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Trance vs Money - who win ?
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 15:33
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pipe&slippers can you please leave me focus on whatever i want? do i have to read always hints and tips here on isratrance what do i have to stop doing?????? if i want to fucking focus on the underground then i will do it and i dont need diazepams to get my head blurred with the shitty nice sides of life that simply dont exist anymore. okey? thank you. good luck with the winner. buy the whole world with it and make the best studios:) then be the next goa pope. nothing personal. just wish you luck with your visions. hope there are people to buy still left
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ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 17:21
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On 2008-11-16 19:13, Soul Kontakt wrote:
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On 2008-11-12 21:26, ocelot wrote:
sure bro- good advice for yuppies slaving every day just to pay for their car payments and their apartment and condo and beachhouse/....
but where did you get your clavia nord lead and modular synthesizers you use?
and where did you get your computer?
and your studio monitors?
you used money.
and honestly i dont need any of your hardware to make good music. i can do it with my macbookpro and cubase4 only. thats fine for me. so i could actually say i use less money than you do.
and you give your music away for free. thats great. do you give away ALL your music? will you do that forever? and should we all do that?
for the record i do give away my older music on http://www.ocelotmusicshop.com and i gave away a lot of music over the years to charity compilations and whatever, but if you come try to hit me right where it counts i must say - do you know what you are doing and saying? are you really trying to say what i think you are saying?
i think this is just a way for artists to come up in the world. its normal. give away your tracks... once you are in demand and playing everywhere people ask a lot of free things from you and you get used sometimes and you will see what i mean soon enough bro... you will see... mark my words.
do you play on a party for free?
listen- i dont want to seem like "money guy"
i too recognize the beauty of life.
where do you grow your food for free?
you have some land to grow food on?
who bought it?
will you give me land for free to live on and grow food on?
i choose the music.
its not against or "versus" money like this topic suggests.
money makes the music possible...
its like saying "public libraries versus money"
well a public library aint all about money for sure. but if you dont have money you cant make a public library... you need books, a space, people to work there... etc...
while barter is cool- thats also money.
stop with the literality already. you know what i mean- energy exchange. not just take take take... you must also give...
this topic is shit stupid bad and otherwise totally bogus
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wow man i never said that you can live without money,what i was saying is that you don't need to kill yourself with work to live a nice relaxed life! Many people just work for the material things all there life and never stop to be happy with what they have! Life is not about money it's about dreams and on the other hand money helps in realising them  You must be pretty strained out man take a break ! Come let's meet in India next year we'll have a couple of chillooms together!
Bom
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ok i agree.
money is only the means to an end, not the end in itself.
the point is life. |
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ocelot
ocelot
Started Topics :
94
Posts :
783
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 17:46
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i dont think money is really THE issue in the trance scene- people have ways to get their money a bit better than the punk scene for example- where even 5$ covers for a show used to elicit groans of "capitalistic bastard"
perhaps some of the energy spent bitching about fees and costs in the trance scene could be better spent trying to feed and house people who are NOT spoiled little bitches complaining about their entertainment costs?
lifestyle oriented trance is a different story. if you are living in a communal situation and throwing parties inside of this context you can quite easily ignore a lot of the money as its related to your greater living structure.
but since most parties are only TAZ temporary gatherings, people bring their money from the outside - jobs, being a dealer, being a rich kid, welfare, whatever- and pay the organizer.
the reason you hear the organizer complaining about money sometimes is that he/she is risking sometimes tens of thousands of dollars/euros/etc. and usually doesn't make an amount proportionate to the risk- its not a very good capitalistic investment- people do it for the love of it.
how would YOU like to pay for flights, artist fees, a location, a sound system, a deco artist, security whatever etc... from your pocket and then hope to make it back at the door?
it would change your priorities a bit eh?
to be fair there are bad organizers who make the budget work by simply not paying people etc... but they usually dont last long. dont support them, support the good organizers.
the people who are too idealistic about money and trance need to try throwing some parties and see whats involved.
there is some concern for money, lets face it. but its not the only thing or the main thing.
but this revolution revolution stuff- you guys if you start a separate thread i can bring you some Hegel (inspired marx) with Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis and your fabled revolution is number 3 and it immediately inspires its own opposite (antithesis) and therefore is engaged and useless (or at least not an isolated actor- there is a backlash)
let me also remind you of the dictatorship of the proletariat (remember the stanford prison experiment? people assigned the job of prison guard start to be cruel to the prisoners almost immediately)
lets face it- partying is an act of individual beauty and joy but does not generate food, shelter, or anything useful.
its aesthetic= its a statement that life is about beauty and that not everything needs to be useful...
i agree that the most strange and purely aesthetic art often does not draw a lot of people... but i would not say this follows from that... |
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thegooddale
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
26
Posts :
626
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 18:37
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On 2008-11-20 17:46, ocelot wrote:
i dont think money is really THE issue in the trance scene- people have ways to get their money a bit better than the punk scene for example- where even 5$ covers for a show used to elicit groans of "capitalistic bastard"
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The most money I ever put into a hardcore show was for the Los Crudos farewell tour. I charged $7 and broke even paying all bands. Even with the smallest lineup of psytrance, I don't think I could throw a DECENT show and break even at $7.
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Soul Kontakt
Soul Kontakt
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
632
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 19:04
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Yes Ocelot this is what i mean that you need money but in a moderate way don't make it the only thing in life it is not. It is a good way to mek our dreams come true but when they do it is useless at that moment. Then another dream starts and you need it again! ahhhh endless loop...what do to bro but believe in the paths of the universe and do what your hearth tells you to do!
 Boom :)
SOUL KONTAKT - 12th Planet new track on www.myspace.com/soulkontakt
Soul Kontakt Live for demo or booking email soulkontakt@hotmail.com
www.soulkontakt.com |
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 21:10
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ah just a small comment on the third opinion above.
as far as i know very few people complain because of their entertainment costs actually. or whatever it had to mean. me personally, i dont complain about the costs so much, as about the attidute. people that take 1000-1500 euro for one or two hours, have this attitude that they are so much above everything that happens at the party. they have their vip zones, they have their pretentions, they have to be treated like such. it is not so much about the costs of a party , the entrance, although i honestly dont have so much money to spend every week 50 euro on parties, but this is not the subject at all. and whom do the complaining bitches have to feed, with what????????????? i mean, if you dont like the commerce, then you are a complaining bitch? well, then i am. with the slightly correction that i dont have anything to feed anyone with at least for now, i am empty as well as lots of others here.
most of the things that i do, i do for free and i finance them from other jobs. and even at events where the video projections have been concepted and prepared for weeks, i noticed that someone comes, plays 2 hours and gets 1000 dollars, while i feel pleasure making the whole preparation for free. and at the end there is always someone complaining about money. so what at the end - it is nowadays only spoiled bitching to say that you prefer underground?
i could say the same about any given topics here on isratrance about labels that didnt pay or whatever. bitching topics. not an often attendant of this forum, but i saw quite a few of those discussion till now. may be it would be more suitable to have an artist forum, where only producers write, where such black lists of bad labels appear or whatever. but anyway, what i dont like is the attitude of lots of those 1000-euro-gig-players. if they just did their job as freaks and didnt behave like the big stars it would be totally different. cause underground is more about values and vision than about the quantity of the coins at the door.
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 22:35
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On 2008-11-20 15:33, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero wrote:
pipe&slippers can you please leave me focus on whatever i want? do i have to read always hints and tips here on isratrance what do i have to stop doing?????? if i want to fucking focus on the underground then i will do it and i dont need diazepams to get my head blurred with the shitty nice sides of life that simply dont exist anymore. okey? thank you.
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With all due respect mate, but since you are free to mouth off bollocks about the "spiritually correct" underground, DJ fees, sadhus and the shitty nice sides of life that don't exist, I am free to tell you that you don't have a clue about what is really happening.
You are so caught up with your own vision of the scene and went on a nice trip to wherever it is you went to and you think you found the real deal.
I could simply ignore whatever it is you are writting, but I choose not to, why? Cause I just feel like taking the piss out of the "values and vision of the underground" and its spiritually correct followers.
You're in the wrong scene.
Try Emo.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Remy [POF]
Principles Of Flight
Started Topics :
48
Posts :
509
Posted : Nov 20, 2008 23:11
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Pavel
Troll
Started Topics :
313
Posts :
8649
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 03:08
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On 2008-11-20 22:35, pipe&slippers wrote:
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On 2008-11-20 15:33, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero wrote:
pipe&slippers can you please leave me focus on whatever i want? do i have to read always hints and tips here on isratrance what do i have to stop doing?????? if i want to fucking focus on the underground then i will do it and i dont need diazepams to get my head blurred with the shitty nice sides of life that simply dont exist anymore. okey? thank you.
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With all due respect mate, but since you are free to mouth off bollocks about the "spiritually correct" underground, DJ fees, sadhus and the shitty nice sides of life that don't exist, I am free to tell you that you don't have a clue about what is really happening.
You are so caught up with your own vision of the scene and went on a nice trip to wherever it is you went to and you think you found the real deal.
I could simply ignore whatever it is you are writting, but I choose not to, why? Cause I just feel like taking the piss out of the "values and vision of the underground" and its spiritually correct followers.
You're in the wrong scene.
Try Emo.
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WORD.
Thank god for capitalism. If you are good and you have demand than you make shitloads of money. I sure thank god everyday I don't have such pretentious hippie wannabees in my line of work. Pffft
Yea and some of those artists deserve bitches and drugs. As long as my favorite producers make me smile for every $ i pay them I don't care if they shoot cocaine through their penis shaft while being sucked off by some Ukrainian prostitute. Ok?
Everyone in the world is doing something without me |
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mk47
Inactive User
Started Topics :
118
Posts :
4444
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 05:54
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^ yup
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V3NOM
Inactive User
Started Topics :
131
Posts :
2234
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 06:10
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Sheeeat yeah.
Uf someone takes the time and effort to save up cash to pay for a studio, learns how to make quality music, then putsin the hours, days, weeks, months and years to make a release that makes me smile then that person deserves the money for the effort.
It's called work. And making this music is work. It takes time, learning, skill and commitement.
And it take the same for a promoter to put on a good fun gig.
Without money this scene would be dead a long time ago.
I'm more than happy to give my $$$ that I earnt to somebody who has put their time into giving me such amazing musical pleasure.
And underground is such a lame term for kids who want try to sound cool.
Please do go underground Moki, about 6 foot underground should be fine so we don't have to hear any more of your idealistic immature rants.
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 11:23
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wow. for long time i stayed away from isratrance, i am really glad that i came at least once for some more days to sort of really feel what this scene is all about. artists need bitches and drugs and money and whatever. you are so sick. you dont even hear your own stupid posts. buaaaah. yes i am totally in the wrong scene. but so absolutely totally. glad that it is not all that it is out there, and may be it is all.
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 11:29
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Thank god for capitalism. If you are good and you have demand than you make shitloads of money. I sure thank god everyday I don't have such pretentious hippie wannabees in my line of work. Pffft
Yea and some of those artists deserve bitches and drugs. As long as my favorite producers make me smile for every $ i pay them I don't care if they shoot cocaine through their penis shaft while being sucked off by some Ukrainian prostitute. Ok?
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what can i say. just go to hell. got it? i dont give a shit about your ego driven post, you look ridicoulous to me. and yes, you look exactly the same as those that i meant. i also respect to good artists, and pay with pleasure the entrance for them, but i refuse to be in one boat with shit bastards anymore.
i dont give a shit about their cocks either, it is just not my drug but whatever. their penis being sucked off by ukrainian prostitute? you are so pathetically ridiculous, dont know what you play but i dont even want to. the only thing that i have for you is go to hell. i could be much more direct with you, but you are not even worth losing time with.
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 12:09
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On 2008-11-21 11:23, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero wrote:
wow. for long time i stayed away from isratrance, i am really glad that i came at least once for some more days to sort of really feel what this scene is all about.
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These blue pages do not represent the scene, just the views of its registered users, who mostly post from home whilst chilling out, being bored or whatever.
The real scene is outside your screen.
Your pessimistic views (the ones you shared on here anyway) about the parties, the music, the DJs, money and life it self make you look like an extremely closed minded person that also appears to be on her period 32 days a month.
Don't take this the wrong way, and find the wits to understand the humor behind some posts that are directed towards you, as you really need to get out of your extremely thick bubble.
There is more to this scene than you, me or everybody knows. Different people like different things, so stop condemning humans for acting like humans.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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mk47
Inactive User
Started Topics :
118
Posts :
4444
Posted : Nov 21, 2008 12:24
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I don`t know if they mean well but most of these psychedelic spiritualist trancer types come across as self righteous pricks , why ?
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