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Underground=Another Word For Bad Music?
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Justin Chaos
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
117
Posts :
3086
Posted : Dec 14, 2004 17:03
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Your case it's absolutely different Margherita,we're talking about people with no idea...and you're a professional musician,different case I would say.
  My fake plants died, because I did not pretend to water them. |
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Zombi
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
375
Posts :
5032
Posted : Dec 14, 2004 20:35
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on the contrary u can ask "if commercial means bad music ?" which is not as well as underground is not a bad music. bad music is bad music, good music is good music, its doesnt realy importent how many copies its sell in this period of time.
also if once underground was somehow means low fi/not quality sound so today with hi fi home studios its also unrelevant descussion.
underground means or forward thinking or not good enough as well, both.
Believe your soul ! |
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deejayridoo
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
14
Posts :
309
Posted : Dec 14, 2004 21:27
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Quote:
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On 2004-12-12 17:14, Nomolos(Zenon Rec.) wrote:
Underground is NOT a Genre!!! it is a Way of life and Concept in self expression in a non Conformist way!
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i just wanted those WORDS OF WISDOM to be repeated. 
this is what "underground" is all about.
close to PUNK ATTITUDE (and here again, in itīs original meaning, not in itīs sold-out or "miserable beggar" version!)
respect, my friend!  |
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mubali
Mubali
Started Topics :
71
Posts :
2219
Posted : Dec 15, 2004 00:26
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There are quite a few reasons why some artists are not released. It could be that their music isn't appropriate for the sound of the label they sent to, or maybe the track got leaked onto the internet... Maybe the artist themselves felt that they just wanted to share their music with people rather than worrying about the semantics of sending off to a label. Of course it could be that the artist did not communicate their idea well enough for it to be received by a mass market.
Getting music released isn't just about writing good music that enough people will like enough to purchase the cd, there is a complicated social interaction network that holds true with any type of social-political group. Some people don't know enough individuals to properly market their music. I know that when I started writing music, I hardly knew anyone label wise that was truly interested in taking chances with new artists. That's when smaller labels really work for the community as a whole. These labels are much more willing to experiment with someone new than more established labels. Hell, if it weren't for these small labels, I would be one of those "underground artists" that is getting so much flak in this thread.
The reason why I write music is to communicate my thoughts and feelings about a particular subject or emotion. (Isn't that why artists create art?)
I don't expect all of my ideas to be accepted by the entire community, I don't expect everyone to completely understand the perspective I am coming from either. But I would much rather communicate my ideas and not have people fully grasp the concepts that I am putting forth than not to express myself whatsoever.
There are lots of artists here in this world and not all of them will have a perspective that you will like or agree with. However I do respect that person for making the attempt to put their perspective out there in the open for people to at least try and comprehend. I feel that most artists do what they do not so that everyone will like what they have to say, but to say what is on their mind and hopefully there will be someone out there that understands what they are trying to communicate. Does someone have to be a released artist to make decent music? I don't think so, but from the general tone of this thread it seems if they aren't considered good quality by one of the more established labels, then they aren't really considered artists.
And without getting into the whole light vs dark thing again... If you like someones music, cool. If you don't, that's cool to. But I feel that to slap a general term onto something just because it doesn't fit someone's ideal of what they want contradicts the concept of art as a whole.
An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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SiENiS
Sienis
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
47
Posted : Jan 4, 2005 16:51
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i duno if ya guys wanna hear my opinion or not, but here it is, IMPOSED on you! teeheee ;D
i personally think thereīs TONS of good unreleased and TRULY psychedelic musik out there thatīs not being released because of the fact that labels usually donīt have the balls (nor the money) to release anything different because it might not sell as much.... sad but true...
thereīs just too many unspoken RULES in the musicmaking process that people forget to have fun with the waves... which kills the whole idea of the word "psychedelic"
psychedelic for me is that what you cannot predict in advance, what you CANīT expect beforehand!
and honestly most of the so-called psychedelic music is VERY predictable....
i mean sometimes iīm not sure if iīm at a technoclub or a psytrance party... and the only thing that gives it away is the tighter sound of psy and the fact that techno tracks donīt have rolling basslines....
but.... BUT.. the real psy is coming back with a frigginī vengance!!! =D
we got kids who get to play around with musik in the early age when their brains arenīt yet too boring and full of strict ideas... big thanx to software etc...
i think the message here is to never really grow up... atleast not if it means you gotta stop having fun!!!!
because fun is what makes life worth living in my opinion 
thanx.. infinite love to all of you |
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SiENiS
Sienis
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
47
Posted : Jan 4, 2005 17:02
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also mubali: u make a really good point there...
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The reason why I write music is to communicate my thoughts and feelings about a particular subject or emotion. (Isn't that why artists create art?)
I don't expect all of my ideas to be accepted by the entire community, I don't expect everyone to completely understand the perspective I am coming from either. But I would much rather communicate my ideas and not have people fully grasp the concepts that I am putting forth than not to express myself whatsoever.
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this is what i think many artists stopped doing because they want to be liked and understood like any other human being.... not saying this is the right way tho.....
i mean when i play at a party and i play some of my more... umm.. weird and crazy tunes... loads of people might stop dancing totally and look at me like i was joking, with an expression saying, "hey my dancestyle doesnīt fit this BPM! whatīs wrong with you?!" (or they might just not like the melodies, what do i know
but, see... iīm happy as long as thereīs ONE person goinī off to those tracks, because that means i have made a CONNECTION with this person... this person understands what iīm trying to express!!!
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mubali
Mubali
Started Topics :
71
Posts :
2219
Posted : Jan 5, 2005 02:10
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Very True Sienis... A lot of artists seem to get caught up in the hype of being an artist.
It really breaks down to a person asking themselves why they started writing music.
An Eagle may soar, but Weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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Elad
Tsabeat/Sattel Battle
Started Topics :
158
Posts :
5306
Posted : Jan 6, 2005 06:09
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have to agree with sienis here ...
and detox.. i think there is million good trax u will never listen to... too bad for u ... 
hope u find commercial "best seller" to realy be good music (i actually think label no.1 is mikseri and antiskarp so...)
www.sattelbattle.com
http://yoavweinberg.weebly.com/ |
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sam i am
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
712
Posted : Jan 6, 2005 08:13
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Quote:
| On 2004-12-12 01:19, DETOX wrote:
Was speaking with an artist friend of mine today and we were talking about this new trend of most of the artists (mostly new artists that cant release anything anywhere) naming their music underground trance.
He said to me that in our days underground is another word for bad and low quality music and suddenly i found myself 100% with his words.
I mean i see so many artists in our days producing really bad music that i cant even call trance and they label it as underground dark trance and are so proud of it because they feel like a special mystic part of the psy trance scene and even have an attitude towards all the other psy trance styles,especially full on.
Does anynone share the same thoughts like me out there or is it just me that is fed up with this situation? |
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 you knob - underground can just as easily be another word for music that is FUCKING AWESOME but hasn't received "mainstream" attention yet.
new Hadal Drop album on the way
if you don't have the last one get in touch |
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SiENiS
Sienis
Started Topics :
4
Posts :
47
Posted : Jan 6, 2005 18:56
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i mean sure... EVERYTHING is relative...
theres really no such thing as bad or good music... only different points of view....
but on the other hand it does depend on WHAT you listen for in a track... what makes YOU decide if itīs bad or not?
i mean think of it... try to explain to your friend whoīs all "Acoustic music is the only real/natural music!" (acting like guitars grow on trees or something)
synths were never made to emulate acoustic instruments in the beginning... it was made to create NEW sounds... so if youīre listening to psytrance to hear lodsa acoustic stuff, youīll be mighty dissapointed for the most part....
but now if we are talking about soundquality in general.... YES a lot of unreleased stuff is badly mixed... BUUUUUUT.... that doesnīt give anyone the right to say that ALL unreleased/underground music sux.... to defend these people who might not know how to mix everything properly YET, i have to say ATLEAST IT FUCKINī JAMS!!!!!!...
these people put some fuckin HEART in their musik....
and now, if we exclude the ones that havenīt yet learned to properly mix, what we got left is LOADS OF KILLER PSYTRANCE ARTISTS!!! who should indeed be out there for the whole world to enjoy!
and as EVERYTHING is relative and most people havenīt even heard a FRACTION of what is out there.... donīt give an opinion on things u know nothing about....
take more time to actually give it a shot and not just listen to whatever mp3s your friend happens to have on his computer....
to mention a few of those artists that have not released music, just from the top of my head:
-cOsm
-Zekazy
-Aum3
-this DJ Hazeīs sideproject i canīt recall the name of at this moment
-Styphic
-Dreadlock Tales
-Astrosnautchers
-Troll Scientists
-Spiralix
-Atma
-Logarytm
-Shamaniacs
-toaST3d
well yeah, i could go on forever if i hadnt such a smoked up memory
ALL of them KIX ASS BEYOND DOUBT and got GREAT sound....
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Maska
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
27
Posts :
869
Posted : Jan 7, 2005 03:03
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In short, undergorund's definition is not bad or shitty music......
Underground can be better than commercial music, or vice verse, period...The two (underground and bad) do not have the same meaning, so therefore have nothing to do with each other.....
Underground music simply means that which is not on the popular circuit and you can even add the word yet to some of them....
I think it's silly for a label person to get up here and try to bad mouth undergorund music the way a SONY exec would.....You know they aren't the same thing, so why make it seem that way?
assumption is the mother of all fuckups. |
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PRAECOX
Bigwigs
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
346
Posted : Jan 7, 2005 18:39
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On 2003-02-25 21:22, DETOX wrote:
Also a fact is that artists that dont manage to release anything (plus their friends) always complain about the 'musical situation' the 'labels' the 'labels friends' and the 'music industry'.
If you have something good send it to labels and they will release it unless they are so stupid and rich and dont want to sell good music and make more profits.
An artist with not many previous releases or not releases at all that makes a label just to release his and his friends music is nothing more than an arrogant person who thinks that he is a good musician while he is not.
If something is good people sooner or later appreciate it,its just a matter of time.
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...DETOX man! your problem has got 2 years already!
*i'm impressed*
"Soft as possible" - Morton Feldman
http://jurekprzezdziecki.net/ |
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PRAECOX
Bigwigs
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
346
Posted : Jan 7, 2005 18:46
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Quote:
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On 2004-12-15 00:26, mubali wrote:
There are quite a few reasons why some artists are not released. It could be that their music isn't appropriate for the sound of the label they sent to, or maybe the track got leaked onto the internet... Maybe the artist themselves felt that they just wanted to share their music with people rather than worrying about the semantics of sending off to a label. Of course it could be that the artist did not communicate their idea well enough for it to be received by a mass market.
Getting music released isn't just about writing good music that enough people will like enough to purchase the cd, there is a complicated social interaction network that holds true with any type of social-political group. Some people don't know enough individuals to properly market their music. I know that when I started writing music, I hardly knew anyone label wise that was truly interested in taking chances with new artists. That's when smaller labels really work for the community as a whole. These labels are much more willing to experiment with someone new than more established labels. Hell, if it weren't for these small labels, I would be one of those "underground artists" that is getting so much flak in this thread.
The reason why I write music is to communicate my thoughts and feelings about a particular subject or emotion. (Isn't that why artists create art?)
I don't expect all of my ideas to be accepted by the entire community, I don't expect everyone to completely understand the perspective I am coming from either. But I would much rather communicate my ideas and not have people fully grasp the concepts that I am putting forth than not to express myself whatsoever.
There are lots of artists here in this world and not all of them will have a perspective that you will like or agree with. However I do respect that person for making the attempt to put their perspective out there in the open for people to at least try and comprehend. I feel that most artists do what they do not so that everyone will like what they have to say, but to say what is on their mind and hopefully there will be someone out there that understands what they are trying to communicate. Does someone have to be a released artist to make decent music? I don't think so, but from the general tone of this thread it seems if they aren't considered good quality by one of the more established labels, then they aren't really considered artists.
And without getting into the whole light vs dark thing again... If you like someones music, cool. If you don't, that's cool to. But I feel that to slap a general term onto something just because it doesn't fit someone's ideal of what they want contradicts the concept of art as a whole.
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...i would say that is really sad that some artists have to explain a A&R ppl (responsible for discovering a hidden talents) from the label, some BASIC things.
...i'm just suprised that he is still has his job!
"Soft as possible" - Morton Feldman
http://jurekprzezdziecki.net/ |
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Lithium
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
646
Posted : Jan 7, 2005 18:59
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good music is good music as simple as that, as bad music is bad music, it has nothing to do with the style of music itself, really nothing at all.
you have good full on and bad full on, as you have good dark underground trance and bad underground trance, just a matter of taste, and everyone has its own, and has nothing to do with good or bad. i think good or bad has only to do with quality of the song, no matter ones taste...
if everyone now just started to make dark trance then dark underground would be comercial, and full on would be the other face of the coin ...loll
i think that one person can easily see that one music is good or bad even not liking the style, i donīt like full on that much anymore, but when i hear a full on track which is actually well built, which has a story, good eq, then i cannot say this is a bad music even though i donīt like it... |
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DETOX
Moderator
Started Topics :
296
Posts :
6194
Posted : Jan 7, 2005 21:26
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Praecox i dont know about which problem are you talking about but i would like to inform you that i dont work for anyone anymore,i got my own label
Toodaloo Motherfuckers!!!!! |
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