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Hate this its not true!!!
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Goblim
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 26, 2004 17:57
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Trance is still relatively new, many people don't know about it and are afraid of new things. So they have to blame it in some way.
Of course it varies in different countries, but I think this is the problem...
Maybe in 10 years trance will not be stigmatised anymore but then it's probably some other music that is.
It's sad that many people can't be more open minded.
  Ut ameris, amabilis esto. |
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nobody_3
Inactive User
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Posted : Feb 26, 2004 18:11
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On 2004-02-26 17:57, Goblim wrote:
Trance is still relatively new, many people don't know about it and are afraid of new things. So they have to blame it in some way.
Of course it varies in different countries, but I think this is the problem...
Maybe in 10 years trance will not be stigmatised anymore but then it's probably some other music that is.
It's sad that many people can't be more open minded.
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Around 12 years is not really relatively new 
I have heard this debate so many times the last 10 years and people complaining about the Press painting a wrong picture about the psy/goa scene (eventhough they in many cases just quoted the artists/Dj's and people on the dancefloor being interviewed) and how it's always the "other's" fault because they afraid of something new and dont understand us. To me it's just to push things under the carpet and refuse to aknowledge that we have a image problem
If it's ever going to change we have to change NOT our souroundings. We have to start realising that some of the accusations quite frankly are absolutely right and that we have to deal with them to change the way the major part of Society look at us. Of course we can also just ignore it but then we have to stop all the complaning and accept that people, the Press and the Authorities wont always agree with what we do.
It's all up to us and maybe we also need to be more openminded |
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Goblim
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 26, 2004 18:15
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Quote:
| On 2004-02-26 18:11, Elysium Project wrote:
Around 12 years is not really relatively new
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Of course not. I meant that it's still new to the public.
Ut ameris, amabilis esto. |
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nobody_3
Inactive User
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Posted : Feb 26, 2004 18:23
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I'll give you a perfect example why so many people here in Denmark see our scene as a drug heaven.
A few years a go there was a TV documentary about our scene where people freely and willingly (they did not even get paid) said yes to be filmed in their own homes doing drugs (heavy and many drugs) before going to parties.... They praised the drugs in interviews and painted a picture that everybody was a druggie in our scene. They said that all their friends did drugs and that it was very cool. Thats just one TV program that for sure did nothing good a part from proving what people already thought. That our scene is full of druggies. No matter what the truth is this is the picture people get when we are so stupid to show ourselves this way.
We have no one to blame but ourselves.
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nova
IsraTrance Junior Member
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16
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556
Posted : Feb 26, 2004 19:32
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On 2004-02-26 15:53, Elysium Project wrote:
Sorry to burst your bubble  but in my experience the majority or at least a very high percentage of people going to the parties go because of the drugs. Unfortinently the music comes second to a lot of people.
And I am not surpriced that people think the trance scene is made up by a bunch of drugheads... It's our own fault. We have for too long promoted our scene as the Drug Heaven and praised drugs as our "God".
Maybe if we started to tone the drug use/abuse down and concentrated more on the music (which it should be all about) then there's a chance that Media's and "normal" people and for that matter Authorities and Gouvernments will look at us differently. But it's 100% sure that it does not help when major drughead artists and label managers (I wont mention any names - you know who they are) promote drugs so openly on CD covers and in every single interview they make. The only result they create is that Authorities and "ordinary" people then say that they were right from teh start about the scene and another result is that newcommers get exposed to Black & White one sided opinion about drugs and NOT the downside of drug use/abuse.
But of course this is just my opinion and experience. there's many views in our scene about how things shoudl be.
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whats the point about blaming ourselfs?
parties are parties, and drugs are drugs.
parties are not ment for people to do drugs, its the people who do drugs at parties and liked the idea in it.
and if you dont know and im sure you do... ppl do drugs anywhere and anytime!
there are drugs in schools... drugs in the army... this world fulls with it.
so taking one item... "trance parties"... and make it for years the sorce for the drugs problem make since?
i know ppl who dont do drugs and partieng for years, and i also know ppl who do drugs and going to parties for years.... so what? is it because of them or what they use that makes me wanna come?
if it is then im sorry to tell you but your music like every other artist here worths nothing.
all those topics of "what trance makes you feel?" worths nothing right? its not the trance, its the drugs right? come'on...
those ppl who thinks like that are called "shimonim" and not trancers!
its not that im not realistic and as i wrote in my last post there are drugs in parties (so dont feel so bad about brusting me any bubbles )
but when an antropologist comes and calling himself a "trance parties antropologist" and talking about only drugs, and only how you can get them easely in parties (btw, its much more easier to find them across the street) is making this scene a bad name!
more then that, this man putting lots of hard time in this scene, going to lots of parties, he must love it if he put so much time in it right?
and he just gave it a concept of a drug culture.
this is not helping cause i expected from such expirience to show all the sides of it (+ the drugs).
you take an item and you related it something that ppl can based on it.
you take trance parties, and related it to drugs... so why not doing it anyway if thats how ppl introduce it?
now, like u said, if ppl stop introducing it like that the problem will solve.
some ppl are doing drugs at parties, and some arent... they can do what they wanna, i dont mind. but calling this a "drug culture" is wrong and silly, specialy for ppl who make a living from this scene.
and the show you mentioned was about ppl who like drugs, i can make a wonderful movie about ppl doing drugs befor an Hip Hop party.
this issue had been discussed befor and i usualy dont like to talk about it cause nothings gonna change anyway but hey... its just my opinion.
just flow baby... just flow... |
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ZeRo
IsraTrance Junior Member
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802
Posted : Feb 26, 2004 21:04
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i like trance music and i like trance parties and i like movies and i like baseball. Ive done all of these things both sober and on drugs.
the reason ppl associate trance with drugs is because the music itself is psychoactive. the music is a drug.
i think a better question to ask is WHY are people so afraid of drugs, trance, and especially drugs + trance?
ein chadash tachat hashemesh. there is nothing new under the sun. --kohelet. |
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technoid
Started Topics :
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230
Posted : Feb 26, 2004 21:48
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I think that's a really pertinant question, Zero.
Drugs are an integral part of the party scene, there is no getting away from it. Of course not everyone does them, but good quality drugs going round a party can make the difference between an OK party and a really good party. I can't understand how anyone can fail to see this.
It is frustrating when trance is written off as just drug music because there's obviously far more to it than that, but perhaps not to the untrained ear. I don't think trance does itself any favours though with artists like 1200 mics naming a whole album's worth of tracks after drugs, and the amount of tracks that contain samples about how great drugs are.
Trance music does mix well with drugs. It's nice to do drugs at parties. What's the problem with that? Drugs and psychedelia have always gone hand in hand. Psychedelic music was invented by people playing rock n'roll the way it sounded to them while tripping on mescaline and LSD and smoking marijuana.
Unfortunately the drugs are more important to some people than the music or the experience at parties. Hopefully this will change in time for some of them as they grow up and they'll develop a genuine love for the music and the culture.
I am sad that anyone who has spent 5 years going to parties can have such a narrow view of such a huge, mixed and vibrant culture. He's not much of an anthropologist. To write it off as a 'drug culture' is so lazy.
And is anyone else thankful that the drugs people tend to do at trance parties are LSD, E and Marijuana rather than Cocaine, Crack and Ketamine?
"One nation under a groove". |
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sea of life
Started Topics :
1
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32
Posted : Feb 26, 2004 23:37
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On 2004-02-25 21:38, psychologic wrote:
why everybody think that who like trance and like to go to trance party his use in drugs?
why??????? 
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well like ppl here sayed its not only in trance parties..its in every kinda party.
and im sorry but even now when i almost dont do any drug i still wanna do it when i hear some trance tunes. i think very small precentage of ppl relates to trance NEVER touched drugs.
but again its everywhere not only in trance parties.
now i can go back to my joint.
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spliffnik
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 27, 2004 10:35
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Before I give my two bits I just want to comment on this quote-
the trance scene is 12 years old= not relatively new.
??????
Relative = compared to other things, in this case other genres of music. (Classical, Jazz, etc)
So I would say this electronic version of trance music is like an infant. It is still figuring itself out, who the hell knows how it will become in 50 years, if it is still around then..
Just thought that was intriguing that some people thought of trance as an old genre of music..LOL
Now that that has been said, I will begin..
To people not liking Trance being connected to drugs... you couldn't be more misguided!
It is called 'Psychedelic' trance, which call me crazy but sure does remind me of drugs! And the spiritual experience of trance dancing and entering altered states of consciousness is also related to the use of drugs- and this has been so for hundreds, if not thousands of years. Indigenous tribes who trance dance to repetitive drumming sounds have also been known to use mind altering substances to enhance their experience. Neurologists have observed that this type of a trance experience triggers the brain to releace chemical compounds very similar to LSD. SO of course this music is going to be linked with drug culture!!! The very music itself induces a psychedelic experience! This is only natural folks!
The problem here is not trance being linked to drugs. Trance being related to drugs is a matter of fact. The problem is how in our society today which is dominated by powerful tobacco and alcohol lobbies and God knows who else have chosen to cast a negative light on drug use. Our society condemns the use of drugs, and this is why you guys here are talking about this 'problem' of trance and drugs. If drugs were legal and completely tolerated, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
So stop worrying about what other ppl think! Just enjoy it for yourself and get out of it what you seek. Have fun, and fuck what other people think about it. But it is illegal, so please everyone be careful! Although we may be free to choose our path we cannot forget that we live in this world which does not tolerate the use of drugs. Jail is not a nice place to go!
I personally don't think all drugs should be legal (crack and methamphetamines, to name a few, are highly addictive substances that bring out the evil in humans), but I also think that the current approach of ''all drugs are bad'' may be convenient but misguided. Medical marijuana, which has a variety of uses, is one example of how this overly simplified approach is flawed, and needs to be changed.
This is just my two bits. People noticing the link between trance and drugs is inevitable, and if drugs are to remain illegal it is also unavoidable that it is going to get a negative reputation by some. But it is still wonderful, and other people opinions will not disconnect us from something we have found to be deeply meaningful to our lives.
This post is for the people who love the music and the message it emodies - keep dancing!!!
Love and Light,
spliffnik |
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ChoBo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
50
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536
Posted : Feb 27, 2004 16:35
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just enjoy like what spliff said 
But never let them listen 1200mics / 1200 mics album! you will get into trouble  It has all the drug names hehehehe  |
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TiMMY
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 28, 2004 13:10
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Nobody has ever done a complete survey checking how much percent of trance ravers are using drugs, therefore all opinions relating to this subject are just opinions, nothing more than that.
It's all a matter of how an individual perceive it - if you come to a party to listen to music and dance, you'd probably see the whole thing that way (because that's your ideal).
This also goes the other way around - if you come to a party to take drugs (or you're a pessimist  ) you'll see it that way, becuase it's much more easy that other people can't enjoy the music differently (without the use of drugs).
Some people like to think that these are drugs parties because it's "cooler".
All of this doesn't really matter. What does matter is how do you see your party experience. You can't possibly be sure if a person is on drugs or not (I got asked lots of times what did I take, while I was completely clean).
You can either look at a party as a special gathering of close friends with mother nature, with good music or as a drug heaven. It's all in the eye of the beholder.
And I've had that anthropologist too, on 8th grade.
His name is Tamir if I'm not mistaken. His lecture was indeed very nice, and it seemed like most of the time he was talking to us "at eye level". But, we have to remember that the schools that invite him over are not interested in trance music whatsoever, they're only interested in drugs (or have the students not take drugs for that matter). If he won't talk about drugs and how bad they are, he simply won't be invited (and won't be paid either, another thing to remember). |
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Nomolos(Zenon Rec.)
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Feb 28, 2004 13:57
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karnaf
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 28, 2004 14:04
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I believe that ppl think that any electronic music is related to drugs, not just trance. for a lot of ppl this is the actual truth, unfortunately.
I've just read the "DJ Ha'Ir" magazine which is distributed to all ppl who buy the local newspaper, not sold seperately. This means that this paper goes to families, kids, adults, whoever feels like reading it. Most of the articles in it that refer to parties, also refer to drugs, quite explicitly. Examples:
1. "... a little girl from haifa with bad hash", "... she gave me something terrible to smoke..."
2. "... two 25 yrs old guys splitting some more acid among them..." "... I assume it's the 'eagle' kind, cause that's all there is out there in the past year..."
3. "... You can lean against the wall when the ecstasy doesn't go up..."
4. "... he tells me he has new pills from England, purple ones, half a pill is like two regular..."
and I can give you so many more of those examples...
Now, assume someone is interested in reading that magazine to see what's the night life in Israel is like, wouldn't he get the impression that it's all a one big drug festival???
Please REMOVE my cellphone number from any SMS spam list you may have. Thanks.
http://www.savetherhino.org |
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nobody_3
Inactive User
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Posted : Feb 28, 2004 14:10
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On 2004-02-28 13:10, TiMMY wrote:
Nobody has ever done a complete survey checking how much percent of trance ravers are using drugs, therefore all opinions relating to this subject are just opinions, nothing more than that.
It's all a matter of how an individual perceive it - if you come to a party to listen to music and dance, you'd probably see the whole thing that way (because that's your ideal).
This also goes the other way around - if you come to a party to take drugs (or you're a pessimist ) you'll see it that way, becuase it's much more easy that other people can't enjoy the music differently (without the use of drugs).
Some people like to think that these are drugs parties because it's "cooler".
All of this doesn't really matter. What does matter is how do you see your party experience. You can't possibly be sure if a person is on drugs or not (I got asked lots of times what did I take, while I was completely clean).
You can either look at a party as a special gathering of close friends with mother nature, with good music or as a drug heaven. It's all in the eye of the beholder.
And I've had that anthropologist too, on 8th grade.
His name is Tamir if I'm not mistaken. His lecture was indeed very nice, and it seemed like most of the time he was talking to us "at eye level". But, we have to remember that the schools that invite him over are not interested in trance music whatsoever, they're only interested in drugs (or have the students not take drugs for that matter). If he won't talk about drugs and how bad they are, he simply won't be invited (and won't be paid either, another thing to remember).
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It's not really about how many people are on drugs or as someone else suggested that everybody else in other scenes take drugs too. It's about how we present ourselves to the world. Do we really want to have a image that show that we are a bunch of junkies? That's the essense of it all!
Yes the music is psychedelic but that does not mean that we have to promote drugs as if we were dealers out to get new customers. It all start with ourselves and if we can change our image as a bunch of freaked out druggies then we have won quite a deal
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nova
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Feb 28, 2004 15:35
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well Timmy, im glad you know which guy im talking about.
i want to tell that i saw this guy lecture to perents and it was a whole different then what he says to teens.
in other words he said "this is what your kids doing at parties" and explaned about all the drugs.
now, i dont think that this is how "we" are introducing ourselfes cause until now i see that "we" are talking about how to make a better image for trance while ppl like this Anthropologist and exsamples from magazins like Karnaf just gave are ruin it.
those both (the anthropologist and magazins) are introducing parties as drug sorces... only the anthro' says to stay away from them and the magazins in order to be more attractive but they both put the same tag (drugs) on the same item (parties)
so... who are "we" between those groups?
just flow baby... just flow... |
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