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Dark psy "trend" ???

Mute
IsraTrance Full Member
Access Gremlin

Started Topics :  51
Posts :  1046
Posted : Feb 5, 2006 07:47
now lets see ,., both morning and dark are psychedelic , psychedelic trance by itself is underground music as compared to the other genres of electronic music,usually the normal listener starts off listening to full on fluffy , cheesy (watever u wanna call it) music but as time progresses listeners want to listen to somethin different ,thats when they listen to dark trance. However,i feel this is totally opposite when it comes to the makers of psytrance , initially artists begin producing more darker material (i would like to call it quality trance)and tend to evolve to the more full on stuff (there are exceptions ofcourse).Take for example Infected Mushroom , Gms etc... these guys made very intelligent music before and now?????i mean there has gotta be a limit to this evolution but remixes of Dire straits , benny bennasi ,britney spears micheal jackson is very sad, since psytrance is underground and has a relatively small market ,these artists wanna grab the market by creating the so called commercial trance(Raja Ram posing on his new cd cover for example) which in my oppinion isnt psychedelic anymore,so in another 10 years are we to expect psychedelic hip hop rap trance ,is this what we want?
This topic is debatable and has been talked about bfore but this is just my perspective of how things are and wats to come hehe ,no offence to anyone
Olimpiasis


Started Topics :  2
Posts :  95
Posted : Feb 5, 2006 12:56

beacuse is good .....
Cardinals Cartel
Black Machine

Started Topics :  191
Posts :  3097
Posted : Feb 5, 2006 16:50
Quote:

On 2006-02-05 12:56, Olimpiasis wrote:

beacuse is good .....




Hahaha .. That for sure ! I belive (As a dark producer) that in the dark u will find only a good music .. (Oscuro my friend say it ones) , Fears , Surprises , Lots of concealed power and mystery ,
All are in . Lots of imagination .
phobic


Started Topics :  5
Posts :  25
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 03:16
Quote:

On 2006-02-05 07:28, chong wrote:
Quote:

On 2006-02-05 00:43, phobic wrote:

I think people listen to it because its the most complex


u fool



let me guess, im wrong because thats my oppinion. well guess what bia, we all listen to music for our own reasons. so f off
chong

Started Topics :  0
Posts :  227
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 16:05
Quote:

On 2006-02-07 03:16, phobic wrote:
Quote:

On 2006-02-05 07:28, chong wrote:
Quote:

On 2006-02-05 00:43, phobic wrote:

I think people listen to it because its the most complex


u fool



let me guess, im wrong because thats my oppinion. well guess what bia, we all listen to music for our own reasons. so f off


is it supposed to be a complex answer?
sorry to piss u off, but u thinking that this music is "the most complex" is kinda funny because what u think is complex is most of the time just random layers...beside that i cannot judge on taste,but it's really really far to be complex music... actually i would say it's the easiest and less complex music in the world(cf my previous arguments in this topic )
Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  60
Posts :  3709
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 17:03
i have to agree with chong, even if you think he sounds arrogant, he has a point..

its a difference in making complex music and know what you are doing and making complex music by just trying different strange sounds...
its a higher level of creation to have a goal and be able to fullfill it...

all of us can put random sounds in motion and call it freaky psychedelic music... without even knowing what the sound is built of.

some people really dont know the difference in twisting that knob and this knob, they only know it happens something....
to know what happens and to have controll of it is that higher level of creation, just like a painter knows which brush to use to achieve a certain thing...

Pt.
IsraTrance Senior Member

Started Topics :  236
Posts :  6106
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 17:13
Hallucinogen - The Lone Derenger is complex music, and psychedelic. Most "dark-psy" tracks, or psy-core tracks are easy in it's complexety. But all in all, if it's tripper friendly or not. Thats what counts.

Something very "simple" can be VERY genius on a trip. Just look at minimal psytrance, or progressive. Simple, but does it's duty.

What was the topic about?
14-year old e-tard




Offtopic posts:  5
Posted: Feb 7, 2006
Quote:

On 2006-02-07 17:13, Kire-naj wrote:

What was the topic about?




About Angelina Jolie and her alleged pregnancy. Is Angelina and Brad Pitt going to get married?           Me>You
phobic


Started Topics :  5
Posts :  25
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 20:35
Quote:

On 2006-02-07 17:03, New Era Scientist wrote:
i have to agree with chong, even if you think he sounds arrogant, he has a point..

its a difference in making complex music and know what you are doing and making complex music by just trying different strange sounds...
its a higher level of creation to have a goal and be able to fullfill it...

all of us can put random sounds in motion and call it freaky psychedelic music... without even knowing what the sound is built of.

some people really dont know the difference in twisting that knob and this knob, they only know it happens something....
to know what happens and to have controll of it is that higher level of creation, just like a painter knows which brush to use to achieve a certain thing...





it is complex. one sound is as if it is behind you, and maybe there is another sound that swirls back and forth. How masterfull the derango cd is. It is so 3 demensional. Of course randome sounds doesnt make it what it is, its how well the artist worked the sounds.
Kashyyyk
Kashyyyk

Started Topics :  9
Posts :  239
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 22:08
Tell all this things to Kindzadza or Entropy (the best in my humild opinion)

Sure...it's so easy to talk...easy, random layers, mediocre, etc...
But to do it and to get to serious labels ...
Well... that's the thing!.

Like that you have all your answers :

good psy = good label = good psy

the rest is just a demo .

Peace and love to all from México!

Kitnam
Mantik

Started Topics :  110
Posts :  1151
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 22:28

good psy = good label = good psy
the rest is just a demo .


i like that simple point of view.
Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  60
Posts :  3709
Posted : Feb 7, 2006 22:31
phobic - Derango is very nice...
they have a sense of making their sounds come alive!
they are wizards!
they know how to process the sounds to get the effects they are after... lots of granulizers and 3d effects.. like dopplers and what else...

lots of experimentation is behind their sounds... and also lots of cannabis and mushrooms


to put random effects in a chain is not a bad thing, to experiment is not bad... but at some point you should also learn what it was that you did and how you can achieve that effect again... this takes time.

i also like twisted music... but it should be somekind of craft behind it, not just random sounds thrown in for the sake of being "crazy"
14-year old e-tard
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :  11
Posts :  797
Posted : Feb 8, 2006 12:12
Quote:

On 2006-02-07 22:31, New Era Scientist wrote:
to put random effects in a chain is not a bad thing, to experiment is not bad... but at some point you should also learn what it was that you did and how you can achieve that effect again... this takes time.

i also like twisted music... but it should be somekind of craft behind it, not just random sounds thrown in for the sake of being "crazy"


I've been having a listen to a few samples to see what this particular sound is all about. This new turn, or whatever you wanna call it, is very similar to what happened with jazz when Coltrane did Ascension back in 1965. Music with no chord progressions, no conventional musical scales, nothing that resembled conventional music in the sense that, there were so many dissonant passages (like the "dark" stuff as you like to call it) and licks, that to many people, it simply wasn't music any more. His older performances on Kind Of Blue, Blue Train, Giant Steps, A Love Supreme were monumental and thought to be genre defining by pretty much everybody in the world. But when he did Ascension, most people said that Coltrane lost it...the booze and drugs finally caught up with him. Could it be that the same is happening to the trance scene after many years of relentless drug abuse?
          Me>You
Kashyyyk
Kashyyyk

Started Topics :  9
Posts :  239
Posted : Feb 8, 2006 19:21
Yes yes yes.. my 14-year old e-tard friend i think is preety much as you say, i think "dark psy" is for now the "anti-music" talking about melodies and chords .

But all this has a "why" .

I my life as a professional guitar player i can tell you that since i was 14 i have been hearing and playing for living every kind of music from jazz to rock to cumbia to classic ..everything, and in certain way i feel that i have and did losted the interest for traditional and contemporary harmony and melody arrainging and this is because is always the same thing:

"intro - 1st verse - 2nd verse - bridge - chorus - half intro - 3rd verse - bridge - chorus, chorus, chorus, chorus - final or fade out" .
Same chords, same melodies, same instruments, as always .

Same happens with comercial trance in it's own way.

So i think is not a matter of drugs since the psy creators are mostly non drug people.
Is a matter of evolution of music and sinthesis, now we are not creating melodies or chords, now we are creating "moments", pastes, we are smashing the sound until the harmonics can't any more with them selves! is the way to say :

WE ARE TIRED OF THE SAME .


best vibes!
Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  60
Posts :  3709
Posted : Feb 9, 2006 02:18
Quote:

On 2006-02-08 12:12, 14-year old e-tard wrote:
Quote:

On 2006-02-07 22:31, New Era Scientist wrote:
to put random effects in a chain is not a bad thing, to experiment is not bad... but at some point you should also learn what it was that you did and how you can achieve that effect again... this takes time.

i also like twisted music... but it should be somekind of craft behind it, not just random sounds thrown in for the sake of being "crazy"


I've been having a listen to a few samples to see what this particular sound is all about. This new turn, or whatever you wanna call it, is very similar to what happened with jazz when Coltrane did Ascension back in 1965. Music with no chord progressions, no conventional musical scales, nothing that resembled conventional music in the sense that, there were so many dissonant passages (like the "dark" stuff as you like to call it) and licks, that to many people, it simply wasn't music any more. His older performances on Kind Of Blue, Blue Train, Giant Steps, A Love Supreme were monumental and thought to be genre defining by pretty much everybody in the world. But when he did Ascension, most people said that Coltrane lost it...the booze and drugs finally caught up with him. Could it be that the same is happening to the trance scene after many years of relentless drug abuse?




sometimes you can wonder,
but if so it would be drugs like cocain and amphetamine not cannabis or other psychedelia
Still i think we should not blame the drugs for anything bad... the bad thing is that humans abuse them.

Derango is for me creepy, strange mind blowing psychedelic music..its like the sounds becomes cretures... not necessary dark, in the sense you get when you hear the word dark.

expression and communication is different things in music...
for communication we need a system, but not for experssion...
sure if you look at it from another point of view communication is also alot about expression... the importance of how you express your communication.

main point is that most(notice i say most not all) twisted psychedelic music is about expression and not communication... i think that this must be similar to the Coltrane analogy..
his first tracks was probably about communication and his later tracks was probably purly expression...

i really dont know, i only heard a few Coltrane tracks and i havent analyzed them at all

Kashyyyk - i think we have alot of artists that use drugs and express what they feel on those drugs in their music...

i think thats the beauty of psychedelic music... it dosent have to be ultra wierd, it exists good tracks with conventional tonal structures but with great timing and good expression..

Jefferson Airplane, Jimi Hendrix, The Doors, Led Zeppelin, this kind of music is not as twisted as what we listen to now days, but still drug influenced and probably it was twisted in their days...

bla bla bla


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