TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : May 2, 2010 06:30
I don't live in any glass house mate.From time to time I care like a mother for a glasshouse maybe but I definetly don't live in any Nuff said already.https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden
Nectarios
Martian Arts
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Posted : May 2, 2010 13:44
Quote:
On 2010-04-28 11:40, Beat Agency wrote:
Why would anyone in their right mind want a underground scene to become commercial? As a warning just take a look at the scenes in Europe, Israel, South America and Asia. Enjoy what you have and protect it from commercial forces!
+1.
I have never been to the US, but from what I read and see on youtube its a small bunch of people, partying out in some desert and for me, that is what its all about.
Big does not mean healthy...like a big fat person, you eat more than you should, you get heart disease, you can't run and do fun things for long cause you run out of breath, you look like shit and you end up dying very soon.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts
V3NOM
Inactive User
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Posted : May 2, 2010 16:16
Keep it underground & small, commercial success rarely works... in any music scene... look what it did for most the classic thrash metal bands... only band I"ve seen commercial success work for so far truly is Behemoth from Poland...
I hate you, you hate me, we are all so hap hap happy!
moki
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Posted : May 2, 2010 17:01
Quote:
On 2010-05-01 21:02, Axis Mundi wrote:
Lots of great points in Moki's post, but there are some things that need to be pointed out.
Quote:
it was also the first time that black music was influenced by european music.
Speaking of only electronic dance music, this is accurate, but speaking of music in general, not so much. Most of the instruments used in modern american music use instruments of american, european, or middle eastern origin. For example:
Also, there are a great deal of funk, blues, rock, etc. bands which have been using synthesizers in their acts for quite a few decades, such as Moog and Nord gear, for example.
....
....
This very short sample essentially became the foundations for multiple genres of electronic based music, such as hip-hop, breaks, drum and bass, and jungle. All genres which have also brought all sorts of people together since before even detroit techno.
indeed, you are right. thanks for this very appropriate correction.
i meant, that the detroit techno period was the first time that black music was influenced by any european style of music on that scale.
and certainly there were other black musicians who were influenced by white music in their soul and jazz styles, but i believe techno was a phenomenon that was clearly the first mix between european music and black music, between electropop or other electronic styles coming from europe and rhythmic beats coming from the black music movement. and whereas soul and jazz were always focused within the black musicians , techno was a sort of a bridge, that would probably never take place on our planet, if it wasnt U.S.A. with their multi-ethnical environment.
the first pioneers of detroit were all black - you take juan atkins, derric mey. followed by dozens of others like jeff mills, carl craig, carl kox....
i find it an interesting issue to investigate, what would have happened to jean michel jarre or kraftwerk if they have not been discovered by the pioneers of techno in detroit? where would we all be now? and i believe , they did a very important achievement for the development of electronic music... to the point where we are now.
no detroit - probably no psy trance either.
well, it is just a thesis that i suggest, it is not a definite observation of history.
i have never been in detroit and i only listened to that stuff at the beginning of the nineties for some time. what i know about the scene there, comes mostly from a friend of mine who was one of the establishers of the first house club in new york. he is now back in germany and was among the first who started the techno movement here.
it is an interesting question why the europeans were more fascinated by the detroit sound than their counterparts in the u.s.
here is a film about the creation of techno music:
interesting to see that techno started exactly like an alternative style of the black population of the u.s.
waht is the reason why the detroit story never developed into these big " huge" events that we have in europe nowadays. may be it was exactly because those people who started the psy trance movement in the u.s. were in goa at the time of detroit. and they stayed underground after they came back. in europe, in comparison, techno and psy trance have always been hand in hand. that is why techno made psy trance big in europe. the states were probably more reserved towards techno.
eLIZAbETHS
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Posted : May 3, 2010 13:32
Here is also one interesting movie about techno music:
And what I find also interesting is the book of Laurent Garnier - Electroshock (2003), which shows the scene of techno music in his 20 year career.
Maine Coon
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : May 3, 2010 16:59
So, here is an interesting question. Techno was invented in the US (yes, drawing on European ideas too - let's not start nationalistic wars here). Yet, it never really took off outside Detroit. And even in Detroit for a long time it was confined to 2-3 clubs. Detroiters exported it to Germany (or re-imported, if you agree with Time Traveler). And it took off from there. So, back to the question. Two questions, actually:
1) If psy trance had been invented in the US, would it follow the fate of techno and stay small here, while flourishing overseas?
2) How do you explain that house - a very close relative of techno - is so much more popular in the US?
Ascension
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Posted : May 3, 2010 17:07
Quote:
On 2010-05-02 13:44, disco hooligans wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-04-28 11:40, Beat Agency wrote:
Why would anyone in their right mind want a underground scene to become commercial? As a warning just take a look at the scenes in Europe, Israel, South America and Asia. Enjoy what you have and protect it from commercial forces!
+1.
I have never been to the US, but from what I read and see on youtube its a small bunch of people, partying out in some desert and for me, that is what its all about.
Big does not mean healthy...like a big fat person, you eat more than you should, you get heart disease, you can't run and do fun things for long cause you run out of breath, you look like shit and you end up dying very soon.
So true. That's what I was getting at in my previous posts. It's not all about expanding as much as possible. It's about keeping the vibe and maintaining a sustainable scene.
Maine Coon
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Posted : May 3, 2010 19:25
^
I was wondering: is there a cooperation between Americans and Canadians in this area. Like for example, do you and Basilisk ever coordinate something together to bring musicians from both countries to an event? Or maybe one of you just comes and helps with an event hosted by the other? Something like that?
Ascension
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Posted : May 3, 2010 19:57
Not really. We brought Basilisk and Ekoplex down to our sacred earth festival last year.
We usually try to do flight shares with other promoters in the US due to visa issues. Some artists can get into Canada and not into the US. There are even artist in Canada who can't get into the US because there are still surprisingly strict custom officials for trips between the 2 countries.
In general though it can be hard to coordinate (especially between countries) since you have to have festivals relatively close to each other if you want a flight share to work out and there aren't a ton of festivals big enough to afford international acts in the US.
http://soundcloud.com/ascensionsound www.chilluminati.org - Midwest based psytrance group
Maine Coon
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Posted : May 3, 2010 20:39
I thought people from the EU and Canada (I mean citizens) don't need a visa to come here (as tourists). Maybe when they see you with equipment, they classify you as a worker and demand a specific visa then...
That's too bad. Detroit and Buffalo would be good places to meet.
Ascension
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Posted : May 3, 2010 20:57
That's exactly what happens sometimes. If you don't have your story straight on where you're going and what you're doing it can turn into trouble.
It's stupid how we're all immigrants here yet some douche bags (george bush, et al) don't like the idea of people coming into our country.http://soundcloud.com/ascensionsound www.chilluminati.org - Midwest based psytrance group
Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
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Posted : May 3, 2010 23:39
In countries within the schengen agreement, the passport stamp is considered your 3-month tourist visa and to apply to extend it, you can go to a foreigner office within that country after you have already arrived instead of needing to apply before ever crossing the border.
There are a few countries such as the UK to which this doesn't apply... you need your own passport stamp from them.
When I flew from the US to Germany last year, I had a bag full of clothes, two bags of gear and wheeling a 61-key synth in a flight case through customs (on a one way ticket) and they just asked me how long I was going to stay.
I'm sure if they really wanted to ask questions, though, they could have easily found a reason to block me.
Flying back to the US through Dublin airport, I was frequently stopped by US customs there and asked why I hadn't filled out an address I was traveling to within the US in my paperwork (reason being I didn't have one at the time).
So yeah.
Ascension
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Posted : May 4, 2010 17:56
Yeah my mention of that was from a specific incident of probably what you encountered jason (it was between usa and canada though, still strange, but not surprising).
http://soundcloud.com/ascensionsound www.chilluminati.org - Midwest based psytrance group
mist
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Posted : May 4, 2010 22:27
i got detained in customs in toronto one time with the crystal method. true story. they actually sent me back to texas because the promoter hadn't sent me some letter of invitation i needed or some such nonsense... they let the cm guys through though....
rich
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Posted : May 7, 2010 20:22
Because the US is a young and immature country, discovering his hard-on for the first time, playing with it like a pubescent school boy and wondering who he is.
