PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 21:09
imo it s way more tricky to get a huge sound at 150 bpm than at 140. check the prog, there is probably way more good sounding low end than in dark psy, it s the law of physics , a very short kick will sound thin vs the same kick with a big tail in many case. also a KBBB at 150 bpm that sound flat like a pan cake there is no way it sound huge(even at 145 bpm but there is already more room) it need dynamic imo it need to breath , if it s flat i find it sound thiner in many case .i dont want to say it s not possible, but it s more tricky to mix.
i was thinking to something that could help sometimes i do that in full on, the first bassline note after the kick i mix it ona other chanel and i process it to sound good with the tail of the kick (different eq with less bass than the other note) and different volume (sometimes i automate it )what i would do too is make first a kick attack, then a kick body to get a fatter sound with a short tail insteed of making a usual kick.
orgytime
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 21:38
lol, i knew this topic would be nerve-wracking.
7 sites in 2 days lol. PoM, im with you there is one true tempo, its 145! lol just kidding i hate dark do i?www.soundcloud.com/orgytime
Medea
Aedem/Medea
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 21:50
150 bpm is not that fast...
Remember the gabber era of the ninetees )
180 - 220 bpm. And a lot of deep and "not toy" music has been released at such bpms.
Maine Coon
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 21:51
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 21:09, PoM wrote:
check the prog, there is probably way more good sounding low end than in dark psy, it s the law of physics , a very short kick will sound thin vs the same kick with a big tail in many case. also a KBBB at 150 bpm that sound flat like a pan cake there is no way it sound huge(even at 145 bpm but there is already more room) it need dynamic imo it need to breath
It’s the same issue again: something from one genre applied to another.
One cannot physically reproduce prog bass in high-speed music, we already established that. But that does not automatically make washed-out psycore bass or fast tech trance tom bass “terrible”. It’s just that in those genres nobody needs the bass to sound like it does in prog. So why are you applying the prog yardstick to high-speed genres? Did somebody here come out and say that prog sucks because it doesn’t feature a full symphonic orchestra? That would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it? But that’s exactly what a symphony fan may say. You (and Mr. A.) are doing the same thing here, imho.
When you talk about prog, it’s not “good sounding low end”. It’s just “low end”. It’s “good sounding” to you because you like it and because it fits well with the rest of the prog arrangement. Full on’s neutered bass fits well in a full on arrangement and sounds good to full on fans. Psycore’s “bu-bu-bu” or even “wu-wu-wu” washed-out bass fits into a psycore arrangement and sounds good to psycore fans. And tech trance’s “tum-tum-tum” bass-that’s-really-another-drum fits well in a tech trance arrangement.
Yes, you cannot reproduce deep well-defined bass in high-speed psycore. That’s exactly the kind of technical limitations Daark was asking about. But do you need to have that kind of bass in that kind of tracks?
daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 22:03
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 21:05, aciduss wrote:
Someone has to lower his stimulant dose.
Quote:
by the way trance was is and will be a meditation to me. i don't expect to have normal heart rate in primal active meditation that is not the point .i need to pump jump yell and breathe like a maniac that is part of the thing
Sorry but I find this too contradictory.
In my book, meditation has nothing to do with pump, jump, yell and / or breath like maniac.
well maybe your book is a very small part of the picture
understand what cardinals cartel? what are you talking about?
all i understand that some people have a real big egotrip thats what i understand
@pom yeah people seem to forget that they have just no idea of how much knowledge it takes to make it work any bpm and there is a million technics that makes a kick and base work not one.
you say its easy to make that kind of music but you are far from it a million miles yes nowadays are a lot of newcomers in psy so what now music is crap? no its still people who are learning not all are big yet
willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 22:08
There needs to be some give and take in this discussion. It's one thing to say that I don't like most music that's past a certain tempo - I'm with you on that. It's another thing entirely to dismiss everything (even stuff that you haven't heard) as 'toy music', or to call Psykovsky commercial.
Do I like Psykovsky? No, not really - in fact, I pretty much can't stand it at all. Don't like dancing to it, not very trippy to me - but commercial?
That music is DEFINITELY not going to appeal to mainstream commerical values or the vast, VAST majority of the consumer world. Ever. I seriously doubt anyone is saying to themselves "hey...you know what will make me a lot of money? REALLY FAST PSYTRANCE!"
Making arguments like those does not add to your argument...it actually degrades your position imo.
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records
daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 22:12
maine coon i agree with you
but everything is possible even making a long tail in 160 bpms if you really need to you can just eq them so they fit both. or even wobble together. you can add sub bass right over the punch to make it have sub and if i leave like 5-6 sounds fading out fading in with long reverbs and delays and stuff it will be spacy and clear. isn't it?
aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 22:55
You got it.
Now go use your knowledge, skill and talent and make some ultrafast sonic deep music.
A.Rosengren
Solid Snake
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Posted : Nov 24, 2010 23:03
We should coin a new saying here, 'Wavs or it never happened!'
A
PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 25, 2010 00:59
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 21:51, Maine Coon wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 21:09, PoM wrote:
check the prog, there is probably way more good sounding low end than in dark psy, it s the law of physics , a very short kick will sound thin vs the same kick with a big tail in many case. also a KBBB at 150 bpm that sound flat like a pan cake there is no way it sound huge(even at 145 bpm but there is already more room) it need dynamic imo it need to breath
It’s the same issue again: something from one genre applied to another.
One cannot physically reproduce prog bass in high-speed music, we already established that. But that does not automatically make washed-out psycore bass or fast tech trance tom bass “terrible”. It’s just that in those genres nobody needs the bass to sound like it does in prog. So why are you applying the prog yardstick to high-speed genres? Did somebody here come out and say that prog sucks because it doesn’t feature a full symphonic orchestra? That would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it? But that’s exactly what a symphony fan may say. You (and Mr. A.) are doing the same thing here, imho.
When you talk about prog, it’s not “good sounding low end”. It’s just “low end”. It’s “good sounding” to you because you like it and because it fits well with the rest of the prog arrangement. Full on’s neutered bass fits well in a full on arrangement and sounds good to full on fans. Psycore’s “bu-bu-bu” or even “wu-wu-wu” washed-out bass fits into a psycore arrangement and sounds good to psycore fans. And tech trance’s “tum-tum-tum” bass-that’s-really-another-drum fits well in a tech trance arrangement.
Yes, you cannot reproduce deep well-defined bass in high-speed psycore. That’s exactly the kind of technical limitations Daark was asking about. But do you need to have that kind of bass in that kind of tracks?
Maine Coon some wise words as usual man, and yes sorry if i was offtopic as i haven t understood everythings lol but when i say good low end i mean well produced low end, it s not so much about taste there ,lot of fast ddark psy dont sound very well produced , the fast tempo dont help and just make things mroe tricky in the low end .maybe you were saying is that they enjoy it even more when it sound thin and badly produced? it could be true for a more underground vibe.. and many listeners dont care much about production anyway they just want good music in any style but it s not the discussion.
Colin OOOD
Moderator
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Posted : Nov 25, 2010 01:20
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 23:03, A.Rosengren wrote:
We should coin a new saying here, 'Wavs or it never happened!'
Shiranui
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Nov 25, 2010 10:34
In all of these videos I see of people "dancing" to high-bpm trance I notice that most of the people on the floor (MOST not all) are gently swaying side by side, feet barely leaving the ground, and not even necessarily in time with the beat.
That is not dancing
THIS is dancing:
try dancing like that to 160 BPM music for 8 hours
Kryten
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Nov 25, 2010 14:15
Quote:
On 2010-11-24 23:03, A.Rosengren wrote:
We should coin a new saying here, 'Wavs or it never happened!'
A
I just nearly fell of my chair laughing...great idea!
try dancing like that to 160 BPM music for 8 hours
+1million but again its personal preference. For other people that is dancing.
Ever saw videos about things like jumpstyle or similar? they call that dancing too My first track:
http://soundcloud.com/kryten/
Trevon
Started Topics :
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376
Posted : Nov 25, 2010 19:10
one thing that I can' understand at all.. is this kind of dnb dance..
if they'd dance free as on psyparties, according to the music.. they would go insane... with uncontrolled arm moves and weird facial expressions... but they do this jumpie stuff instead
do i?
