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Do we really need labels?

Pointy


Started Topics :  6
Posts :  278
Posted : Aug 14, 2004 10:58
First of all, sorry KokaOlalaJwal for my strange way of quoting you in my last post. Wasnt familiar with how to do it.
I learned...

Quote:

On 2004-08-13 22:35, NoKeyAah wrote:
labels are to musicians as a frame is to a painting. the best painting in the world will look like shit without a good frame thats supporting it.
many artists are famous because of the record label promo tactics...........





Have you ever been to a museum or art exhibition?? The paintings usually hang there without a frame around! And the good old Dali looks amazing nevertheless. Have you seen any party decoration with frames?? Does it all look like shit?? Wake up!

And yeah, Boybands and Britney are famous because of the clever promotion tactics and the money the label puts into that, not because they are actually good artists.

In the Trance scene it doesn't quite work like that and I hope it never will. Or do you want your favourite act to be a puppet, who's image and performance is controlled by others and hasn't much to do with their own personality at all?

And Kemic-Al: I also met and hang out with some of the label guys you are mentioning and with all respect, I think they are nice and friendly people, but surely not overworking themselves!
Spindrift
Spindrift

Started Topics :  33
Posts :  1560
Posted : Aug 14, 2004 13:25
Hi kemic-al, how's things.
I respect that your music is definatly is made as your own personal expression, and that you are not a sell out
And I know that some of the people behind the labels you mentioned is doing a good job. I don't know if they come across to me as hard working, but then I also meet them on 'holiday' in goa. Agreed, it can feel like you quite busy making, smoking and cleaning chillums sometimes there
Especially Guiseppe (parvati) I respect, because he has been running his label a while allready, and seems to still do it for his love of a certain style of trance without compromising.
He is more organised in what he do than most lables, and is giving advances higher than his contractual obligations to artists even if he is not really making any profit on his releases.
Like I said, most people come quite bitter after a few years of working for no money, so it is nice to se that someone remembers the reason they are doing it.

What I'm wondering is that if one is doing it to get your style of music out there and played, why stick to CD's as a only distributing method, and get upset if people now prefer other means of distribution.
I would gladly pay 20% of a gig-fee to a label if they aided a bit in promotion, and had some decent server space to host my music on.
Of course they could sell CD's and charge for higher quality downloads, sell merchandise etc to get something for the time and money they invested. Just let go a bit of that expectations that everyone that want's to hear your music has to give you a few cents.

The software industry I belive is just a pioneer for all media that can be distibuted digitally. There is plenty of companies and individuals doing extremly well making free software. As all of you know, most websites is hosted on an open-source os like linux, with open-source webserver like apache....etc
I think it would be amazing if that type of economy could spread more. To give away what do for free, and get back because people want to give you something back or require further services from you.....
:hell choice:


Started Topics :  0
Posts :  5
Posted : Aug 14, 2004 16:31
'critics' are important in the role of 'interpretating other' peoples art....

..."act"... plays an important roll in performance art.. wouldn't you all agree..

in my eyes everyone is an artist, it's the different approaches that you take to it..
you artistic pursuits could be; conceptual, intllectual, emotive, decorative/descriptive, thematic/systmatic, your direct intention (surface) could be kitsch, might have bad taste, be classical, you may be focused more on the visual impact, peripheral tension, spacial rest, centralisation, maybe more focused on the 'elements'; tone/'intensity'/colour/size/'space'/'mass'/direction...

whatever really..

soul expression comes from the heart...
so, don't break it ..use it..

critical minds..confusion kills

umei express yourself freely, so don't mind me..


how about you take an approach like an art assignment.. "three blue arrows danced in pain watching below them the two armies-one of mythological symbols, the other random shapes- fighting a phyrric war where one solidier from each side stood at the peripheries pleading an answer from the god of wise" this was an art assignment i made up in the 8th grade, my intellectual, and very emotive role through the eyes of the "the universe" and never losing 'thekate' like ..outside and inside... (for you to all analyse, would definetly b something to hear!!!)

and there i go again...
so the moral of the story.. umm..what was the plot??
Pointy


Started Topics :  6
Posts :  278
Posted : Aug 15, 2004 13:40
Quote:


:hell choice:
so the moral of the story.. umm..what was the plot??




We were actually discussing the pros and cons of labels in the trance scene.

Maybe you'd like to join the "Artists I want to ask you something" thread, your comments seem to fit in there.
shahar
IsraTrance Team

Started Topics :  155
Posts :  2037
Posted : Aug 15, 2004 22:21
http://forum.isratrance.com/viewtopic.php/topic/6186/forum/1/start/15


And I'll quote myself from there:
Quote:

The job of a record label in my eyes is double:
1. present a musical vision.
2. give the artists space and time to work on their art.

I can elaborate a lot on what each of these means. But I'll let you think about it yourselves, or when I have more time.



And I'll add something more that has to do with my vision of a label and why I'm running a label.

In a time that everyone with a computer and a bit of money can release a CD, in a flood of average and bad releases- good ones easily drown. A good label can offer both artists and listeners that mark of quality, which is a powerful thing and very helpful for all involved.

The fact that almost none of the trance labels actually do that lately, is sad for sure.
          ---------------------------------------------
"Be the change you want to see in the world!"
M.K. Gandhi

"There is only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving, and that's your own self."
Aldous Huxley

geisha


Started Topics :  0
Posts :  10
Posted : Aug 16, 2004 05:29

Quote:


>>>>>"Artists I want to ask you something"<<<<<<




that would make you a...
Pointy


Started Topics :  6
Posts :  278
Posted : Aug 16, 2004 10:31
I wonder why you two are so angry.

And there are no stupid questions, only stupid answers.



edit:
ups, now the posts I was refering to have diappeared.........

Thanks for that CyberPunk
deejayridoo
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  14
Posts :  309
Posted : Aug 16, 2004 11:58
i believe that labels are doing a good job and are important for orientation. maybe we should better talk about the need for distributions...
the major problem are artists who impose themselves and do everything to release in order to get into the illusory "hall of fame". i can only repeat it all the time: people, do it for the love and go to work on a regular job in order to be INDEPENDENT. so you can go on making weird music and play it in underground parties and don´t give a shit to the mainstream...
YES, labels are important, but they should only release really good music, not only because it is music of friends who are good bootlickers...
that´s pure nepotism
i think that music sould pass the borderline of the circle of friends...
i wouldn´t want to release a "family cd" because people are not critical enough when they are personally involved.
:hell choice:


Started Topics :  0
Posts :  5
Posted : Aug 16, 2004 13:07
ok then..
labels, i think, are important because they bring all of the same 'kind' together, if it weren't for labels, we'd have "randoms" all over the show..
like 'me'.... peace!!
KakoOlalaJwal
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  116
Posts :  2565
Posted : Aug 16, 2004 13:34
Quote:

On 2004-08-16 13:07, :hell choice: wrote:
if it weren't for labels, we'd have "randoms" all over the show..




Little wink... the comp "Random" on Koyote records...           .
.
"Get your dose of BoOgie !"

http://www.bunkum-records.com
http://www.myspace.com/zekakoo
:hell choice:


Started Topics :  0
Posts :  5
Posted : Aug 17, 2004 07:07
well.....there you go, ::clap:: ::clap:: and all hands down, the topic has been SOLD to "me" the little wink, wink, for much more than it's worth!! ..even "randoms" have a label!! WOW amazing shit.. shows how much i really care.. i mean, know about "labels" ..and.. ..i just learnt a lesson.. >no opinions excepted, by people who can't take it!!<
KakoOlalaJwal
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  116
Posts :  2565
Posted : Aug 17, 2004 12:36
Sorry I didn't understand anything...           .
.
"Get your dose of BoOgie !"

http://www.bunkum-records.com
http://www.myspace.com/zekakoo
Pointy


Started Topics :  6
Posts :  278
Posted : Aug 17, 2004 13:41
I seem to have really upset a couple of people with the topic of this thread.
They think the question is out of the question.
Well, IMO it is worth a thought when you read comments like this:

Quote:
On 2004-08-15 13:02, Fu Hsi wrote:
...Labels that don't put enough attention into quality of music released.......
Quote:
On 2004-08-15 00:03, Ulf:G wrote:
The big problem is the large amount of crap being released, so that talented artists drown in this sea of bullshit.
Quote:
On 2004-08-10 21:57, DiMiTry wrote:
A lot of good psychedelic music is too strange for mainstream psy labels. Thus it remains unreleased. Check out Vicious Spiral ...
i'd really like to donate some money to him so he keeps making psytrance.
(Quotes from other threads. There are many more like that.)

and think about that the trance scene started without labels and music got spread through copying only.
Artist got well known, because people loved to dance to their music.
What was didn't get copied.

It is right, that that time the artists weren't getting any material reward for their work and I agree that they should, but for that we don't need to buy copywrited CDs in shops.

Nowadays there is the possibility to have music ditributed and payed for via web sites.

So OK, we do need some kind of "labels"
(I just don't like the word, it makes me think of 'Nike'& Co. I also don't like the development from "I paint something colourful on my shirt for the party" to "I need to have a shirt of this years 'blablalabel' collection" BTW.

The way most labels define themselves and their work should IMO change.

More ideas and opinions ARE welcome.
Bom.
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