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Does the subbass have to play in tune?
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Upavas
Upavas
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Posted : Sep 6, 2014 05:20
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Quote:
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On 2014-09-05 10:39, routingwithin wrote:
One full bassline + sub - the other adds extra movement with bits here and there.
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I second that, nothing hits the sweet spot like a single oscillator well made sawtooth bass! If you can, prove me wrong... But I doubt you can...
  Upavas - Here And Now (Sangoma Rec.) new EP out Oct.29th, get it here:
http://timecode.bandcamp.com
http://upavas.com
http://soundcloud.com/upavas-1/ |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Sep 7, 2014 23:26
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Does psytrance bass require one to use layers?
Sure as hell NO!
But is it something you should avoid?
Sure as hell NO!
When using them, is it a good idea to have all layers playing in tune?
Yep!
Some people here mentioned that you can detune them a bit. It reads to me like they're going for some kind of chorus effect, or a doubler. My opinion, though, is that you're better off having the lower and extra layers in tune, then if you want you can double the other layers and spread them out a bit and use different tuning on those doubles if you want. Probably not a good idea to have your subs sounding like they're not in tune with the meaty part of the sound. Why? You don't call it layers unless you want it to sound like one sound! You call it a mix when you're combining different sounds with some separation between them.
Then it's probably a good idea to check the phase. Why? Imagine you pick some voice, say from a movie's dialogue. You then split this signal into frequency bands and you then decide and delay just the mids by 2 to 5ms. Guess what? It starts to sound like two things, rather then just one thing!
This will probably lead you to a simple conclusion: better keep it simple unless you have a good reason for complicating 
Good reasons could be: the kind of bass/lead that's done in most DNB and Dubstep these days... Just think of the predominance of that sound as compared to a psytrance bass sound to. Psytrance Bass, imo, needs to have a steady presence, drive the track, but kind of sit underneath it, with enough bass energy to drive the audiences, with enough pluck to cut through and give the notes some definition even with a crowded mix, but leaving enough room for all the synths and samples and whatever to tell the story, right?
I think most time based fx or chorus/doubling/phasing/saturation&distortion, etc for psytrance bass should be applied gently, just to give it a small, almost subliminar touch at best... And that's one of the few reasons I see for going out the layering route. |
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woodster77
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Sep 8, 2014 00:53
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wont you get phase isues with the bassline if your using a diferent osc
°°°ACTS 4:12°°°° |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Sep 8, 2014 02:00
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yep?!
but it's different! two oscillators tuned slightly differently will of course 'cause some phasing effect, as the two waveforms don't match.
but that's not the same as having one signal (no matter if produced with a single, two or three oscillators, dialogue or whatever, split into different bands with one of the bands lagging because of all the processing that went on.
I may be coming across as being ultra conservative and precious about small details. But I do feel that it DOES make a difference when it comes to layering sounds together, if you're to produce something that will sound as one - even if it's two (or more) pieces of the same thing with different processing, or separate pieces combined to produce one single sound; either way phase is something to keep an eye on and a parameter to tweak.
The thing is, many times absolute phase alignment isn't the best sounding option at all. But it's best if that's a decision you make, rather then the result you simply arrive at, no?
Cheers |
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knocz
Moderator
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Posted : Sep 11, 2014 23:19
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Hmm lots of nice and interesting points of view over this 
I'd say it doesn't matter that it matters.
Well, you can balance your subs just right to make the house rumble, and you can tune it so it's more or less consonant or dissonant, which will or will not cause phasing issues depending on what you play and how and even where you play it... so everything is possible: use it to your advantage!
You can really go out of the box -> think of psychopathic high tek dark stuff, almost randomly changing the beat out of time until it lands into a nice sweet spot and rumbles away You can use you subs to bring you bass in and take it out, phase in or out, enter consonance or dissonance. You decide what what's good for you - and it doesn't really have to be a set-and-forget setting on your bass synth.
Is it necessary to have a sub oscillator rumbling in tune to have the dancefloor grooving? No.
Is it necessary to have some subs rumbling to have the dancefloor grooving? Maybe. That's up to you, but listen to your material, and figure it out! Just try out different settings, and get it as you like. You can't fail like that 
Super Banana Sauce http://www.soundcloud.com/knocz |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Sep 12, 2014 01:07
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Stylish post Knocz! |
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routingwithin
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Sep 12, 2014 10:26
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Sub bass: -x-x --x- -x-x ----
Main bass: --x- -x-- --x- -x-x
3rd Bass: ---- ---x ---- --x-
" We are together in this matter you and I, closer to death, yes, closer than i'd like. How do you feel? - There can be no division in our actions, or everything is lost. What affects you affects me. " |
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Upavas
Upavas
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Posted : Sep 13, 2014 21:50
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Get-a-fix
Getafix
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1441
Posted : Sep 14, 2014 14:40
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Sep 14, 2014 17:37
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sub are phase synced with the osc, it s part of the osc in fact i think ona analog synth..might depend the design .., that the difference between a sub and a second osillator one octave lower |
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orange
Fat Data
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Posted : Sep 23, 2014 03:05
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