Greententacle
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
53
Posts :
323
Posted : Apr 11, 2008 11:16
WTF????
Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Apr 11, 2008 11:49
It's a neat idea, but i think it's more marketing than science. At least for the next 10 years or so. Even in scientific settings it's hard to measure emotions and other cognitive processes. This is because there's so much interpretation involved and because all known methods of measurement are extremely sensitive to artifacts.
Djones
IsraTrance Senior Member
Started Topics :
267
Posts :
1766
Posted : Apr 11, 2008 16:42
Not a bad price either, 299!
Interesting!
Alex Roudos
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
411
Posted : Apr 11, 2008 21:07
It's too cheap to be true unless these 4 guys are Einsteins.
A friend told me once that the biggest mistake we make is that we believe we live, when in reality we are sleeping in the waiting room of life.
Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Apr 12, 2008 11:14
Believe me, it's bullshit. At my job, we do cognitive and emotion research using functional MRI, EEG and TMS. Even with an MRI scanner of a few million dollars we are hardly able to consitently predict which emotion a subject is experiencing. Same with lie detector tests: it's a pile of crap.
Doesn't have to be bullshit. It's a simple EEG device that you can learn to control since it reacts to the parts of the brain responsible for the movement. Imagining that you're moving right hand that part of the brain is activated in exactly the same way as when you really move your hand. Device simply registers movement.
Now that's at least what I know about this kind of controls. They are making those for years primarily for disabled people. Don't know about this specific device, but this kind of technology is used in military for decades and it's quite useful.
"It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity
Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Apr 13, 2008 01:30
In real life, it's really hard to measure brain activity using EEG, because the small currents produced by the brain are a few orders of magnitude smaller than the currents produced by facial and neck muscles. These large currents will obscure the brain activity you're interested in. Imagine what kind of confounds you will have during gameplay and how diffucult it will be to disentangle this from emotion-related brain-activity. A simple EEG device simply does not exist. Even making one steady electrode connection to the scalp is difficult enough. Let alone making several connections that can provide reliable measurements across subjects. The kind of technology they're using in the military is also still limited to measurements inside Faraday's cages, because one single moped driving by is likely to clip the amlifiers for extended periods. Theory and practice are almost always miles apart.
I won't argue... theory and practice are quite different. The latter is quite unknown to me except for the fact that I know that EEG can be measured even without electrodes... wireless and on a distance up to few meters. So maybe... just maybe it's just a catch of isolating certain frequencies while measuring.
Disabled persons already use similar devices to control wheels and operate a computer. So they work somehow, and the theory is that it's done by EEG. I guess that there is more to it than just simple EEG and that is obviously part of the protected patent.
"It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity
Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Apr 14, 2008 10:51
Quote:
On 2008-04-13 18:05, shamantrixx wrote:
I won't argue... theory and practice are quite different. The latter is quite unknown to me except for the fact that I know that EEG can be measured even without electrodes... wireless and on a distance up to few meters. So maybe... just maybe it's just a catch of isolating certain frequencies while measuring.
Disabled persons already use similar devices to control wheels and operate a computer. So they work somehow, and the theory is that it's done by EEG. I guess that there is more to it than just simple EEG and that is obviously part of the protected patent.
Measuring EEG at a distance is done with MEG (magnetoencephalography), which is a useful but particularly artifact-prone technique. Most MEG scanners also uses liquid nitrogen to cool the detector-coils, to reduce their resistance. This makes them impractical for gamers.
In the case of the disabled it is sometimes done by inserting electrode matrices directly onto the cortex. This circumvents the large artifacts generated by the muscles. However, I imagine that intracranial surgery is a bit too much for the average gamer
I might be wrong, but I would certainly think twice before parting with my hard-earned cash to buy an Emotiv helmet.
Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Apr 14, 2008 19:09
It certainly wouldn't be a first fraud on the market. Site does not point to any real research that could be reviewed...
Technology for such precise measurements really is expensive and still under development. Such concept is possible... but with this controller hard likely. I agree on that.
"It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity
I have actually seen something about this on BBC not too long ago, it is still in it's theoretical stage, it was said that this technology is amongst what we can expect in the coming 5 years or so. While we are at it, they are frantically working on AI and it is said to be expected to happen in the next 3 years...
Upavas - Here And Now (Sangoma Rec.) new EP out Oct.29th, get it here:
http://timecode.bandcamp.com http://upavas.com http://soundcloud.com/upavas-1/
Controllers of that kind already operate in cars and other technology. A single IR sensor can precisely monitor your eye movement therefore replacing mouse. It can tell when you're nervous, sleepy, not paying attention... and the best of all is the cost of that technology.... They call it ONE DOLLAR technology.
The future is now "It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity
