Aluxe
IsraTrance Junior Member
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725
Posted : Jun 9, 2008 10:59
You can define everything as “chaos” if you want, however it doesn’t take away choice. You have the choice to either take a shit on your plate where you eat or you can choose to instead go to the toilet where you can flush it away. It’s the same thing for earth, you can either trash it or take care of it. Chaos theory seems irrelevant. And lets be honest, when you talk about chaos and the universe, honestly what do you really know about it? NOTHING. So don’t use that to justify your denial of the fact that you make choices everyday. Chaos my ass. Look, just like you take care of yourself or your home you also have to take care of your extended body and home which is the earth. You say earth is going to take care of you, but on some level you are the earth and just like the trees do their part you also have to do your part as a human which includes choices, and the ability to be aware of certain things.
You ask why you should spoil your time worrying about calamity. Tell me, why then should someone worry about swimming with sharks? Isn’t it obvious? Ofcourse, if you stay away from shark infested waters, you will probably not worry. That is the whole point, it’s all about choices. About choosing certain actions so we don’t worry. I bet you will be worried if you suddenly do not have to eat. Why? because its uncomfortable, because suffering sucks. Even if you accept it as some other level. Like go smash your finger with a hammer and see how much you like it.
So please, let’s not be hyprocrites here and pretend we do not really worry, because we make choices everyday. Even the yogis that leave everything, make a choice. Maybe a counsciuos one for a more enlightened state of being.
Xolvexs
IsraTrance Senior Member
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Posted : Jun 9, 2008 13:58
you make choices on what you know...but there are things you do not of choice, but of necessasity...ocelot, yeh i know what you guys point of view, i have been there...i heard a lot of people talk talk and then really did some searching elsewhere and found that there is good opportunity in crisis...i like nature...i believe in its power..to destroy, create and heal. the problem is with the way its done...its become very fanatical and become an issue of national and international and now global concern...there is a system in which its being used to scare the hell out of the world, i enjoy to be in a state of paranoia...i think its better than love...i crack up when i see little kids talking about the world collapsing and ordering their parents to turn off the lights....they are already paranoid...fear paranoia and guilt the three factors of human control...its been there for centuries...its the same now...get them scared get them paranoid, make them feel guilty, punish them, sell them hope, give them hope get them involved...the cause maybe different but the structure is the same, remove the content of environnment and put anything else and the structure is still the same.
people spending is bad, people not spending is worse and people that do drugs are junkies...and so on...i think humans can easily go beyond this but they are scared of being alone...its the lonliness that makes their spine shiver...being alone in a dark place with blood dripping from a ceiling and a head hanging on the faucet screaming shit at you...death is alternative reality...btw i am very cheerd...i like the dark and negative out of choice, too much positive will do nothing, you need negative too...negative is like the live wire it just sparks you, positive is like opium feel good...
When death comes to your doorstep, make sure you are alive
Aluxe
IsraTrance Junior Member
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25
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725
Posted : Jun 10, 2008 09:04
DoughCherry, I agree that the system makes sheep out of everyone through fear. Of course our goverments are not to trust.
However the system hasn’t really being trying to scare us about the environment, quite the contratry. They have been for a long time undermining the issue and protecting the interests of corporations who are destroying the environment. So you have your story a bit messed up there. Now the environmental problems are so out of control and so OBVIOUS to everyone that our governments at least have to admit that there is a problem, however their agenda is all about protecting the interests of corporations, not the environment. Make sense? So they will plant a few trees on TV, and talk about protecting the environment, all while behind closed doors they close a deal with some corporation to destroy the Amazon rainforests (or whatever)
But the problem is real. You do not need to turn on the TV to be informed or misinformed about this. You can see the problem with your own eyes: The polluted rivers, polluted air, poverty, deforestation, etc, etc, etc.
And dude all that shit about you liking the negativity out of choice, like come on dude.
You couldn’t even take the heat when Ocelot got on your case and you ended up calling him a failed artist “for life”, like a sore puppy. Hehe, honestly who are we kidding man?
I don’t want to offend you, but let’s not pretend you enjoy the shit hitting you on the face.
Oh I am sure you love negativity, but at a distance, just as long as it is not actually really hurting YOU. Because then your pose falls and you quickly realize how human you really are. It’s easy to talk while you are within your comfort zone, then you can pretend to like eating shit and suffering pain, but as you cross the thin line beyond which you really can’t fake, your fasade falls. So please let’s not be hypocrites and pretend you actually like pain and suffering, you know that at a very basic level its obviously BS.
Let me put all this in another way. Let’s say you go to a party where everyone is dancing trying to create some good energy and you come and dump your trash on the dance floor spreading broken glass and garbage all over the place. Would you ever do that? Would you? I am assuming you wouldn’t (but please correct me if I am wrong).
Well just expand that idea of basic respect on the dance floor to respecting the whole community, the whole earth. You got to be aware of how your actions, what you consume and how you choose to live affects everyone else. Otherwise just like trashing the dance floor you trash the earth affecting many people. Its just selfish and if you would not do it on the dance floor then don't do it elsewhere. It’s the same principle of being aware of your surrounding and how you affect everyone else. You can’t escape it, you are in the boat along with everyone else. So how about some unity? Nobody wants your trash on their backyard, I am sure you feel the same way. Its a very basic idea of respect.
I am sorry about calling you a sore puppy btw. I was tryng to illustrate a point. And you are totally right that the enviromental problems are not the only problems the planet is facing, but the solution I think is the same. We have to disolve the illusion that we are different groups, families and individuals all competing against eachother.
We have to think about it like we are all one. Its a hard concept to accept, but it seems to be the reality. The energy comming from you affects me, affects everyone. Its like your legs and your arms and your head. They all belong to the same body. So if your leg is ill, the rest of the body will also be ill.
SO what we need is some deeper understandin of this unity which we can deny but can not escape.
Then we will be able to tune in to a better frequency where we love eachother more.
Check it out, he has the right vibe here:
Yeah man, I respect you. You are part of the groove..
ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Jun 10, 2008 14:22
Quote:
On 2008-06-10 09:04, Aluxe wrote:
DoughCherry, I agree that the system makes sheep out of everyone through fear. Of course our goverments are not to trust.
However the system hasn’t really being trying to scare us about the environment, quite the contratry. They have been for a long time undermining the issue and protecting the interests of corporations who are destroying the environment. So you have your story a bit messed up there. Now the environmental problems are so out of control and so OBVIOUS to everyone that our governments at least have to admit that there is a problem, however their agenda is all about protecting the interests of corporations, not the environment. Make sense? So they will plant a few trees on TV, and talk about protecting the environment, all while behind closed doors they close a deal with some corporation to destroy the Amazon rainforests (or whatever)
But the problem is real. You do not need to turn on the TV to be informed or misinformed about this. You can see the problem with your own eyes: The polluted rivers, polluted air, poverty, deforestation, etc, etc, etc.
And dude all that shit about you liking the negativity out of choice, like come on dude.
You couldn’t even take the heat when Ocelot got on your case and you ended up calling him a failed artist “for life”, like a sore puppy. Hehe, honestly who are we kidding man?
I don’t want to offend you, but let’s not pretend you enjoy the shit hitting you on the face.
Oh I am sure you love negativity, but at a distance, just as long as it is not actually really hurting YOU. Because then your pose falls and you quickly realize how human you really are. It’s easy to talk while you are within your comfort zone, then you can pretend to like eating shit and suffering pain, but as you cross the thin line beyond which you really can’t fake, your fasade falls. So please let’s not be hypocrites and pretend you actually like pain and suffering, you know that at a very basic level its obviously BS.
Let me put all this in another way. Let’s say you go to a party where everyone is dancing trying to create some good energy and you come and dump your trash on the dance floor spreading broken glass and garbage all over the place. Would you ever do that? Would you? I am assuming you wouldn’t (but please correct me if I am wrong).
Well just expand that idea of basic respect on the dance floor to respecting the whole community, the whole earth. You got to be aware of how your actions, what you consume and how you choose to live affects everyone else. Otherwise just like trashing the dance floor you trash the earth affecting many people. Its just selfish and if you would not do it on the dance floor then don't do it elsewhere. It’s the same principle of being aware of your surrounding and how you affect everyone else. You can’t escape it, you are in the boat along with everyone else. So how about some unity? Nobody wants your trash on their backyard, I am sure you feel the same way. Its a very basic idea of respect.
I am sorry about calling you a sore puppy btw. I was tryng to illustrate a point. And you are totally right that the enviromental problems are not the only problems the planet is facing, but the solution I think is the same. We have to disolve the illusion that we are different groups, families and individuals all competing against eachother.
We have to think about it like we are all one. Its a hard concept to accept, but it seems to be the reality. The energy comming from you affects me, affects everyone. Its like your legs and your arms and your head. They all belong to the same body. So if your leg is ill, the rest of the body will also be ill.
SO what we need is some deeper understandin of this unity which we can deny but can not escape.
Then we will be able to tune in to a better frequency where we love eachother more.
Yeah man, I respect you. You are part of the groove..
+1000000000000000000000
and not just cause (s)he said nice things about e and my opinion, but because (s)he said things i would not have had the guts or honesty or clarity to say this deeply into the mudhole of this thread.
BE TREEHUGGERS
and people huggers
and animal huggers
being jaded is passe
*lovenlight*
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
1181
Posted : Jun 10, 2008 19:35
aluxe u rock!
i think you have summed up what we all have been trying to say so perfectly thank you so much.
i think if we all make the problem our own and relate to it we will see how important this issue is
mwah! "END THE OCCUPATION!"
"We cant solve the problems that we created with the same thinking that created them"
Xolvexs
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
241
Posts :
2848
Posted : Jun 11, 2008 20:37
i agree with u aluxe but i dont think its a problem..i think its more to do with adaptation...if you call it a problem there will be sides...also realistically we are adapting and finding ways to minimize our impact...global warming is going to be about adapting to a new climate, global warming is not a problem, its a change...for politicians its a problem, and solution for their motives.
the blame will continue...some will join some wont...but simply having a majority of the world convinced about the "problem" will not do anything...consumption will be taxed, all the money spend for improving your business/lifestyle will no longer be written off as "expenses" on your balance sheets, it should be a "liability"...adjusting of trade balances and putting carbon caps etc, better quality engines etc will still continue to degrade the environment...biofuels have already destroyed forests in amazon, the food prices are screwed, while all the new alternative fuels are great options they are political issues, even if everyone did their own thing and made the changes in their lives...the govts will make it a poltical thing...FOOD PRICES ARE RISING:::STOP BIOFUELS...its ridiculous. save the environment or save the people, thats why its not a problem..its got to do with adapting and management not eliminating the problem...the solutions will come and may also become the problem..like in the biofuesl case..., how you adapt to it, dont worry about the others, if you find a way to live better than what you have been thats good too, if it works for you doesnt mean it works for everyone..on top of this there is a threat of terrorism and war which are like cherries on the icing of the cake
When death comes to your doorstep, make sure you are alive
T.D.R
IsraTrance Junior Member
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50
Posts :
368
Posted : Jun 12, 2008 10:31
Quote:
On 2008-05-30 16:57, "42" wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-05-30 02:43, T.D.R wrote:
People, calm down please. I have more important things in life than deleting your posts every day, allright?
Can I ask what reason will you have to delete this post??? Who and why is not calm?
ok, after failing to send you this message in pm i decided to copy & paste it here.
Hey man sorry for late reply, i was little busy lately..off course you can ask what reason bro, and anything else that you want. my purpose in deleting your post and some other users posts here, is to try and direct you to be stick to thread-topic, no matter what it is.
Imagine yourself every one will open a thread every second here or just write their stings or even just nice messages which not in the place, what mess will be here..think before you open a thread or give reply if it's really important or it's possible to write the messages in other place..
you're one of the main guys in the forum and specifically because of that, a bit of considering bro.
In every thing and every time i'm here, so write me whenever you want.
Tom
"From bitter searching of the heart
We Rise,
To play a greater part"
(Leonard Cohen)
Aluxe
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
25
Posts :
725
Posted : Jun 18, 2008 02:26
There is one important aspect to it all. Before we can change ourselves and change the world we must first believe that we have the power to create the world we want to see. The problem is we have since forever been educated to see ourselves as powerless. And even if we say we can do it, at an uncounscious level we very much STILL think that we are just powerless ordinary human beings who can not change much. And as long as we remain tuned to that frequency we are not going to be able to do much. I think this has to be understood very well.
So I wanted to share the following video where this concept is explained very well, I personally found it very liberating. The guy talking (David Icke) has been often called a loon and many people might want to dismiss him all together because of some other things he says. But I think he has great insight on certain matters like how he explains on this video that we are fundamentally in control of our lives. (btw, I don’t really agree on everything on this video, but some parts are incredibly lucid and right on target. Eye opening shit)
Please have a listen (if you get an error saying the video is no longer there, just refresh the page, sometimes a few times):
Part 1:
Part 2:
Part 3:
Part 4:
Part 5:
Part 6:
Part 7:
PS thanks to ocelot and loveandlight for their feedback
sure_smoke_alot
IsraTrance Junior Member
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45
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6874
Posted : Jun 21, 2008 14:00
Quote:
On 2008-06-21 07:24, qwerty wrote:
I have been reading this thread with interest.......shame that so many would gang up on the minority view point.
A harsh reality has hit me though........I just have not experienced first hand global warming. ......I live in England.........I can remember where I used to play in the woods as a child and well its as I remembered........I don't believe what the media puts in front of me............I thinks it's dangerous to be selective over what you choose to believe and what you don't........the way I look at it....you either believe what your government tells you or you don't......you either trust what is reported in the media or you don't...................I choose not to.........so I can't actually say that I have in my lifetime noticed any effects of global warming...........am I alone?
wow.... that's intresting jus coz ur neibourhood has'nt changed = no global warming
i wud really doubth for bout more than 1000 species of my fellow earthlings which got extinct in the las decade & some millions of ppl. who had evacuate thier ancestoral homes jus coz of climate channge wud agree with ur viewpoint.
the problem with valuing art is, till u dont understand it, it's worthless but wen u do understand it, it's priceless!!
sure_smoke_alot
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jun 21, 2008 14:03
jus an intresting thing
Between May 2000 and August 2006, Brazil lost nearly 150,000 square kilometers of forest—an area larger than Greece—and since 1970, over 600,000 square kilometers (232,000 square miles) of Amazon rainforest have been destroyed.
the problem with valuing art is, till u dont understand it, it's worthless but wen u do understand it, it's priceless!!
Dogon
IsraTrance Junior Member
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50
Posts :
8779
Posted : Jun 21, 2008 14:08
some people just dont choose to believe & understand & agree that there's a problem; now, that's the biggest problem.
We were born naked & grow up to become wicked.
Ellon
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jun 21, 2008 16:38
Dear qwerty...
The rising of temperatures in our planet is a "scientific" fact....and with it the dissapearing of many species that are sensitive to such fast changes.
Are we humans the responsible party? Would it happen even if we were not around? I cannot say it clearly for our planet is known for its cycles but our posture is not balancing the planet at all...
Moreover, who cares!!!! Do you feel that the way we live and consume is something to maintain? Are you identified with it?
phiber_optixz
IsraTrance Full Member
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162
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2072
Posted : Jun 21, 2008 16:51
qwerty = Psytracked
sure_smoke_alot
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
45
Posts :
6874
Posted : Jun 21, 2008 16:51
Quote:
On 2008-06-21 16:28, qwerty wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-06-21 14:03, sure_smoke_alot wrote:
jus an intresting thing
Between May 2000 and August 2006, Brazil lost nearly 150,000 square kilometers of forest—an area larger than Greece—and since 1970, over 600,000 square kilometers (232,000 square miles) of Amazon rainforest have been destroyed.
so what caused this? are you saying this was caused by global warming?
sorry i forgot ur from kiddergarden
this was in reference to tell u that jus coz ur tiny area is the same as u think it was when ur were younger does'nt prove shit.
the problem with valuing art is, till u dont understand it, it's worthless but wen u do understand it, it's priceless!!
sure_smoke_alot
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
45
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6874
Posted : Jun 21, 2008 16:55
Quote:
On 2008-06-21 16:26, qwerty wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-06-21 14:03, sure_smoke_alot wrote:
jus an intresting thing
Between May 2000 and August 2006, Brazil lost nearly 150,000 square kilometers of forest—an area larger than Greece—and since 1970, over 600,000 square kilometers (232,000 square miles) of Amazon rainforest have been destroyed.
Thats what you tell me......I don't know you......why should I believe you?
this is getting better then the Indian section now
but still if ur curious
http://www.mongabay.com/brazil.html (but f*ck it coz u dont know the owerners of this site as well so wot's the point)
only ppl whom qwerty knows say the truth all other of us mofo as big fat liers
the problem with valuing art is, till u dont understand it, it's worthless but wen u do understand it, it's priceless!!
this is getting better then the Indian section now
only ppl whom qwerty knows say the truth all other of us mofo as big fat liers