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Commercialism Kills ! Or Does It???
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___yaniv
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 6, 2001 21:21:53
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Hello to u all!
I just wanted to say something i had in my mind...
** So, It is obvious that when you ask ppl of trance in israel
mostly 74% Will Say infected mushroom...!**
When an artist becomes famous, and really wershiped
i feel like quality of music is lower.. MUCH
lower...
Because he starts making what MOST OF PPL WANT and this is not
A good built psytrance! so... I say do not afraid to try things
You never heard about or Underground!
Because After all, They come the best...
Anyone that can build a good discussion on this
ILL BE HAPPY
10x 10x 10x
ISRATRANCE!!!
bye lol
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___kaz
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 6, 2001 21:36:52
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Hmmm, where'd you get that statistic? :)
I don't think success kills quality. It did to some, but there are many successful acts which are successful because they're just GOOD. |
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___yaniv
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 6, 2001 21:49:37
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u can be right |
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___OA
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 6, 2001 23:27:39
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Yes and no. Some bands are still trying to figure themselvs and thier style of music out when they get popular, so the music you got to know them by in the beginning, might not be the music they stick to. I think a lot of bands get shit on for this.
But commercialism can also kill a band. There are many bands that "sold out" thier style after getting big. Thier music got less original. But some bands are able to change and stay original. It really depends on the band. Look at The Beatles (just cause thier one of the biggest commercial succeses ever) I think thier music got better along with thier popularity. I think it really comes down to the talent of the band.
BTW. I do like the change in Infected. I don't like them more compared to thier old stuff, just like them different. |
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___pacman7331
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 03:19:12
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Hey it's OA! I recognize you from psynews... I'm "me" there. Don't post there often... discussions get personal there too often... What part of the states do you live? I'm in TX |
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___DETOX
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 14:25:26
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Being famous is good and thats a fact.
Infected Mushroom are not only famous in the trance scene,many people out of this know them and thats good because trance needs to be spread to the world so that more and more people will pay attention to oti and spend time making the scene better.Ofcourse someone might say that the more people get involved the worst for the music,ok i disagree on that because i know that two brains think better than one.
Spread the music. |
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___kaz
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 15:11:55
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On the other side...
commercail success can kill, and I know people are going to shout at me for this, but People Can Fly was the beginning of AP's end as far as I'm concerned, same thing that happened to The Prodigy with Firestarter (Fat of the Land was MUCH more successful than Experience and Jilted). |
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___DETOX
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 17:11:11
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The problem is that sometimes groups reach their maximum capabilities and after that everything else they do seems to be bad comparing with their older jobs.The problem is not to become famous,but to remain famous for a long time :) |
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___yaniv
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 18:32:46
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YEAH! Halleluja DETOX! |
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___Sesto_Sento
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 19:06:15
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IMHO, commercialism is a serial killer that must be haunted and killed :)
and i'm not gonna say anything about infected or give any specific examples.
due to what people are used to seeing and hearing nowdays (MTV :() some, and actually most of them
don't look under the surface.
record labels know it well and provide the murchandise.
again, i'm not talking about any specific label or type of music.
so,naturally, when trance became more popular among different groups of people and not only fanatic trance lovers :) - commercialism got it too. it can be viewed as a good thing, cuz after all we love what that music does to us, and want to change some social grasps and perspectives about it, about music and about life.
but it also means it's now more or less in the process of becoming some sort of mainstream. |
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___Ohm_Nam_Shivaya
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 20:00:17
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Yes we are going to shout: WHY? PEOPLE CAN FLY?!?
I mean, what, anything that's melodic an catchy is commercial?!?
And another thing:
Trance is definitely a problematic scene, on one hand it's a very attractive scene(in israel at least), on the other hand it can't support you, on the third hand, it's unfair.
You see, you have to look at the issue from all sides: If you look at this from the perspective of: "Commercialism kills good musiC", Than you have to ask yourself why do some people turn commercial?
I mean, the ideal thing to do would be to actually be able to support yourself well, and then to start with the trance. So that you "try" to make a porofit out of your music, but you don't let music sacrifice your financial situation, and in this case you stay calm, and don't turn commercial.
BUT, in most cases that just dosn't happen, either because you rush into music at an age to early, or at an older age, but still without being able to support yourself, and then you actually run a risk of either gaining the bold success of groups like Infected, astral, and all those...
Or miserably failing because of lack of talent(probably), or other reasons.
And now comes the unfair part: If you do get into the stream of those hugely succesful artists, to success there are two aspects: financial, and musical, and not many are lucky enough to succeed in both. For example IM, AP, XDREAM, SIMON POSFORD, MWNN, MMM, and some which i didn't mention, made financial success and musical success, but then you have others like:CS,MFG,and most of other artists out there, who just can't support themselves from the scene, and in that case you either quit, or turn commercial, and the n you are hated by your fans.
Ofcourse, piracy, illigal copy, Fuckster, and the others, contribute to more financial loss, to those who are successful, and to those who are less.
And in the end it's our job(the crowd which supports the scene), to remember that the trance artists don't get the $5,000,000 of sponsorship per month like britney and all the other shit on the market does. And that it's still not easy to make money while honestly making music.
And everyone needs the green.
So before ya all post all sorts of shit about how artists should make music the way YOU like, maybe you should first "remember" for a while, that CD's don't write themselves, but that they are written by someone who is EXACTLY just like you, as far as needs are conserned, which means they those who make this music are "people". And with no way to pay bills, it can get hard to still support your crowd.
THE END.
BOM!!!
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___kaz
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 21:34:01
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What I was saying about AP (which were one of my favorite acts, exactly like the Prodigy), is that something happened to them... People Can Fly was not APs best tracl, but it was a good track (and so was Firestarter to the Prodigy).
It was the direction which AP took when they released People Can Fly. They moved from the classic goa spirit into something else. Less psychedelic, not with the same deep vibe (I still get an ear to ear smile from Mehadeva for instance), and as much as they are true proffesionals, with amazing production, and musically, they haven't become any less talented. It's the musical direction which they took (just like after Firestarter with the Prodigy), which caused many of the truest AP fans to ask "what happened here?" (I'm pretty happy with the Prodigy example here, it's damn accurate as far as I'm concerned), while it really increased their overall popularity.
That's what I'm saying. Their music changed in order to become more popular, and by doing that, something wonderful started to fade. The process continued and went further and further, and the more time passes, the less I like APs new material. And believe me, they were one of my 5 favorite acts at the time (the other 4 are still in my 10 favorite acts, by the way).
... or am I the only one who feels that way about AP (and the Prodigy? :)) |
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___KLine
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 22:01:46
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If You buy the Ferry Corsten 'Trance Nation' album and you'll find that only about 4 or 5 tracks on the entire album is actually trance. The rest is Techno or Hard House. I believe that quality original trance is more harder to find than a warez link that actually works!!!! Also the likes of ATB, Fragma and people like that have made Trance music go down hill in the past few years and I don't think that your'll get Trance back to how it was in the day....Am I right in saying that?
Jay
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___Ohm_Nam_Shivaya
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 7, 2001 23:17:58
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Well, i don't know about AP and Prodigy, cau'z look, somehow astral still maintain this "+/- underground" style, (i think).
The prodigy(i used to drool over their music once), they are 100%pop, they have MTV clips, probably a lot's of$$$, and a million posters, they are original though, and i don't know if they make music anymore.
And astral(as your example), they have a clip(which i didn't see), a few photos, and that's all. Now it's actually true that "people can fly" isn't really psy, but it sure is a "goa" track. Are you sure that they moved to less psy?
After that they reliesed "dancing galaxy" & "another world", how less psy is that from all the early stuff ? (94-96)? For example, I'll compare from the earliest stuff to the latest stuff,
y-salem>mahadeva>kabalah(people can fly time)>Free tibet>Solid electonics>Dancing galaxy>Nilaya>Axis.
Most of the first tracks are pritty much with the same spirit:y-salem-solid electronics, and also all the tracks on the album maintain the same spirit, and no commercial. Then you get dancing galaxy, which is anything but commercial, and it even has a night track(life on mars).
Then you get "nilaya" from "another world ALBUM"Can you call another world "goa spirit-less"? It is a bit more psy, but it's pritty much the same,
then you get "in the mix" which is controversial, it has (imo), one original and good track "axis", notice the sound similarity between axis and kabalah. Unfortunately, except the mixes to the old tracks in this album, AP have descided to show us the HOUSY side of things, which freaks me out personally, cauz some stuff there is definitely not with the AP spirit, And yes for 2000, axis is a bit housy, but if you look at "y-salem" which is actually goa, then i think you could call "axis" goa as well. So i don't think that AP have lost the spirit, at least not with releasing "people can fly" because as i have shown, EVERYTHING they have reliesed untill "in the mix" seems to be right on the GOA path.
BOM!!!
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___kaz
Old Forum Member
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Posted : Nov 8, 2001 01:59:40
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Faithless - God is a DJ (Astral Projection Remix)
if that's not going commercial, I don't know what is. |
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