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Artist Survival Guide
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shulman
Shulman
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
88
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 01:25
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ive been cheated by almost every label i worked with or by labels that worked with the labels i worked with
a) some labels didnt pay me my money.
b) some paid me partially.
c) some labels didnt do the work they were suppose to do proffesionaly like promotion, booking etc'
d) some labels sold my music to other labels without any right to do so (and without telling me) and kept the money to themselves, and that is considered pure fraud.
e) some of them released my music without supplying me with the contract i was promised, prior to starting to work together.
f) most of them (the bad ones) done any possible combination of the above.
since i been in all these situations already, i decided to compile a couple of tips for the new guys in town
1. always try to work with a local label since its much easier to perform legal and/or criminal actions if you must.
2. before you contact a label, or close a deal. check out the label releases and email a big number of artists that worked with them in the past. its better not to email GMS since they were probably paid. prefer the less known artists and ask them what's their opinion of the label, and if they got paid.
also prefer those who are not "house" artists
since they are probably prejudice
3. have everything WRITTEN DOWN AND SIGNED. never trust someones promises, because people tend to forget what they said 5 minutes ago, especially if its in their interest.
when its written its unarguable.
4. Always consult a lawyer before signing anything. the small fee paid for consulting might save you BIG $$$ later on down the path.
5. avoid those who promise you the world (unless you're infected mushroom) since they shamelessly lie to you in your face.
not doing any of the above since youre too stoned or too damn lazy is a sure way to get fucked!!! and you have no one to blame but yourself.
hope this helps you guys
best of luck in the mu-sick biz
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nobody_3
Inactive User
Started Topics :
13
Posts :
1177
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 01:32
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Very good advices 
I can only say the same. Make sure the above criterias are meet.... I have been ripped off, cheated and lied to and wish that I could have gone somewhere and got some advice when I first started out releasing my music. It would have saved me from a lot of frustration and loss of a lot of money.
Take the time to get the deal with the record label right from the start and one other important advice. NEVER sign a contract for more than one release at a time.... |
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nobody4
Inactive User
Started Topics :
21
Posts :
358
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 16:38
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A few more good advices:
1. when signing a contract with a label, prepare your invoices. yes, these are needed for the label to be able to release the money you deserve (hint hint to many who bitch about not getting paid)
2. Make sure you understand the terms Exclusive and Licensing - Exclusive means that the label owns all the rights to the track, and is entitled to do whatever it wants with it (but still it has to pay for any re-use of the music)
3. Enlist yourself in the local artists organization, it might cost a bit but it can help in the future.
4. Remember that you are NOT infected mushroom/GMS. a very good advice for artists who are releasing their first releases - dont let it get to your head.
5. Don't rush to muddy the waters if things don't go so smoothly - even if you feel you are 100% just, throwing mud in a small scene like ours never helps, and can also hurt you in the future(by no means a threat, but I've seen this happen and dont want to see silly wars again)
And most of all, try to remember that the major profit for starting artist is the PUBLICITY he gets from releasing a track, not necessarily the small amont of money he might get from the release. I'm not trying to say that deals should not be kept, only I've seen may ocassions where young artists with demands like the 'big' ones, artists with 1 track on a little backdoor compilation with egos up the sky - get real ppl.
gimmi a couple more minutes, I'll think of more...
A
 auspexx@compact-records.com |
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ND
ProSect
Started Topics :
44
Posts :
919
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 21:50
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really great advices shulman & helen!
Without Deviation, Progress Is Not Possible.
www.andivision.com
Sound Field / ProSect / Sonify / Radio Mess |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 22:56
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Auspexx I wouldnt do that if I was u..
Shulman is a well known and respected artist and his opinion about the situation shouldn't get this 'cinical' interpretation. If you wish u can open a thread about what label require from artists. As far as I know Yaniv, he knows very well what exclusive is etc..
We personally had some nice encounter in the past and I don't remember doing anything wrong back then, and I got your apologee and dont you worry.. But mostly the mistakes come from the labels..
What labels are? THIRD PARTY THAT MOVES ART INTO THE CONSUMERS HANDS.. that is all, and u get good money for that.. much more than the artists that create the art.
So take your cinicism somewhere else sweet talking DJ Auspexx
Take it easy
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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shulman
Shulman
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
88
Posted : Oct 8, 2003 23:25
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what is exclusive?
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Xoltan
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
119
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 02:56
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I've been lied in some times as well... Terrible fact. 
No limits |
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nobody4
Inactive User
Started Topics :
21
Posts :
358
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 08:12
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Yuli, I meant no cynicism in my reply, these I believe to be very important advices for new artists. This wasn't a reply to Yaniv's post, but rather an addition - don't you think its important for fresh starters to know that they will NOT get any money without an ivoice (something that is usualy discovered on the paying date and creates a lot of mess), or that they should be enlisted in the local artist organization?
What is so cynical about that?
I have a lot of respect for yaniv's work, and although I think his advices are a bit driven out of bitterness, I respect also his right to post them.
And Yuli, you dont yet have administrative rights here, so I don't have to take anything anywhere, even if you misunderstood and didn't like it.
peace off,
A
auspexx@compact-records.com |
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shulman
Shulman
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
88
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 13:11
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dear helen....
may i ask why exactly do you think my "advices are driven out of bitterness"?
why dont you think they are driven out of "trying to help alot of new artists to mange their precsious music, efforts, money and time wisely"?
i think thats your the one whos bitter... especially due to the fact that i have never mentioned compact in any one of my posts!!! nor i have ever worked with you people (although gadi is a good friend of mine, which i know since we were kids...).
about your post: yes it is a fact: there is almost no way for the artist to fuck a label. but there are numerous ways for the label to fuck an artist.
and when you sign a new artist ITS UP TO YOU TO EXPLAIN TO HIM WHAT HE SIGNS!!! because you're the more experienced side to the deal and because youre the one who wrote the agreement. IF YOU DONT DO THAT IT MEANS YOURE HIDING STUFF FROM HIM... KAPISH??? and eventually ripping him off. so instead of posting general and "u artist are very stupid" advices, it will be better if you sit down with all your new artists and explain to them the true meaning of what they sign, and all the other procedures they must perform in order to get their money ON TIME.
and apart from that its time that you label people start worring more and more about youre reputation if you want to succeed in this buisness.
and let me finish with acouple of cliches
1) "WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND"
2) "DONT SPIT IN THE WELL YOU DRINK FROM CAUSE IT AINT FUCKING NICE"
m'kay ???? |
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Rik
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
107
Posts :
966
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 13:24
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Yuli: when I read the first posts and didn't really detect any hidden flames, but a friendly advice to beginning musicians. knowledge is power, and can avoid a lot of nasty situations (i remember some thread here not so long ago, that wouldn't have existed if there weren't errors in communication and/or understanding terms of contracts etc...
my personal conclusion: pretty usefull thread for "young" artists!!!
ps. i don't know any previous history about relations between the people that posted these and their respective labels.
www.psytracks.com :: Brand new website for sharing your psytracks with the world. Get a free 250Mb Artist profile, Blog and events calender!
www.psygarden.be :: Upload your psychedelic art and partypictures to our gallery! |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 13:41
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Sorry rik I did not see that as a friendly advice by helen.. Knowing the funky equlibrium of powers in this forum, I can in 98% of chances, say that if Yaniv wouldn't 'show his', Auspexx wouldn't 'show his'. Usually I even tend not to join this kind of conversations.. But in this case I did and the reason for it is simple:
There is a general feeling between <especially> 'young' artists that if a label sign u up, then WOW, it is so fucking nice and great >>> and they live in euphoria, buy equipment, spend heeps of time in studios etc.. Only to find out that after all the work they have dun that counts in HUNDREDS / THOUSANDS of hrs, the label didn't do any of his things well ( promotion, cover, licensing etc.. ) and the usual answer will be -
'There were some unexpected shit in the scene and u know that the situation is quite hard at the mo.. bla bla bla'
So when someone that represents a label, responds in this kind of a way... well I find it disturbing and abusing.
AND YES TAL, when u sign 17 year old artist, and bear in mind that he has to know everything about contracts and shit, u r playing it VERY UGLY. Because the least u can do as a label, who basically has to do very little to release a CD ( at least in comparison to the artist's work ) is to explain this 17 year old what exclusive is.
I don't like sharks
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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Yuli
Retired
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1660
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 13:45
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Oops forgot
About admin..
Tal, actually I had part of these rights in the past and preferred not to get into the shit since I wasn't sure I can swim it... And I dont regret it since... But I do say my thing when I feel the time is right.
And the time was right
BTW.. to be perfectly honest >
Guys, there are good ppl out there that run labels not out of greed, but out of love for good sounds and for the sake of our scene. Dig them out
A man with a "master plan" is often a woman |
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nobody4
Inactive User
Started Topics :
21
Posts :
358
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 13:48
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Yaniv, maybe my choice of words was incorrect, I didnt mean to say you are bitter, only that the tone of the post sounded a like someone who's been hurt, and I can understand that.
We do try to give as much information to the artists working with us, and as you can see, I also added some information (that wasn't covered in your post).
The irritating thing is that many artists are posting their complaints in this forum, and after 2 days if appears that there was no true claim, either misunderstanding that could be solved between the artist and the label, or simple slander.
Again, I posted my first reply as a genuine effort to add to your post, I guess the second post's phrasing was a bit wrong, and for that I apoligise.
best regards,
A
auspexx@compact-records.com |
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Toxical(rotem)
Toxical
Started Topics :
24
Posts :
448
Posted : Oct 9, 2003 14:23
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DJ Hoffman
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
104
Posted : Oct 10, 2003 07:27
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this are very bad but real facts im also producing music and wouldnt like some label to lie to me or cheat on me :'( that is really disapointing :S is true what u say about knowing what u sign or even get a consultant... any way many artist say they dont really make a lot of money selling tracks, they make money of playing at parties.... i dont know if this really true and i guess its similar because there are a lot of liers and cheaters party organizers
it is a shame that some people just care about the money and dont give a fuck about the music |
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