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Perfect solution for this whole MP3 issue

Lord Deo


Started Topics :  7
Posts :  215
Posted : Jun 23, 2005 23:27
Quote:

On 2005-06-23 23:20, Cosmos Mariner wrote:

plus don't forget the HIISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSing and cRaCkCRacKcrACkcRacKling




oh like cd's never skip, and labels never peall off.

besides if you get hiss and crackles on you vinyl, maybe you should take good care of them.           www.venomous2.com
www.myspace.com/venomous2
www.myspace.com/asymmetricnoisesyndrome
aplz


Started Topics :  2
Posts :  29
Posted : Jun 23, 2005 23:31
Quote:
oh like cd's never skip, and labels never peall off.



Heh, thats true. CD's scratch way to easily, vinyls warp, CDs peel, vinyls crack. Theres downsides to both. It's all personal prefrence.
HandA
Inactive User

Started Topics :  9
Posts :  890
Posted : Jun 23, 2005 23:33
lol you guys seem to use all tricks to back up your non factual claims that CD's are better than vinly. I guess you haven't owned a vinyl in your lives but nevertheless try to appear as if your experts on the matter
UnderTow


Started Topics :  9
Posts :  1448
Posted : Jun 24, 2005 05:12

HandA: Here are some facts for you:

Vinyl has a smaller dynamic range than CD. Why? Physical limitation: Increasing dynamics means increasing the groove excursion on your vinyl thus shortening playing time and, with too much dynamics, replay needles bouncing out of the groove all over the place. Solution: Over compression of material to fit it on the vinyl.

Real numbers: Dynamic range of vinyl: 60dB max
Dynamic range of CD: 96dB

Vinyl warm? That is just lack of high frequency content on vinyl which rarely goes above 16Khz. You want your CDs to sound warmer? Just EQ out a bit of high-end.

Real numbers: Frequency range of vinyl: 20 - 16Khz [1]
Frequency range of CD: 20 - 20Khz

[1] Depending on where the needle is on the record. A far cry from hi-fi.

Another nice thing about vinyl is the way that the bass is made mono to stop the needle from jumping out of the groove.

Then you have the RIAA EQ curve applied to the signal introducing all sorts of phase shifting and other signal degradation.

Then you have surface noise caused by the needle scraping the vinyl. (THat is the main reason for the RIAA EQ curve). You can't avoid this.

Then you have dust and scrtaches and all the manufacturing anomalies of vinyl.

Real numbers: Average signal to noise ratio on vinyl: 50 - 60 dB
Average signal to noise ratio of CD: 91.3 dB

Vinyl doesn't even come close to the ability of CD to accurately reproduce an original signal.

Vinyl is out-dated.


UnderTow

gandharva
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  338
Posted : Jun 24, 2005 05:50
cheers          dont worry be hippie
phobium
Phobium

Started Topics :  14
Posts :  718
Posted : Jun 24, 2005 05:58
Thanks UnderTow for providing some nice facts
I think vinyl can sound pretty nice if it's being played on a great player with a fancy needle. Your average club/scratch needle just won't do.           ________________________
www.phobium.net
http://phobium.bandcamp.com/
________________________
gandharva
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  22
Posts :  338
Posted : Jun 24, 2005 06:04
Quote:

On 2005-06-22 04:05, Nik© wrote:
Vinyl? Hmm let’s not go into the past
Maybe we should look into more innovative ideas
I think Best solution is electronic mp3 detectors which will notify party goers that the mp3 is playing at the party...? Maybe that will stop the Dj’s from playing this stuff... But really, how can you stop an mp3 thing, if all u see in stores are mp3 players?


yeah and how about ripped programs(reason logic...) detectors to see when an "artist" makes illegal music.so if its making music illegaly you can´t blame a dj by play some of is traks can you?           dont worry be hippie
gaspard
Yab Yum

Started Topics :  50
Posts :  641
Posted : Jun 24, 2005 12:47
Quote:

On 2005-06-22 04:44, phobium wrote:
The perfect solution would be to ban music.
No music = no mp3s
Who's with me on this?




absolutely! join the ELF (Ear Liberation Front) and hold silent parties! hehehe           Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Terry Pratchett
Lord Deo


Started Topics :  7
Posts :  215
Posted : Jun 27, 2005 05:49
Quote:

On 2005-06-24 05:12, UnderTow wrote:

HandA: Here are some facts for you:

Vinyl has a smaller dynamic range than CD. Why? Physical limitation: Increasing dynamics means increasing the groove excursion on your vinyl thus shortening playing time and, with too much dynamics, replay needles bouncing out of the groove all over the place. Solution: Over compression of material to fit it on the vinyl.

Real numbers: Dynamic range of vinyl: 60dB max
Dynamic range of CD: 96dB

Vinyl warm? That is just lack of high frequency content on vinyl which rarely goes above 16Khz. You want your CDs to sound warmer? Just EQ out a bit of high-end.

Real numbers: Frequency range of vinyl: 20 - 16Khz [1]
Frequency range of CD: 20 - 20Khz

[1] Depending on where the needle is on the record. A far cry from hi-fi.

Another nice thing about vinyl is the way that the bass is made mono to stop the needle from jumping out of the groove.

Then you have the RIAA EQ curve applied to the signal introducing all sorts of phase shifting and other signal degradation.

Then you have surface noise caused by the needle scraping the vinyl. (THat is the main reason for the RIAA EQ curve). You can't avoid this.

Then you have dust and scrtaches and all the manufacturing anomalies of vinyl.

Real numbers: Average signal to noise ratio on vinyl: 50 - 60 dB
Average signal to noise ratio of CD: 91.3 dB

Vinyl doesn't even come close to the ability of CD to accurately reproduce an original signal.




Indeed Undertow,
you got the numbers right, although vinyl can handle 20hz to 25khz, not many tunes are being pressed with full dinamic range for the reasons you've mentioned reasons. Even majority of cartiges are made with the frequence response of 20hz to 16khz.

but still after running the same tune side by side on vinyl and cd, my preference goes to vinyl all the way.           www.venomous2.com
www.myspace.com/venomous2
www.myspace.com/asymmetricnoisesyndrome
EYB
Noized

Started Topics :  111
Posts :  2849
Posted : Jun 27, 2005 08:11
Yeah, some people prefer it Lo-Fi

Massaker            Signature
Lord Deo


Started Topics :  7
Posts :  215
Posted : Jun 27, 2005 17:45
Quote:

On 2005-06-27 08:11, EYB wrote:
Yeah, some people prefer it Lo-Fi




oh well, trust me EYB even with those 4khz missing, tunes on vinyl don't loose much. even jungle and d'n'b tracks (with intense hithat action on hi end and floorshaking bass on low end) sound much much better on vinyl then they do on cd, but that's a matter of preference.

oh and by the way, basses on vinyl, are not always converted to mono, just like not all records are 20hz to 16khz. some of the records i own, have full spectrum frequency range (20hz to 20khz).

cheers          www.venomous2.com
www.myspace.com/venomous2
www.myspace.com/asymmetricnoisesyndrome
EYB
Noized

Started Topics :  111
Posts :  2849
Posted : Jun 27, 2005 17:55
Lord Deo u have to read it Lo-Fi Massaker, my side project for destructive hardcore psychedelic muzik            Signature
vector_0
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  113
Posts :  1189
Posted : Jun 29, 2005 00:09
Quote:

On 2005-06-23 22:47, aplz wrote:
Quote:

On 2005-06-21 07:53, EYB wrote:
Vinyl is crap quality, so this idea is absolutly not good.



Not only that, vinyl is expensive to produce. A small psy label in Brazil can't afford to press 7000 vinyls. CD's are much much cheaper, provide better sound quality too. Besides, ripping vinly is no harder then ripping CD.



i dunno man, i think ripping vinyl is WAY more of a pain in the ass than ripping cds. i like to put my favorite songs on my comp so i can listen to them while computing, and all i have to do is put a cd in the drive and tell iTunes to make an mp3. if i wanted to rip a record (which i've never done) i'd have to set up a turntable & mixer next to my computer, play the whole record while using a recording program, then use another program to convert the recording to an mp3. fuck all that shit. i'll just listen to the record when i want to hear the song. mp3 problem solved!

oh, and has anyone mentioned that you'll get a lot more girls if you spin vinyl?
gaspard
Yab Yum

Started Topics :  50
Posts :  641
Posted : Jun 29, 2005 11:00

[/quote]
oh, and has anyone mentioned that you'll get a lot more girls if you spin vinyl?
[/quote]

?????????????           Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Terry Pratchett
vector_0
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  113
Posts :  1189
Posted : Jun 29, 2005 21:04
lol
Trance Forum » » Forum  Trance - Perfect solution for this whole MP3 issue
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