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widening- s1 (records with microphone)
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
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120
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Posted : Dec 1, 2009 08:31:12
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hi, i noticed that i cant widen my records with S1-imager.
its only possible, if a make 2 tracks with the same sample, put 1 sample a few ms later and play 1 sample Left and one Right.
this gives a computer sounding, wide effect to the sample, but not what i want.
when i take 2 tracks, 1 left and 1 right, and play them at the SAME TIME, it neutralizes the effect, and its mono again ftw...
why i cant simply use s1? are there any physic rules i dont get? ^^
cheers
  www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
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384
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 12:50
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i'm not familiar with the waves s1 but if it is anything like similar plugins (i use the brainworx one), in order to 'widen' the imagine it simply changes the ratio of mid to side. basically turns down the 'mid' (sound that comes through both speakers) and turns up the side (sound the only comes through one). also known as sum and difference (the sum is the signal that comes through both speakers, the difference is the signal that only comes through one or the other).
basically that means if the signal is mono to begin with, the plugin won't do anything. it can only 'widen' a signal that already has stereo information.
as for turning a mono track into a stereo one, there are a few ways to accomplish this:
one as you mentioned is the whole, double the tracks and put one left and one right and delay one trick. it is used heaps but as soon as the track is played in mono everything turns bad and you get horrible phasing and the like.
another is comb filtering, that is, doubling the tracks panning one hard L and the other hard R but cutting out different freq bands across the two sides to give the perception of width.
But the best way IMO to widen a mono signal is basically good ole double tracking, which is used widely in rock mixes. basically just do two takes of the same synth line, pan one hard L and one hard R. obviously if the takes are exactly the same they will sum to mono, but the idea is to make sure there are LFOs and stuff like that going so that the synth line is ever-changing, or have subtle variations in the timing of the part/midi notes. so when you double track it it will sound wide. |
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piko_bianko
Oxya
Started Topics :
57
Posts :
974
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 13:27
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mquirk1 is right.
you can only widen a stereo signal.
what you can do is send your recording in a stereo bus and insert a reverb using small values. then put an s1 and there you have a wide recording 
extreme |
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Pointless
Inactive User
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0
Posts :
49
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 13:31
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about 20 ms delay on one side will do it for that classics rock guitar width
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
120
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Posted : Dec 1, 2009 13:41
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ok, that sounds logical.
so if i got exactly the same signal coming out L/R, it is mono?
and i only can widen it up, if i change one of those signals a little bit?
i tried to make a storyteller voice (like in films)... i recorded my voice, pitchshifted a littlebit to sound deeper, compressed it... and the last step should be the widening... BUT i want to keep the signal original... i want no metallic/computer like effects... just a deep, smooth and wide storytelling voice.
would you manage this issue with a reverb?
or how would you keep the voice natuaral?
EDIT, my recorded signal is a stereo track with 2 same waveforms, so its a monosignal, right?
cheers
www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
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384
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 13:47
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
Posts :
384
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 13:50
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Quote:
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On 2009-12-01 13:41, orgytime wrote:
ok, that sounds logical.
so if i got exactly the same signal coming out L/R, it is mono?
and i only can widen it up, if i change one of those signals a little bit?
i tried to make a storyteller voice (like in films)... i recorded my voice, pitchshifted a littlebit to sound deeper, compressed it... and the last step should be the widening... BUT i want to keep the signal original... i want no metallic/computer like effects... just a deep, smooth and wide storytelling voice.
would you manage this issue with a reverb?
or how would you keep the voice natuaral?
EDIT, my recorded signal is a stereo track with 2 same waveforms, so its a monosignal, right?
cheers
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that' easy, like i said the best way (imo) is just to double/triple track the recording. have your main one dead centre, then have say one super compressed panned hard left with a bit of a low cut, then another panned right with a send to a delay which is then panned somewhere else. maybe even stack up to 4/5 different takes on top of each, all panned+effected in different ways. you will end up with a huge/wide vocal sound
just experiment.. look up some tutes on multi-tracking pop vocals and the like |
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
120
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1703
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 14:48
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thanks guys!
maybe you can help me with another question, dont want to start a new thread for it...
i need a huge samplepack with any kind of sounds.
i want to do audio post production for films of a friend of mine...
i need as much sounds as i can get, like:
steps, doors, explosions, rain, ... much things i can produce with vst´s... but not all.
you know any soundbank for audio post production?
cheers
www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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Pointless
Inactive User
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
49
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 14:51
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make your own. Become your won Foley artist. |
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
80
Posts :
3207
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 15:27
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[/quote]
that' easy, like i said the best way (imo) is just to double/triple track the recording. have your main one dead centre, then have say one super compressed panned hard left with a bit of a low cut, then another panned right with a send to a delay which is then panned somewhere else. maybe even stack up to 4/5 different takes on top of each, all panned+effected in different ways. you will end up with a huge/wide vocal sound
just experiment.. look up some tutes on multi-tracking pop vocals and the like
[/quote]
That is the easiest and fastest way to make vocals as wide as you want them to be.
Though this description is very intense man,very kool gonna try that.
I never got that S1 image widener.Would be interesting to find one reason for its existence.What for it will be used when you can widen all differently without more plug ins?
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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mquirk1
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
63
Posts :
384
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 15:56
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the reason for it's existence is mainly to use as a very subtle effect when mixing. it isn't supposed to be used to turn narrow leads into huge stereo monsters, or to be used on mono signals at all, but it is used more in mixing projects where an instrument has been recorded with a pair of stereo mics and you want to widen the stereo field a bit. for example you have recorded a drumkit with two room mics, but they sound too close to the centre, you can use a tool like s1 widener to spread them out a bit. there is really no replacement for such a tool.. but it's use is fairly limited in psytrance production since nothing is really recorded with mics or room ambience.
if you are wanting to make stereo leads/pads etc you are better off going a different route such as stereo plugs like chorus, double tracking, or even better just start from the source and have different osc's/filters within the patch panned either side |
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orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
120
Posts :
1703
Posted : Dec 1, 2009 16:14
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thanks guys, now im smarter again
Quote:
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On 2009-12-01 14:48, orgytime wrote:
thanks guys!
maybe you can help me with another question, dont want to start a new thread for it...
i need a huge samplepack with any kind of sounds.
i want to do audio post production for films of a friend of mine...
i need as much sounds as i can get, like:
steps, doors, explosions, rain, ... much things i can produce with vst´s... but not all.
you know any soundbank for audio post production?
cheers
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anyone?
cheers
www.soundcloud.com/orgytime |
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