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Why don't I use a limiter?
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Alien Bug
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Feb 10, 2012 17:31
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 10, 2012 18:00
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the idea that limiter are reserved for mastering,that the mastering engineer should always make things louder is a bit bullshit!
a mix that is clean welll balanced and loud,not over processed i don't see the problem, for me it will sound more like a mix made by a pro as i won t have much to do at mastering.
the problem is when it s loud and the mix sucks... |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 10, 2012 18:39
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taking care of transients , ratio between average and peak levels ,spectral balance ... . loud mix is not about slaping a limiter on your master and cranck and limit the shit out of it.(even if it might work for some)
good knowledge and control of dynamics matter a lot for today modern in your face sound, to try get something that sound not too squashed,clean and well balanced at the end |
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e-motion
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 10, 2012 20:11
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I agree with clean and balanced mixing, but imho, we should never mix for loudness. It's very easy to overcompress because psychoaccoustics always tells us a louder sound sounds better than a quiet one.
If you have a very well balanced and clean mix (level balance done right, instruments not overlapping, etc.), squashing them with a limiter on the mastering is easy.
I've a friend that is a mastering engineer and his biggest complain is the lack of dynamic range in the mixes he receives for mastering.
 Pyrex :: Traveling without moving
www.myspace.com/pyrexperience |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 00:13
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yeah agree ,it can destroy a mix easily ,when someone ask me i recomend the same as you but it s far to be a rule.
you can get excellent mix that wont need much loudness increase and you can get execellent mix that are low in volume and not squashed at all.
the thing is on the loudest good mix, you won t change much the sound at mastering, maybe just a bit of eq and a bit increase in volume.
while on the quiet one the sound of the mix is more subject to change,it will need more processing to get loud and these processing color the tune.
it leave more room for mastering engeinner to change your sound, it may be something not desirable .
also the aim is to not get the the most loudest squashed sound, but the oposite, trying to get the cleanest musical sound for today loudness |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 00:51
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getting your loudness like this ,cliping limiting at mastering, is quite brutal too.. it could be coocked since the first sound you put on the arrangement for trying to get a cleaner sound in the end,when you know why mixs can crap out, how loudness tools are used to maintain punch or stay clean ,how you will eq and balance things ... it s a bit like mixing with mastering experience.
i think it s great to always master our tune just for fun , a lot to learn from this to make our mix better ..
also about mix with dynamic , thinking to loudness while mixing...getting a great mix that will end at -12 rms , and trying to get one to sound good that will end released at -9 rms ,personally i wouldn t mix the 2 tunes the same. |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 01:22
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on the one at - 9rms , i would think to loudness potential since the first sounds i make, the kick and the bassline and their processing ,when you mix for low rms this is not a problem, but i think it s good to worry about it for today loundess , the aim is to get good sound at the loudnes the tune is released ,it mean compromise ,but trying they affect the mix the less.. |
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elastic_plastic
Re-Boot
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 12:59
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i use limiter on my bass everytime! |
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e-motion
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 14:20
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PoM: I do sometimes master my tracks myself, either for sending to my friends but also to check the mix. It can be a good way to point troubles in your mix.
Maybe it's just my way and is probably not the best for psy, but I must say I only use compression when I need to fix something. I know most people have 100% of their channels with compressors. A big example of this is that I don't compress my kicks and hihats.
Pyrex :: Traveling without moving
www.myspace.com/pyrexperience |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 15:26
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yeah after it depend the sound you are after, the mood of the day...
.if i listen music that is not squashed for 1 or 2 weeks i will hate the modern squashed sound... in fact it s all about what our ears are used to listen and they don t like change i think, cause it work the oposite way too .when the sounds breath as soon as they dont ,it just feel strange, the opoiste work the same, when everyhting is locked as his place and really cut , when it s not it feel strange for someone used to listen modern stuff
check for example logic bomb checksum tune, it s the kind of modern production i like these day for psytrance.. for someone used to listen stuff that are not squased it will sound probably way too much,everything is locked ...but that exaclty what someone used to listen modern produced music will enjoy and find it sound great i guess, really about taste.. and what our ears are used to listen i think |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 16:08
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sound are locked at their place in the mix ,i dig that under control feeling personally , it s related to dynamics, transients,peaks... the culture vulture can lock sound like this in the mix,make-ing them sound ready ,under control, finished sound with the harmonics giving a nice sheen when ti s suited on the source.. i like a lot this effect, it s like preasure on the sound, hard to explain, the sound can t escape, it s locked and under control ,distressor give me a bit the same feeling , of under control, locking of the sound in the mix ,where and how you want it..it can sound very in your face and modern but in a nice way imo, its the taming of the peaks, the reduction of the dynamic,transients.. dunno exaclty .. |
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Taisto
IsraTrance Junior Member
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252
Posted : Feb 11, 2012 17:14
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I prefer more limiter than compressor in case that sound has more attack on peaks-> in more sharp cases. When i want so smoothen them into the mix and get it flowing in the same air.
Compressors i mostly use for more pumping and tight mix, when i want things to stop right time more smoothly, limiting their tail, get the funky feeling to the mix, and whats most important; get the mix grooving.
In most cases more volume less limiting is better than pushing too hard with compressor. So i use compressor/limiter more for touching-> for kissing things. |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 17:19
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eqs can give similar feeling too that i was talking about above, they change the dynamic of the sound ..dynamics tools change frequency balance,eq change dynamics..both benefit to be fine tuned toghther when used on a sound.
some hardware eq act even more on dynamics with their tube and/or transformers or signal path, add harmonics.. and i think it s what make all the difference..it hapen even in preamps..,it can give a more finished sound once you run something into it and tweak ,that finished sound, the fact it just sound right is hard to get in software imo just like this.. with nebula it s possible to get close.
with something that tam peaks naturally and give you control on the peak to average ratio, a eq ,a comp and something tthat add harmonics it s probably possible to get similar things that hapen in some gears |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Feb 11, 2012 18:18
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btw would love to know what gear logic bomb used for making the album/mastering? if anyone know the equipment they use..
would love to talk production with these guys i really dig the color of their sound, that is unic , it have something that the rest of my trance playlist is lacking,it don't sound as much itb.... probably few piece of quality equipment well used.. but who know, maybe they have insane ears and get you that sound with only plugs ,really good modern trance production to me. |
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Alien Bug
IsraTrance Junior Member
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682
Posted : Feb 12, 2012 18:43
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