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Where do you think trance music is headed?
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shellbound
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
14
Posts :
601
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 20:29
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On 2009-09-19 01:12, psytones wrote:
wow wouldn't that be cool Freeflow, if someone took the time and effort to make a psytrance track/show with real/live drummers, people on different blowhorns mimicing synth's with people on effects etc etc and woow, in my head this sounds so fucking rad, like thhe term killer would need to get a upgrade.
Of cource, for the person controling the hihat, the person doing the kick. Must be hard work following the trance rythm, but if someone hadpulled it off, I would be moping for the rest of my life. I once saw a band doing D'n'B with live instruments, so it's doible, i think ..
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alarm_will_sound
if they can pull off Aphex Twin, everything else is just...
  https://soundcloud.com/dead-end-dance
https://soundcloud.com/shellbound |
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Suloo
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
87
Posts :
2822
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 21:37
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@Freeflow
orchestra trance or in general all this band stuff..blabla
in trance music is not my thing..its already there actualy if you did not realize..sun project and some others do it quite well..
back to the roots with tape maschine and cut the bands with razorblades and stuff has kinda vintage style but is then again just affordable for a very few, so im very happy with all this computer stuff etc..
what i mentioned with control the music/sequencer just with your mind is kinda this style here..(sorry german only)
http://www.u-he.com/sim/sim.html
by Urs Heckmann
have a look maybe you like it as well..its pretty futuristic but a nice idea i think..
for english rewies on that thing just google (semantics in music9.. 
cheers
-------......-------...-..-..-..-.-.-.-.- |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 21:39
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rich
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
103
Posts :
2184
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 22:56
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Good point.
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On 2009-09-22 21:39, Elad wrote:
if you BUY your favorite cds it will go to great direction.
dont - and all u have left with is the cheesy crappy commercial shit.
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and cheesy crappy darkpsy 
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 23:35
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Quote:
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On 2009-09-22 21:37, Zork wrote:
@Freeflow
orchestra trance or in general all this band stuff..blabla
in trance music is not my thing..its already there actualy if you did not realize..sun project and some others do it quite well..
back to the roots with tape maschine and cut the bands with razorblades and stuff has kinda vintage style but is then again just affordable for a very few, so im very happy with all this computer stuff etc..
what i mentioned with control the music/sequencer just with your mind is kinda this style here..(sorry german only)
http://www.u-he.com/sim/sim.html
by Urs Heckmann
have a look maybe you like it as well..its pretty futuristic but a nice idea i think..
for english rewies on that thing just google (semantics in music9..
cheers
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Sorry man if i came on to driven, though its still my opinion, and read my post again and point me to that band. Have you heard sufi trance? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sufism their core beliefs is kind of nice..
http://www.iktara.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8&Itemid=2
But they dont use any electronics, just drums and probably some bells and stuff, but i believe you can expand on this and add more instruments and make real nice trance...
just some ideas from my side...
i accept your opinion and if you dont like mine lets not take this any further 
and to add i already use my mind when creating music, i would not like to connect anything to my head which read my electric signals and create noise out it..
cheers
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Sep 22, 2009 23:38
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Quote:
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On 2009-09-22 21:39, Elad wrote:
if you BUY your favorite cds it will go to great direction.
dont - and all u have left with is the cheesy crappy commercial shit.
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Thats just not true IMO! sorry Elad
The last thing that will be left is that kind of music... i mean how can commercial music survive without people buying Cds?
There will be only free great music from free great people! that have no intention in pursuing this road to hell! hehe
But sure you should support your favorite artists, but there are lots of ways doing that...
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Sep 23, 2009 12:51
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Quote:
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On 2009-09-22 23:38, Freeflow wrote:
Quote:
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On 2009-09-22 21:39, Elad wrote:
if you BUY your favorite cds it will go to great direction.
dont - and all u have left with is the cheesy crappy commercial shit.
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Thats just not true IMO! sorry Elad
The last thing that will be left is that kind of music... i mean how can commercial music survive without people buying Cds?
There will be only free great music from free great people! that have no intention in pursuing this road to hell! hehe
But sure you should support your favorite artists, but there are lots of ways doing that...
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neh dude.
pay.
or the artist have to go to work, no time for new music , less inspiration etc.
you will left with "weekend" musicians. for free. and the music will sound cheap.
what is "lots of ways" to support?? join the myspace page? send comment?
if you help to get full paid gig then ok i will even give u free cd but you dont expect people to actualy donate their work since you think its cooler?
so its all going down to this what to do. no labels will buy album that sell 200 copies , sure wont pay for this. but for 500 allready BIG difference this why i think each fan makes a difference.
and with all respect to free realeses (i did a few) its hardly help in anything compare to established labels.
oh yeah , and hooray to all tibetian bowls but its far from expensive synths monitoring and all you need to make electronic music in semi-pro-level. offcourse for trance we want the synthesis and hi-tech. www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Dogon
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
50
Posts :
8779
Posted : Sep 23, 2009 12:58
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yea agreed: pay for music & it gets better!
We were born naked & grow up to become wicked. |
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
Posts :
1848
Posted : Sep 23, 2009 13:23
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I agree with Elad. He is very right.
I'll share a bit about my personal story.
Right now I am an American living in Germany, registered with the government as an "independent english teacher". Unfortunately, the teaching jobs I am limited to are contractor-style work, which means I can't get a normal job doing anything else, limiting me to support myself on now-and-then style work which comes and goes... and when it goes, I'm eating canned tomatoes until it comes around again.
Where I was living in America, the economy is so bad that I could not find a job where I could get more than 30 hours a week at $8 an hour. Even with a Linguistics degree. Here, I am at least able to make roughly the same money, working less hours, and doing something that actually benefits people instead of some US corporation. I LOVE to give music out for free, and I LOVE to do bookings for free, but if every artist did this all the time, they'd either starve, their music would suck horribly until their gear breaks and they can't replace it, and somebody ELSE would step in to make money off of their art (for example, sites like Rapidshare, who make money from the corporate advertisements they get paid to host and to flash at you while you're busy downloading gigs worth of low-quality psytrance mp3's for free).
That being said, if it were not for my music, I would not be able to survive here whatsoever. I HAVE to charge for bookings so I can eat, and I can no longer simply give my music out for free even though most of my tracks in the past are available for free for all to download. As it is, what money does not go into my savings to improve/replace my gear goes to buying pasta and canned tomatoes.
Yes, it's true that I would be making music even if I were still working a shit job and never leaving my bedroom. But is that what artists, especially artists who make music people the world over look for, deserve? No.
If I did not ask for donation or payment for music or bookings, like Elad said, my music would be cheaper, not made on the best gear, and I would not have the time or energy because of my real-life obligations to make it the best I possibly could.
It's mainly because people today feel like they should not have to pay for music they like and just download it for free that the following occur:
1.) Labels cannot release a single CD without losing hundreds and hundreds of euros. These days it is almost always a losing proposition for an artist or label to release music. Therefore labels are limited to what they can scrounge from artists for free, the artwork suffers as they must seek this out for free, also the mastering, so on, so on. The whole scene suffers. Fewer actual CDs are pressed, and more music becomes net-based which lets it fall in the hands of greedy pirates and illegal downloaders that much faster.
2. Artists cannot rely on the time and energy they put into their art to be able to put bread on their table. Therefore, out of survival, they have to work shitty jobs and long hours, make do with second-rate gear to do their art on, and they have less time and energy to improve themselves and make the music better.
So... if you think you are a.) too cool, b.) aren't hurting anything by doing it, c.) feel entitled to free music from your favorite artists for whatever reason you can think of, then you should rethink your "contribution" and "support" of what you claim to love so much. If you can't afford a measly 1 euro per track download or 10 - 15 euros for a CD, well, there really is no excuse for you, and it's pathetic to take that as permission to just download it from some download site as if it were yours and yo had some right to do it. It's pathetic, really, because the truth is for the individual, 1 - 15 euros is nothing, but when you simply download for free instead of showing the artist some REAL support for the music from them you like, what you are doing is taking time and energy straight out of the hands of the people making this music and giving nothing back, and, in MY opinion, this is some severe disrespect, greed, and hypocrisy on your part.
P.S. Maybe I'm making a gross, unfair generalization here, but I think it's a safe bet that MOST people who listen to psytrance spend far more money on DRUGS than on the MUSIC they enjoy while on or off drugs. Yet this is considered perfectly okay, and acceptable, and never talked about. Why? Especially when the people REALLY making the money are the drug dealers, who on the average tend to be a LOT more unsavory than the average psytrance producer.
Here's an honest question for anyone willing to answer honestly. I'm mainly asking this to put things in perspective for a lot of people, not to blame or point fingers. (Hell, I'm no saint, I do drugs too, but when I have the choice to improve my gear or get more music versus buy drugs, I always go for the music.)
How much did YOU spend in the past year on drugs (including tobacco and alcohol) than on the music you claim to be all passionate and spiritual about? |
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Upavas
Upavas
Started Topics :
150
Posts :
3315
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 04:31
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Dogon
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
50
Posts :
8779
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 17:59
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Off all the music i have 80% is paid & 15-17% from friends 3-5% downloaded for free!
But yea, i spend more on alcohol & tobacco than music for sure!
I spend almost everyday on alcohol & tobacco but i dont buy music everyday!
We were born naked & grow up to become wicked. |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 19:53
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Of course you agree, you want money, i understand...
but there are professional musicians who could live without hi tech stuff and just play music... if that would make the world better...
i mean there are chemicals in all this electronics and its not so good for mother nature... But like you care cause you will die and who gives about the children that also going to live a life on this earth...
really.. i bet i can make as good music as you can elad and axis... and release it for free if i soo much want to release it... thats just a ego thing.. ohh i released my music look at me!! whoho... I make music for my self, and of course i think its nice if someone else like it, but its not that important really.. its my expression!
work is boring.. who wants to work really? i dont, i want to just play music all day long, eat good food, play with children, flirt with women.. smell the flowers, enjoy the nature... yeah but i live in this world where money is king.... too bad
If you want to keep going like this and just be another release amongst all this mega amount of releases.. go on! i wont buy your cds, i wont even listen to your music.. why should i.. all you are interested in is to get your music sold, too many people are interested in that...
i could go buy some Cds and support some artists! its nice... sure i should respect that they have this music thing as a work...
but music is holy and you should not force anyone to pay for it, we all have a right to hear it and enjoy it...
if you dont like that, keep your music to your self and dont let anyone hear it... maybe put a gun to their head after you played the music for them and demand money?
nah its just whack, but it is how it is...
nothing is free for some people... im happy there are people that think its okej to do things for free...
with the knowledge that you will get something back in the long run... and even if not it wont matter...
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 22:13
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your additue is lame. you assume stuff that is SO far from reality. then base your theory on that assumption.
oh sorry yes i forgot me asking for people who enjoy to buy the cd is what cause WWII also not only global warming and poluting the earth.
and yeah thatss the best - "forcing" people to buy. i truely broke yesterday someone nose for not buying my album. LOL. dude. comeon!
i know over 20.000 people download all i say 10% that will buy can make X3 more of that stuff to realese. thats it!
everyone need and deserve to eat (more then listen to music IMO) but food still cost money... wow surprise. worry on what really matter.
so please make sense from now on.
to the other part .. to tell you my numbers will be 'show of' for ego right?
so i wont do it 
instead you can start guess how much i make from play music all day long, eat good food, play with children, flirt with women.. smell the flowers, enjoy the nature... oh yeah and travel the world to festivals. the real hard part
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and the truth is i think psy is not going anywhere realy. everytime its developed its allready called with other name. very close minded crowd. so music get better , psy stay the same.
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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Axis Mundi
Axis Mundi
Started Topics :
75
Posts :
1848
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 22:19
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I think you may have misunderstood me.
Like I said, in case you missed it, most of my music is available for free for public download (want links? PM me. ), save one EP that is technically up for sale (at 0.99 euros per track download, wooooww! Of which I will see almost nothing of... Maybe I can retire soon ), but I give for free to anyone who has asked. But maybe you missed that part in my earlier post because you had already formed your opinion ahead of time instead of being open to what people who have a bit more experience in the field have than you.
I know I won't make money from my released music. To me it's more of a calling card, saying, "Hey, if you like this music, contact me and book me at your next event. "
I think painting me and Elad in a stereotype like this:
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i mean there are chemicals in all this electronics and its not so good for mother nature... But like you care cause you will die and who gives about the children that also going to live a life on this earth... |
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... is a bit unfair. You don't know what sort of lifestyles we lead, who we are, or not.
Yes, I agree, work is boring. Nobody wants to do it. But I've determined to make the most of it, and music is helping me do that. I have work opportunities here in Germany, working with kids and teaching them English... that is, being a positive influence in their lives... that I didn't have in the States. It's certainly a lot better than standing behind a gas pump or a friolator. However because of the laws, I'm not allowed to work enough to actually support myself. So for the time being as I work to better my situation even further, money from bookings is very important to me.
As it is, I can tell you that I charge a LOT less than most live acts in Europe. Part of it is because as a live act, I'm "new" and not well known. Part of it is because I have other means of income and I don't need to charge a lot, so why should I? On the other hand, what happens if I'm at a booking, and a piece of my gear breaks? Gets stolen? Whatever? Gear isn't cheap. If I'm booked at a 10,000 person party where everyone is paying 40 euro entry, there's nothing wrong with asking for 200 euros for the booking. Where should all that money go, in your opinion? (Actually, I recently played at Indian Spirit here in Germany... 9000 attendance at 45 euro a head, and I only asked for transport money for myself and a DJ friend who played as well, and the promoter only gave us half the money, leaving us paying 200 euros out of our pocket to get home. What's your opinion on that?)
Things that are holy cost money, too. Believe me, I understand that. So do quite a few other live acts, such as Elad, I'm sure. But I don't think you understand what producers/live acts go through to do bookings and make music sometimes. It's not easy, for sure, but I do it because I love it.
If I were interested in making money, I would have invested thousands of dollars and years of time and energy into getting a lucrative degree or a more sound investment strategy than synth-ware. But I didn't, because, again, I love what I'm doing.
I feel really sad that it seems you didn't read or think too much about our posts, because maybe you would at least respect our opinions even if you don't disagree with them.
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| i could go buy some Cds and support some artists! its nice... sure i should respect that they have this music thing as a work...
but music is holy and you should not force anyone to pay for it, we all have a right to hear it and enjoy it... |
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No, you're not entitled to those things. What you hear is the result of time, energy and sacrifice of the people who made it for you. It's too bad that you expressed that you have no respect for things that you feel are holy and you don't feel the need to support that. That's exactly the attitude I was speaking about... people who take and take and don't give back because they feel it's their right to do so or something and the people who go out of their way to make music for you to listen to (if you choose) are soulless automatons who are an endless fountain of energy for people to drink from and don't deserve anything in return. Maybe your favorite baker and candy maker should just be giving you their finest creations because you deserve to have them for free just by existing? After all, food is rather holy also in terms of its necessity in keeping you alive. It's tragic that people unquestioningly give their money out every day for all sorts of things but when it comes to music, the people who make it should just be left high and dry and they are somehow wrong for asking for anything for it. Maybe I'm wrong about what you're trying to say, but that's the way I take it.
Lastly, nobody is "forcing" you to buy anything. If you don't want to listen to our music, don't. The choice is yours. I won't lose sleep over it even though I'd be happy if you did, whether you liked it or not.
If you think you can make good music, I believe you can also. I urge you to go ahead and do it. I'd be happy to hear your results, so when you do, feel free to send me a mail. I'm certain that the more deeply you delve into it and the more you put into it, your opinions will change drastically. I hope you do do that and you let us know how it all turns out, when you see how much really goes into it.
Peace, brother.
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
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3709
Posted : Sep 24, 2009 23:13
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Hey Elad, yes my attitude was pretty lame And Axis im sorry i reacted too strong in this matter, it came out a bit wrong.. i tend to get too driven sometimes and i really should learn to control it..
I hope you guys forgive me and understand that i just think that things are a little to focused on selling and too focused on the "future" of electronics and all these gadgets..
To be honest of all my gear i am most happy with my handdrums and classical guitar... they give me most pleassure and peace... and freedom of expression..
No hard feelings?
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