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The Mother Of All Studio Monitor Threads
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Kane
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
1772
Posted : Dec 10, 2008 22:29
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Ascension, have you tried using alternate power sources and made sure that it isn't an interconnect problem? I used a pair for a little while and never had problems, but I've heard a lot of people complaining about the hiss.
Either way, PsyTiax, they are very decent for the price.
  You believe in the users?
Yeah, sure. If I don't have a user, then who wrote me? |
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Ascension
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
170
Posts :
3642
Posted : Dec 10, 2008 23:20
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Yeah I've hooked them up to a different power strip and audio input and it was still there. Some people say it just IS there. I got them for so cheap and I can't afford to buy anything better since it'd be such an increase in price so I'm gonna stick with em.
http://soundcloud.com/ascensionsound
www.chilluminati.org - Midwest based psytrance group |
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naga
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
204
Posted : Dec 25, 2008 13:22
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A little christmas tip here to setup your monitors 
1.check your monitor's Acoustic Axis
if cannot find it for "non-pro" monitors use genelec's page as a reference http://www.genelec.fi/ht/documents/other/acousticaxis_CI_FI.pdf
2.put monitor on sideways that their bass elements are within and highs out.
3.take measuring tape or some kind of cable and place monitors as apart as far you (equal triangle). acoustic axis and your head as spots.
4.take a little mirror, tape it to your monitors acoustic axis and sit you listening position.
5.turn your monitors that your can see your ears from mirrors and you're finish
6.open your sequencer, play acoustic drum kit, add wizooverb's hall emulator and find yourself listening drummer at the hall 
if sounds are too bass boost, middle boost, high boost replace your monitors and listening positions between the lenght of your room. try your monitors even 45cm offset from you if room doens't have an acoustic =)
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Kane
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
1772
Posted : Dec 25, 2008 18:00
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Quote:
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On 2008-12-25 13:22, naga wrote:
2.put monitor on sideways that their bass elements are within and highs out.
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I still don't understand why people do this. If the monitor is designed with that orientation in mind (center channel MTM arrays, etc.), then that's a different story, but based on my own tests and other articles I've read, most monitors, when horizontally oriented, exhibit a 25-40% increase in average frequency deviation than an identical vertically oriented monitor. Imo this isn't worth better imaging, and I usually don't like how it changes the imaging anyway..
Bottom line: Read the manual. If the manufacturer suggests a certain placement, there's a very good reason for it. If not, or if their suggested setup doesn't sound right, trust your ears and adjust accordingly.
You believe in the users?
Yeah, sure. If I don't have a user, then who wrote me? |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 20:08
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My vote goes for Genelec 8040!
gonna go listen to some Adams some day but i must say that genelec totally did it for me.. they are analytic and shows you were its wrong...
many studio monitors are too Hifi!
my advice for you who is going to go listen to some monitors is to take a track were there are some frequency clashes and other problems... if the speakers reveals this then its a good thing..
For example i tried a pair of Event Studio Precision 8 and compared them to a pair of Genelec 8040 with a track im working on, in one section of this track there is a frequency clash between kick and a lead sound,
this did not show very good in the events, i didnt hear it at all.. but the very first time i heard it in the genelecs, and second time and third time..
So my vote for the Finish Genelec!! but they are very expensive so now its time to work hard for some cash...
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 00:42
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I just bought a pair of Alesis Monitor One's (the first version) for a very good price. I'm planning to get a proper amp for it but at the moment all I have is an old TEAC amp from a stereo system. The monitors are rated at 4 ohms and the amp anywhere from 8-16 ohms. It also puts out 45w per channel while the speakers are capable of 200w.
From my understanding by using these monitors with that amp, I run the risk of damaging the amp because of the impedance mismatch, correct?
If the above is true though, I'm not so concerned with blowing this old ass amp so I'm really more worried about speaker damage.
Can I damage the speakers by connecting it to the 8 oh amp or if it doesn't put out at least 200w per channel?
If I run no risk of ruining the speakers, I'd like to use the amp temporarily (at low volumes)since it feels like a crime to have these sitting here and not use them.
Thanks |
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 02:23
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I should also add...what should I be looking for as far as a better amp? I know it's best to get something that pumps out more than the speakers are rated at for headroom but wouldn't an amp that pumps out 200w per channel be expensive? (not to mention overkill since I'm doing my work in a fairly small room)
Also, will any good amplifier work, or do I need something that's made for powering monitors?
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Trip-
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
3239
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 14:40
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45w @8ohm usually means half of the power @4ohm.
So you're basicly going to give ~20w per speaker, which is hardly going to drive the speaker. I will suggest on getting a fitting amplifier. You are not going to damage the speakers with the current amp.
"expensive" is a relative term.
Powerful, acurate, clean amps cost money.
You don't want the amp to start 'dying' just to drive your speakers correctly - usually you will work with regular volumes to hear everything you need, to give the speakers to reproduce that.
Any good amp is good for monitoring speakers as well as any other speakers.
Crackling universes dive into their own neverending crackle...
AgalactiA |
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Kane
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
1772
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 16:25
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Trip, you have it backwards. It would be more like 60 watts per channel into 4 ohms if you're going to put it that way.
Understand that the specifications from Alesis are what the speakers can handle, not necessarily what they need. They also probably aren't completely accurate or relevant when it comes to impedance, since they're only giving you a nominal value and actual dc resistance within the passband generally isn't considered.
Also keep in mind that an amp doesn't output watts, it outputs volts. Wattage has more to do with efficiency than the actual power going to the speakers.
The concept of overpowering speakers is often misunderstood, and for studio use you probably don't need anything more than 100w/channel at 4 ohms. The most important thing is to be able to power the speakers to a decent mixing level without overworking the amp, and to reproduce the sound as transparently as possible.
You should look for one without a fan, but properly heatsinked. For those speakers I think an Alesis RA300 would be a good place to start.
You believe in the users?
Yeah, sure. If I don't have a user, then who wrote me? |
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Trip-
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
3239
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 18:10
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Thanks Kane - I did get it backwards... am I getting rusty? ;/
"The most important thing is to be able to power the speakers to a decent mixing level without overworking the amp" -- maintain maximum efficiency.
Crackling universes dive into their own neverending crackle...
AgalactiA |
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Jan 21, 2009 20:17
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Great! Thanks a lot for the help, it's much appreciated. |
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Feb 1, 2009 21:11
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So I picked up an Alesis RA100 for the speakers and was finally able to push them really loud...and then I noticed a loud click in the right speaker! Nothing's clipping, I'm sure of that and it's definitely just coming out of the right one. When I play a sine sweep from 30-300hz it starts buzzing really loud like it's about to die at around halfway so I'm guessing from about 100-200hz or so. I've run sweaps through the other frequencies too and that seems to be the only range that causes the sound.
I also noticed that if I hold the monitor with my hands in the air the buzzing sound goes away for most of that range except the higher end of it.
Is the speaker totally screwed or is this something I could fix?
Thanks |
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Feb 1, 2009 23:34
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Did a few more tests...by placing the monitor horizontally the buzz during the sine test and the click heard when I play back a kick stop at the same volume.
If I turn the volume up enough, eventually the click comes back and a less obvious buzz. I tested this by loading up a kick sample and cutting out all the frequencies except the ones that made the click (from about 130-200. I could push it louder when it's horizontal but it eventually starts clicking again.
I'm guessing that this means something is loose in the enclosure and nothing's actually wrong with the speaker itself? Either way I think I'm SOL as I don't see a way to get inside the enclosure. 
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Kane
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
23
Posts :
1772
Posted : Feb 2, 2009 00:42
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If you hold the monitor in the air and it goes away, it's probably just vibrating against whatever you have it sitting on. Try putting them on something soft, just to test it. I don't know if the mk1's are ported or not, but it sounds like it could just be port noise too. Is the clicking constant or did it just happen once?
As far as getting inside the enclosure, you should be able to take out one of the drivers (preferably the woofer) or the binding post plate (not sure about this, since I haven't seen the back of a mk1). You should obviously try to eliminate some possibilities before you open them up, though.
You believe in the users?
Yeah, sure. If I don't have a user, then who wrote me? |
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roigt0r
Started Topics :
2
Posts :
83
Posted : Feb 2, 2009 01:25
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Hey, thanks for the reply.
I'm sure it's not the desk or anything on it vibrating because it does the same thing when I place it on my floor, a chair, etc, and the noise is the exact same every time. It's a steady, loud buzzing/rattling thats there for as long as the problem frequencies are played. (no cut outs or anything) It's also constant, it doesn't go away, and seems to be clearly emanating from the speaker. I also tried putting it where the left monitor was (which doesn't make any kind of rattling/clicking) and it still does it.
I was also a bit wrong about holding it in the air to stop the sound...it DOES stop it, but only until I crank the volume a bit more.
By placing the monitor horizontally (which alesis recommends anyway in the manual) I'm able to go louder before the sound starts (even louder than when I held the damn thing in the air!). At this point they're definitely loud enough to be usable for mixing and okay for decent music listening (but not nearly as loud as I'd like of course) so at least I have that going for me.
I could take off the binding post plate on the back, but the opening would be awfully small...not sure what I could do from there? If you have any suggestions I'm all for trying them!
Also, there's no screws around the woofer driver, just the driver and a round rubber ring around it that's flush with the front of the monitor.
You think it would be possible to pry that out without damaging the driver?
There's screws around the tweeter so I could probably get that out, but then i'm in the same conundrum as with removing the back plate...can I really do anything with such a small opening?
I should also add I'm being careful not to have anything clipping. I have the knob at about 2 o'clock before it clicks when the monitor is on its side (starts at 12 o'clock vertically)...I can push it to nearly 4 o'clock before the clip light starts flashing.
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