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Kick pitch problem
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 17:46:45
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As we all know the kick in psytrance is made of a sine wave that is pitch bent, but the kick and bass have to be in a certain key to sound really musical.I make my kicks with bazzISM2 which is a really good plugin creating your own kicks.I used to set the lowest peak a few Hz lower than the desired note and the highest peak to the desired note between roughly 2kHz and 5kHz.Then I set the tEnd parameter to about more than half of the time of the entire kick sound in milliseconds(so if i want my kick to be 120ms I set it to about 60ms) because that is the slider that sets, for how long the lowest part of the sound is going to last(approximately).Then tSweep to the degree until I get a sample that is 120ms long, and finally vSweep to taste.Once I got the kick sounding right to my ears i consider the kick finished,BUT here comes my problem.I checked my latest kick sound with a pitch shifter/pitch correction plugin and it didn't seem to be in the desired key.My question would be is there any reliable pitch plugin according to what I can make my kicks(the problem may be that this plugin is not good enough to catch the note in a sample as fast as a kick)?
Or is there any method that is so reliable that I can ignore what these pitch plugins show? |
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Xsze
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
657
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 17:51
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Voxengo SPAN, "high res" mode, hoover over highest peak and read the corresponding note, I tried many visual things and this turned out to be most reliable one.
http://www.voxengo.com/product/span/
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 17:58
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Thanks for the fast answer mate.I use SPAN and check my peaks every time, but considering that time is passing the highest peak starts the sample and it doesn't necessarily mean that the sample as a whole is in the desired key, so lowest and highest peaks are what I want them to be but the entire kick isn't(according to one of my pitch shifter/correction plugins) |
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 18:04
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Quote:
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On 2014-12-23 17:51, Xsze wrote:
Voxengo SPAN, "high res" mode, hoover over highest peak and read the corresponding note, I tried many visual things and this turned out to be most reliable one.
http://www.voxengo.com/product/span/
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Still, how can I set to "high res mode?" |
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Xsze
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
657
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 19:13
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Quote:
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Still, how can I set to "high res mode?"
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You will see "Default" right next to "Mode", click on it.
Key of kick is in low end bump/highest peak, that is crucial/relevant and should be in tune, for me everything else is in ears/how does it actually sound (even before that was too), if you want to get everything else, than just cut it up and analyze every bit.
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 19:25
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Maybe it's just me, I used to complicate things xP
Thanks for your help bro  |
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supergroover
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
1505
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 19:29
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if you have a sample it is easier for many programs to detect the pitch if the pitch is higher. So increase the pitch an octave of your sample to check it.
 soundcloud.com/supergroover |
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Xsze
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
657
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 19:33
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^ +1
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On 2014-12-23 19:25, Wize-art wrote:
Maybe it's just me, I used to complicate things xP
Thanks for your help bro
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Same here, but trust your ears more, if it sounds good, it's good, even if it's out of tune
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Dec 23, 2014 20:55
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Easy, from manual:
"fEnd:
The end (lowest) frequency, will also be played out while the time tEnd. For C-2 to F1 BazzISM will play the Midi pitch instead of fEnd."
Self explanatory.... Then:
"A click on the fEnd note symbol opens the note menu to tune your kick sound (...)."
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 10:39
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Quote:
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On 2014-12-23 20:55, frisbeehead wrote:
Easy, from manual:
"fEnd:
The end (lowest) frequency, will also be played out while the time tEnd. For C-2 to F1 BazzISM will play the Midi pitch instead of fEnd."
Self explanatory.... Then:
"A click on the fEnd note symbol opens the note menu to tune your kick sound (...)."
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with fEnd note symbol you can only set the note of the lowest peak of your kick, still you must write a midi note that makes the pitch of your sample totally different.
So if I write the midi note between c2 and f1 to the desired note, it is going to be that note no matter what fEnd is?
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Xsze
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
657
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 11:09
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woodster77
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
119
Posts :
1733
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 13:29
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stick a distortion on it to find the pitch
°°°ACTS 4:12°°°° |
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Wize-art
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
7
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 16:40
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Quote:
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On 2014-12-24 11:09, Xsze wrote:
That's lowest frequency, not lowest peak, and that frequency is the key of your kick drum and AFAIK no matter where you put the note in piano roll, it will sound the same.
http://liutaiomottola.com/formulae/freqtab.htm
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I don't know about your daw, personally i use logic and it does matter in what key you write your kick in piano roll.Some octaves seem to show the same pitch, but from f-1 to f1 there is pitch shift. |
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knocz
Moderator
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1151
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 17:01
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Its still extremely difficult for computers to understand concepts such as "pitch" and, even if there are utilities that can really minimize all false positives, there's nothing like a human ear.
I understand your point and where you wanna go - you want to make it all sound perfect together. But no data or info a computer screen can give you that's better than how it actually sounds, so forget all else and tell us: does it sound good?
If so, let it be.
If not, change it so it sounds good.
A kick is a kick; a bass is a bass. There's no magic numbers or specific things.. the only thing that matters is how it sounds, nothing more (which means you can really have your kick completely out of tune, but if you make it sound good, then who cares?)
Super Banana Sauce http://www.soundcloud.com/knocz |
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frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
10
Posts :
1352
Posted : Dec 24, 2014 20:14
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Avoid choosing a note between C2 to F1, otherwise fEnd value is replaced by the pitch of the note on the piano roll.
For any other note, then the pitch will be the one set by fEnd value - since it's even got a note picker in there, think it's a real no brainer...
The thing is the sweep should be fast enough to give this pitch some time, so that it blends well with the bass.
This is the most important part to get right, btw. The other value is similar to "pitch env amount" on a regular synth, only it lets you choose a frequency (in HZ). No problem choosing same note some octaves higher, but it's not really necessary. Just follow your ears, choose what sounds good.
There's another option in there that can be easily overlocked: "midi stop"! If you tick this box, then the kick will stop exactly where your midi note stops, regardless of the value you set for it - which of course can be something like (60/bpm/4=1/16th - value in secs.). |
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