feedback type comments by the artists on existing reviews, this is something that makes Isratrance special compared to other forums, you can say something about an album and then get artists view on what you have said, be that positive or negative.

Isratrance users are not stupid little children, i am sure they can tell the difference between a proper review and such comments by the artists. IMO this is another example of ridiculous overmederation that happens rather often on this site.
shahar
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  155
Posts :  2037
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 16:11
Quote:

On 2005-08-18 12:30, Madpup wrote:
IMO this is another example of ridiculous overmederation that happens rather often on this site.





hmmmm....
The reason I started this thread was as an alternative to moderating and because ppl here are not stupid- i just wanted to expose to ppl what I see as lame behaviour- so i don't understand your remark here mate.

Did you read my original post?
          ---------------------------------------------
"Be the change you want to see in the world!"
M.K. Gandhi

"There is only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving, and that's your own self."
Aldous Huxley

shahar
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  155
Posts :  2037
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 16:12
and Clown, you wanna review your own release- just do it in the promo section, that's why it is there.           ---------------------------------------------
"Be the change you want to see in the world!"
M.K. Gandhi

"There is only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving, and that's your own self."
Aldous Huxley

Madpup
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  21
Posts :  174
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 16:33
Shahar..I was referring to Surrender's deleting of comments, which he mentioned in the post just before mine.
----Dawn----
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  19
Posts :  789
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 19:59
Re: Deleted post...

Quote:


Post posted by ----Dawn---- in forum CD Reviews in topic Frechbax - Frech (Ajana Records 2005) CD has been deleted by Surrender. Post text was :Mentioned this before in another thread but this seems like a good place to mention it again...

If you are interested, you can also download a full free 8 track promo album (MP3@192) by this guy here:

http://www.frechbax.com/music.htm [addsig]
Reason:
please stick to reviews in this section.




This seems like an appropriate place for my opinion (and that’s all it is) on this.

[Pompous]

The point of any review section should be to provide a service for the purpose of informing and advising potential purchasers as to the nature, content and quality of available products - the products in this instance being CDs.

If a user of the service provided by this board is interested in purchasing a CD - especially a debut CD by a previously unknown artist - then information as to the availability of free samples of the artist's previous work would surely be beneficial to the user in making any decision. Prohibiting or intentionally withholding such possibly useful information could well be seen as doing a disservice to users of the service (ie, potential buyers).

[/Pompous]



I totally agree with the stance against promotion but all reviews are promotional by their very nature. Regardless of the writers intention, they promote the fact that a product or service is available. You can’t have a review without promotion.

In my opinion, letting someone know about free samples is actually less promotional than any review could possibly be because in the case of samples, it's you that makes the 'review'. You may listen to them and think they are total shit. That's hardly what you could call biased promotional hype.

To make an analogy... say a new breakfast cereal came on the market. What would be more useful in helping you decide whether or not to buy it? Someone without bias telling you what it tastes like (a review) or actually getting a free bowl of it in order to decide for yourself? (a sample). The former is good but if the latter is available you would be doing yourself a disservice not to take it. While it's true that the latter is promotion, it shouldn't be confused with someone with a financial interest (often in disguise) telling you it's good. Whether it's good or not is entirely for you to decide.

I’m not getting at you Surrender but you seem to be the only mod on this forum who ever deletes my posts. Maybe you should replace the words ‘Post has been deleted’ with ‘Surrender strikes again!’ I understand that the forum needs rules but adhering to them in a strict, uncompromising manner can sometimes (imo) hinder instead of help.

[RecommendedClosingArseLick]

All that said, i think you guys are doing a great job. Keep it up!

[/RecommendedClosingArseLick]           Am i the only one who believes in solipsism?
Surrender
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  506
Posts :  5388
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 20:26
Madpup:
what we are trying to do is keep this section for non label/artists to formulate their opinion regarding musical material. this isnt an award show and thank you comments although sometimes genuine are mostly done in a promotional manner... since that is the case with over 50% of them, something had to be done. i think the same artist/user connection that exists here can be excluded out of this section and into the promotional one where we beleive it belongs. i dont see why an artist cannot comment on it there. i understand your frustration, please try to see our side.

----Dawn---- :
i admit, i mightve made a mistake on your deletion, i saw the word promo and my sensors lit up, my apologies. i dont have a problem being the "bad guy" who deletes posts or isnt afraid to say his opinions, even if its not the original intention of our actions here. we were getting the feeling that this section was being taken over by the promotional force of the labels/artists and being turned into their ground. again, it is not what this section is about, so it was a concern for us once this was happening on a major scale. youll be amazed what artists/lables are doing here, with multipule fake nicknames and "impartial reviews" that are hardly that. still with your case, it might be a better idea to post it in the promotional section, since although its free, its still a promotion (lots of things in the promo world are set up that way and thats ok). we would like to have a clear as possible distinction between the 2 sections and sometimes there are "casualties" such as that. i hope i got our point across because after all, we are here for the people and nothing more.
          "On the other hand, you have different fingers."
http://myspace.com/gadimon
Willy Wonka
Inactive User

Started Topics :  13
Posts :  574
Posted : Aug 18, 2005 20:51
Surrender you can do really simple thing, Reviews section should contain only long reviews. It will automaticly exclude all "killarg", "keep it up" and thanks "for this album" silly comments. It can also exclude reviews like " XXX-Demon Lair - great bouncy bassline, best done by XXX".
You will teach ppl to review and express properly so i think it can only do the best for all of us. Thou show me where i'm wrong!
Ppl that have not much to say keep you mouth shut or learn to express themself thru writing.
Now you will stay with objective and promotional reviews, i think it will be easy to define each one and quickly remove the promotional ones and move them to promotional section of the forum.

AND btw, there great reviewers on Isratrance forum, something like 10-15 guys (Surrender one of them), it is really a joy to read your reviews, but i try to keep the mouth shut with my own personal comments, only in case i disagree with said or i have to add something really important.

I tend to think that ppl who post short comments wish to keep this album or compilation on top of the board so everyone could read it and and advertise it. I find it's amateur way of thinking! That's why i argue here.
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