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Why do you like (or dislike) fast (160bpm+) "nuerotrance"
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AumShantiAum
IsraTrance Junior Member
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911
Posted : Jan 15, 2009 23:56
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Goa is good  , and Suomi is rocks  (well some of it lol)
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AumShantiAum
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
27
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911
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 01:38
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On 2009-01-15 23:29, konflux wrote:
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lol, this is Neil buddy. But yeah back to the point, i dont see why we have to call it neurotrance or traumatrance or whatever other names are out there. To me personally its pretty simple; there's a Goa derived sound and a sound thats been influenced by other genres. I like the goa sound.
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Sorry Neil. 
What about the Goa-derived sound influenced by punk rock and gabber? Oh wait, that's Suomi. 
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but in all seriousness, Suomi has sooooo many influences from sooo many different genres, but its main influence has to be Goa
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acplaughs
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98
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 03:19
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I think that alot of people mistake their own subjective experience of certain trance as innate characteristics of the music, some sort of objective aesthetic. Frankly the darkest music to me is empty booty club music, soulless and painful, the best for me is the music that gets us into the woods dancing till the sun comes up. Granted I have my preferences, I tend toward the faster harder less melodic side even when the sun rises, but how absurd is it, in such a small community to let aesthetic bias and closeminded interpretation of one sub-genre over another limit our experiences.
The hollow and emotionless qualities many see in neuro are the same as the hollow empiness I find in much melodic trance, projected and non-objective. If you find depth or don't find depth it is not some innate musical characteristic but your own aesthetic bias.
In the end, it either shakes the dancefloor and moves the people or it doesn't, in the end its just a physical vibration through the air, make what you will of it. |
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mez
IsraTrance Junior Member
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13
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163
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 03:39
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Cum on dood,
Psybooty Bass House is the fastest way to enlightenment hands down.
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DJ Uhm
Started Topics :
7
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147
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 03:48
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On 2009-01-16 03:19, acplaughs wrote:
I think that alot of people mistake their own subjective experience of certain trance as innate characteristics of the music, some sort of objective aesthetic. Frankly the darkest music to me is empty booty club music, soulless and painful, the best for me is the music that gets us into the woods dancing till the sun comes up. Granted I have my preferences, I tend toward the faster harder less melodic side even when the sun rises, but how absurd is it, in such a small community to let aesthetic bias and closeminded interpretation of one sub-genre over another limit our experiences.
The hollow and emotionless qualities many see in neuro are the same as the hollow empiness I find in much melodic trance, projected and non-objective. If you find depth or don't find depth it is not some innate musical characteristic but your own aesthetic bias.
In the end, it either shakes the dancefloor and moves the people or it doesn't, in the end its just a physical vibration through the air, make what you will of it.
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Very well said
 Brian - Uhm
Atrium Obscurum
www.atriumobscurum.com |
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OpenSourceCode
Datavore
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26
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660
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 04:23
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could it be that the vast majority of music in all genres and tempos is terrible, and that we just have to seek out the good shit wherever we can? |
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Eklypz
Started Topics :
7
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359
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 08:30
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I too come from a goth/punk background (80s not this marilyn manson crap ) and about the only time I heard the speed I wanted was at AUM, think Mubali, Dylan, Facehead iirc really took me there. It is such rarity in the midwest that I can hardly comment on it. I like it because it raises my frequency and vibrates my body so much I just kinda pop out of my head and float. There comes a point where it is going so fast it turns slow. Hard to explain these kind of things but that is the gist. The emotive quality of it is the thing for me, I love expression and 200+ bpm is sure expressive. Just raw chaotic energy sometimes and I am in my little bubble watching it g down..
I wish more was brought to the midwest
I also think it is important to have a progression and not have it at 10 AM on the other hand:D |
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BrainLizzard
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779
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 12:07
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On 2009-01-15 09:59, paradigm wrote:
The harder faster darker craze in psy trance exactly mimcks what went on with hardcore back in the mid 90's.
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First, I would like to say as a dancer I have enjoyed your sets which have been few to witness and my pleasure to have had, You took me places.
Secondly, from that rainy night we stayed in the hotel, I learned something from you which allowed me to cross examine my friends intentions outside of that room. Allowing me to realize once again, that everyone's experiences aren't the same nor should they be.
I disagree with anything being mimicked from the mid 90's at this level we are talking at. Yes, there are some tracks in today's times that aren't making any "quantum leaps" just like the 90's. Although i did enjoy some of that sound back then, It Just Wasn't Like It Is Today. Depending on how one thinks, one could say that sound in the mid 90's was psychedelic but not as much as Goa.
Its my belief that the Goa sound is dead/over but its vibration has evolved to less of a sound and more to a feeling per individual or even groups, which would be highly subjective and also very egotistical for someone to say my sound is the spirit of Goa unless by chance they are Elder than you with more experience at what their doing, respect would be more like it. If there is not respect then channel that negative energy where it's welcomed. Unless your talking about the mimicking sounds of NeoGoa.
Oh, I forgot to mention that I have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm delusional as if I'm..... some, sorta GoaGod with elitist values and on the brink of committing Goasyede. Which is not an attempt to deliberately and systematically destroy, in whole or in part, an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group but to end peoples short comings of perception towards something not just i believe in. Lets do something the rest of the World hasn't done, Wake up..
I'm totally kidding, I love this thread and we are on seven pages with only one derailment that was successful caused by an action calculated to frustrate an opponent or gain an advantage indirectly or deviously at most.
Keep It Goan, 4 reelz....
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Trancephonic_Kronik
IsraTrance Junior Member
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24
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391
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 17:31
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I think its funny that people don't like the samples of people screaming and dieing. I love those. I especially love if I can figure out what its from. If you can use those kinda of samples in the right way with the right effects, you can get some pretty trippy shit. Someone at the last party I went to told me he hates samples of babies. I think those are great as well. Kannibal hollocaust does things like this and its really awesome. One track that comes to mind is candy power - m.s.n-upe. I think if you use samples in the right way you can bring in some really cool ideas, like telling stories. Anyone ever hear the dalex mixes??? Also has anyone heard terracore or speedcore? I don't like it but its fucken crazy tho. Like a simple drum beat at 1200 bpm or something sounds a little ridiculus. Almost as ridiculus as noise. |
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FaceHead
FaceHead
Started Topics :
129
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1555
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 19:07
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ya i heard a track that was 666bpmand the only thing close to psychedelic was the breakdowns the music itself sounded like someone forcing gears to jam
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Deep-Fryer
IsraTrance Junior Member
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26
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304
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 19:37
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Goddamit Chuck... "Forcing Gears to Jam" was the title of my most recent nanotech-related article due for contribution to Scientific American... Now I have to change it cause I know your litigious ass will sue me silly. Curses
{':' }Deep Fryer/Squirmtronix{ ':'}
["0,c]Global DAT/Adama Recs/Esoteric Gen[c,0"]
(>x<!)soundcloud.com/squirmtronix(!>x<) |
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MR VOMERS
Moderator
Started Topics :
36
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2094
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 20:56
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On 2009-01-12 21:55, FaceHead wrote:
i wanna say bravo lizzard.
ok check it. I make music that is between 100-196 so far is my highest. I have a 191bpm track that is way easier to swallow than some 140 bpm ones. Look at yourselves. you are destroying your own ability to enjoy any moment that is currently happening to you by going into them with predetermined attitudes. you know before you think it sucks that its gonna suck becasue you said i think alll of that music sucks and its trying to murder me based off of a handful or even a single experience. yes lizzard is right there is a speed threshold to dance you follow the kick drum till you can and then cut your time in half so you are slowly and calmly enjoying music at high speeds....white noise is absolute chaos yet it gets to a point where it is so chaotic that it is calm any of you who have ever had a severe psychedelic experience can relate im sure to that. But you cant get to that point if you cant break through that wall of chaos that is trying to scare you away. Point is yes there is some hail satan childish nonsense out there but that does not mean fast music or neuro is anything more that what you are perceiving it as at the moment.. in the same set ive had people come up to me and say dudee killlarrrghh keep darkness alive or whatever then ive had people come up and say that was beautiful. so perhaps having opinions of whether or not to automatically like or dislike anything that your mechanical brain organizes into categories in endless file cabinets of likes and dislikes so you can predict whether or not you want to make your life more efficient by never doing anyhting that you think you may not like with an open mind and essentially open eyes. ok so sort that mess out if youd like. to answer the original question. i like some of it but will never determine that based off of its speed, label, artwork, intensity, etc.
There are artists on all sides that are pushing a less than psychedelic adgenda its up to us to pick and choose artists NOT styles to support. Its also up to us on the contrary to stop supporting artists leeching off of the scene.
I saw gil inside in new york and i was almost offended by it...then fast forward a year later had a very important life changing experience in the oregon outdoors. my point is that if i wouldnt have made myself present for that awakening by going to see an artist play who offended me the first time then i wouldnt have had it and would be a much different person.... other than that for you people to be placing gil as the figure head for that kinda music youve chosen to not like is not really fair he is a person separate and different he is not dark glitchy whatever trance. just some guy.
ditch your predetemined instincts to control you reality by not letting anything thing in you havent scientifically decided was the best plausible option for you. yes acceptance isnt just for druggies anymore its for everyone. The only way to peace is through your acceptance of any circumstance if you are able to accept that then no situation even ones your brain frowns upon will be without benefit.
To predetermine things is to keep your advancment in a feedback loop.
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WARNING: The Reality Master General has determined that Mr. Vomit may significantly alter your reality. Usage of the knowledge provided by Mr. Vomit may be perceived as dangerous and subversive by those in authority. |
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vaxination
Started Topics :
2
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262
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 21:18
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On 2009-01-16 19:37, Deep-Fryer wrote:
Goddamit Chuck... "Forcing Gears to Jam" was the title of my most recent nanotech-related article due for contribution to Scientific American... Now I have to change it cause I know your litigious ass will sue me silly. Curses
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lmao, the frair emerges to lay down the law.
welcome to the debate sir!
on a different note
I think that once you get above 160 I go into drum and bass mode and automatically start chopping shit in half. since I cant keep up to 160 but can keep up to 80 etc.. so a 190 track is really only like 95bpm and busy..
I dont like throwing limits on the BPM people, I dont care how fast you make it, but as LOUD put it, would someone show me some kind of creativity!?!?
thats all I want. something weirder, yet funkier, yet more pulled apart, yet better put together, than anything I've heard yet. take all the elements of all the genres you love and combine them with the base that retains that goa sound and please do post the track so we can give er a listen.
I'm kind of sick of seperation, there is a need for classification so you have some Idea what you are getting into, but really, half the fun is almost having no idea what you are in for in the first place. I think chuck got it right, blow our minds with weirdness again people, what happened to the good old days when there was no predicting this shit?
I've started hopping genres midset just to keep it interesting, and as long as its psychedelic I dont see a problem with it. if I want to throw some psy breaks in the middle of my trance set, well the kids could probably use a break themselves, I just want to see people pushing the envelope not necessarily the sound barrier with supersonic speed.
when it gets to the point where I'm thinking, do I need meth to enjoy this track, then I think we have derailed the movement abit.. I mean if hardcore trancers are getting headaches, then maybe its too much? but you know, thats a subjective opinion, and honestly, I'm not going to not go to a party because one person plays something I personally cant gel with, I'll just go retreat for a set and grill up a burger and drink a beer and sit it out until Its back on a track I can follow.
I guess thats my point, regardless of what your doing, push it, prod it, poke it, make it different, make it weird, and I'll give it a chance.
one thing I've noticed is instead of a overall progression over the night, like a big sine wave, parties lately have seemed to have many smaller waves, like each set is its own progression upward and then lulls down as the next one starts and then rises again into its own peak and this continues so the night has multiple plateaus.. I think its just part of the overall frequency increasing.
.:.vaxination.:.
vaxination@gmail.com
esoteric generation/beatnik productions |
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adamzero
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Posted : Jan 16, 2009 21:52
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many posts back now i tried to make the point that you have to separate the sheer BPMs from the lack of a pitch-based melody. i should have added violent samples.
what is usually called dark trance nearly always is faster than full-on, does not have a pitch-based melody, and may or may not have the violent samples.
when people say they dislike it, they mean for one or more of those three reasons:
1) high BPMs
2) lack of pitch-based melody
3) violent samples
so if you like or you don't like, it might help to be specific about what you like or don't like.
for example: i'm in it for 2); 1) is optional as far as i'm concerned; and i frickin' hate 3).
/rant
honestly, in terms of 3)-- i've have an "its just my opinion that i feel strongly about" moment now-- what are people thinking? people are on f*cked up and you want to play samples of people dying? seriously? what are you thinking? this has gotta be because the producers have never been to a lovely trance party. sit on the beach in arambol and try to even imagine such a sound-- you can't, it has no place. whatever you think trance "means", one of the reasons we like it, i think most would agree, is the sense of human connection we're surprised to find at parties. violence is about human dis-connection in its most extreme form. let's have none of that.
rant/
in terms of terminology:
neurotrance seems as good as any term.
psyreviews liked to use 'powertrance', which was pretty good.
psycore seems apt, too-- that's my personal favorite for the highest bpm versions, on analogy with hardcore.
horror trance describes the violent sample filled trance, i think.
and i reserve dark for anything without a pitch-based melody.
let's realize though that there is no 'right' way to name (sub)genres. |
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bastardsamadhi
Started Topics :
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437
Posted : Jan 16, 2009 22:22
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this seems a bit odd, "dark" being WAY too specific an adjective to describe such a general set as "non-pitch-based"....
another important point on this topic would be that said "non-pitch-based" elements very often, in fact, *ARE* pitched! (unless they are completely *acyclic* / irregular -- essentially noise).
the elements i feel you are referring to in "non-melodic trance" are often a result of various FM synthesis techniques, essentially boiling down to "pitch multiplication."
sample manipulation of "found sounds," another common technique for manufacture of said "non-pitch-based" elements, is also very often based on sounds whose pitch(es) is/are defined, even if varying within the sample.
the question is:
is the artist aware of the harmonic relationships of said sounds -- or are they just randomly applying these varying pitches in their supposed "non-pitch-based" elements?
analogy:
does the drummer tune his drumset?
does he make melodies?
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On 2009-01-16 21:52, adamzero wrote:
and i reserve dark for anything without a pitch-based melody.
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