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the cosmic octave and mathematics
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
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1931
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 22:26
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i really need the answer of this question so much...
because it is all about the intention. even this theory is just the manifestation of the intention to reconnect. in this sense i completely agree with mandari in the point that at the end of the day it is the same thing which frequency you take.
i will ask hans cousto immediately after i close this window . per email. about this table and the possible variations of the pitches in the last column. what will happen if we have other natural scale of intervalls - if we only take the number five..
i met him some days ago, totally different meeting, and i had the chance to discuss the subject of the gravity constant. the cosmic tones and especially the sun tone are based on the popular idea of gravity. i think there is more behind. what if we take other value of this constant...
this man is really one of the most genius heads of our time...i cant express my respect...he was the one to recreate the vision about the cosmic tones..
and actually after all my search in this field i came to the conclusion that in the known world of scientific prove ( artefacts, monuments ,stones and so on)there is no mention of someone who was using sound for healing before orpheus. the secret about orpheus is very attracting to me. i need to know as much as i can about the pentatonic...
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
58
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1397
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 22:49
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you already have the perfect fifth
i believe nonsense will happen if actually divide 8 in to five
and the perfect fifth is used well baby metal!!!\m/
petatonic and the number five five five this makes me laugh  even good intentions can take you to hell
i am very iterested in the field too i think you do great job honestly ive been in your site more than once keep it up and the more i get into music therapy i understand there is nothing to understand or you are a healer or youre not i would play trance too heal tripped people like you(you need to take it out somewhere) but i will use different methods on children in hospitals
and if you believe this water thing then you know that bach creates better shape than metal hahahaha
i am waiting for the results:) lot oof luck to you namaste |
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
779
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 23:27
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On 2009-06-26 21:44, Moki.Time.Wave.Zero dont know why you feel personally offended:).
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I am not personally offended in the least objective perceptual reality... oh teh ironiez 
Although, I would like you to recognise that you are employing dual standards - if you do not like me commenting on your opinion of Colin's post, I would like you to consider whether or not it would be appropriate that you follow your own advice and take it to PM Land...
BUT, if it makes you feel any better, that whole exchange was actually a reference to another post made by Colin elsewhere, BUT it was so subtle that I'm not even sure Colin got it, such are the weird foilbles of my sense of humour.
Axis:
I haven't read any Carl Sagan (blushes) - the book which really changed my life around completely was this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gödel,_Escher,_Bach
although there was a long period of investigation of ancient Greek philosophy, and a few years to mull all that info over
Several of which had me convinced I was going mad, but, as it turned out, I was going sane 
Well, the above book I think would be of interest to anyone with an interest in this subject, although, it is not about this subject.
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http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
58
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1397
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 23:39
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A.Rosengren
Solid Snake
Started Topics :
266
Posts :
4139
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 23:40
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And here we go again
Keep to the subject???
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
779
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 23:43
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hehehe, that, is precisely the issue of debate ATM.
I assure you, I am (by and large) trying.
AND besides which, hofstadter does indeed make reference to the golden ratio, all the bloody time so, perhaps you would be so kind as to elucidate where the conversation has gone off topic?
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http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
58
Posts :
1397
Posted : Jun 26, 2009 23:45
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0 is the answer and all the best to you bless you mman you are good guy may you soul flourish with love and harmony man i like your hat really magical colors keep up the good work bless you |
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*eLliSDee*
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
671
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 00:23
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this topic really needs a lot more methodical scientific research. for instance; Earth's frequency is not a constant.
I'm fairly certain that one vibrating body can effect another. eg. Tesla's Earthquake Machine (to get into the swing of things).
i'll tune my shit either way.
IF there is a natural cosmic vibration then i'll be in sync. IF not, what is 8hz between friends?
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 14:30
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| I'm fairly certain that one vibrating body can effect another |
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i am certain too. this is a natural low that you see everywhere if you observe material substance. sound can break glasses, sound can make physical objects vibrate, sound can induce geometrical structures in the sand or in the water.
i was thinking about the link that speakafreaka demanded : a scientifical link that proves that one can heal through sound waves.
okey - i dont have any scientifically approved links about the cosmic tones yet ( consider that we are at the beginning of the whole thing and much more experiments and studies will come in the next 10-20 years on this subject... because even the scientists are beginning to get the whole picture finally ( i hope the people in isratrance are beginning too!), after they failed to explain the quantums or to unite the quantums with the relativity).
but i realized that this demand ( " prove that the sound can heal" is actually already officially stated in science.
1. Entrainment
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| In 1665 a Dutch scientist Christian Huygens, 'discovered' the principle of 'entrainment'. This principle states that whenever two or more oscillators in the same field are pulsing at nearly the same rate, they tend to lock in and begin pulsing at exactly the same rate. The powerful rhythmic vibrations from one source will cause less powerful vibrations of another source to lock into the vibration of the first source. |
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http://www.collegeofsoundhealing.co.uk/pages/about.html
consider this fact and what it can mean. it means that every frequency in this universe, is in "interaction" with all other frequencies around. they attract each other. they get stronger if they meet. in some sense it is like butterfly effect in the chaos theory - you have the so called "strange attractor" in form of a frequency which attracts many other frequencies in the system. it doesnt have to be a frequency (like how much hz) but it can be also an interval like 2/3 or square root of the number two. okey, i will not extent this to the theory of chaos right now, but just consider what does the entrainment mean in terms of synchronisation.
2.
take a simple example :
http://www.webmd.com/kidney-stones/extracorporeal-shock-wave-lithotripsy-eswl-for-kidney-stones
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| Extracorporeal shock wave lithotripsy (ESWL) uses shock waves to break a kidney stone into small pieces that can more easily travel through the urinary tract and pass from the body.
You lie on a water-filled cushion, and the surgeon uses X-rays or ultrasound tests to precisely locate the stone. High-energy sound waves pass through your body without injuring it and break the stone into small pieces. |
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this is only one example, but it IS an example that sound healing is already done in science in some form or another. it is not a spiritual junk that i am trying to discuss with you. it is something very scientifical where my interest lies
i really believe that in the near future a diseased condition will not be described in terms of physicians and psychologists, but it will be spoken of in musical terms....
so we have at least a diagnosis in terms of music ( as you saw in the link at the beginning which showed that the ill cells in the human body have a musical dissonance with the rest of the cellc so that they can be easily identified through wave analysis nowadays).
so i asked myself , do i really need to prove that sound can heal?? it is already used in science.
btw sound is something that i prefer to perceive just as a number and a value of a frequency , which can also be outside of the spectre that my human senses perceive. this is why i am considering even a micro wave as a wave that changes reality you know ( no i am not kidding, i am just talking in terms of every day reality). you put an object under micro waves and you get a totally different object after a minute. it shows quite trivial that waves change material substance.
you know...
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| IF not, what is 8hz between friends?. |
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well it is a lot between friends. because it is ALL ABOUT THE INTENTION. really. all things in the material manifestation of reality are about the intention. also this theory - i am putting much energy to understand the cosmic octave only because then my energy is direction towards my intention. my intellect is directed towards it. the deeper you go into the theory, the more powerful the intention:)))
why dont we just try to study this subject on real. we need people who will do this experiment. then we can have scientifical prove for everything....why not just do a party on this theme. anywhere. no matter where on this planet. but lets just try...what you think?
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 14:31
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hey daark, thanks for the friendly post, i was happy to read it. thanks for the wish too, the same to you back! i will try btw to ask cousto to give me an interview in english but i dont promise....
smile and kisses:)
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
18
Posts :
779
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 14:57
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Moki:
I asked:
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I want to see peer reviewed evidence that the use of pentatonics within music have bearing on someone's well being on a physical level.
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What I didn't ask for was:
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a scientifical link that proves that one can heal through sound waves.
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Your first link, again points to a site with vested financial interest - why are you persisting in linking to sites that are not going to sway me or any else capable of rational thought?
Your second link points to the treatment of something that is a completely different concept - and is precisely why I didn't ask 'can sound heal?', because I am already aware that it can. A kidney stone is not 'singing at the wrong frequency', a kidney stone is a calculus of phosphates that has no place in the body in the first place. Its a salt. Furthermore, ultrasound, as far as I am aware does not need to conform to pentatonics to be effective.
So this is not proof of whether
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that the use of pentatonics within music have bearing on someone's well being on a physical level.
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not even nearly.
You are not stupid. Surely you have noticed by now that the one thing which gives scientific credence to any of this is missing from every single site that advocates it? Do you not think if they had scientific approval they would be shouting it from the rooftops? .
http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 15:44
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as i said many times i dont have any evidence about the pentatonics. this is btw something that came into my mind as a hypothesis. i have never seen a scientific prove about it. and if i have one, that is more than a spiritual reflection on the golden means or more than a mythos about the existence of orpheus, i will be the first to shout it from the rooftops.
btw i dont even have a scientific evidence about the effects of the cosmic octave on the humans. okey yes, i know people who are experimenting in hospitals, but as far as i am informed , there is not more than a statistical prove that shows that it is statistically significant that a person reacts on a certain way after being treated with a certain tuning fork. but statistics is the most important science of all , isnt it?
btw about the pentatonics i dont even have a term of consensual reality that i can use. because as i said - in music theory nowadays the pentatonics is a simplified construct that shows five points within the scale. it is not a different octave from the one we know. but i think that this is not what it was at the beginning, at the times when orpheus lived - much longer before pythagoras and the greek culture. orpheus was talking about another term of pentatonics. and i want to first find out what it is , that he meant. what is the golden means. because, okey, we can take the perfect fifth but this would only be the golden means within an octave that is divided into 12 parts ( you see the number root 12 in the table from the latest page). how would the natural temperate scale look like if it is only five intervals. okey lets say it simple - i have read some cultural analysis of the orpheus thing ( which i still dont find in any other language that i know, besides mine but i was born where orpheus lived) and there it was all explained about the intervals and the third ( terz). orpheus had a totally different one. does anyone know anything about it, ever heard, ever read, ever experienced ?
so if i can define the pentatonics in terms of consensual reality and acredited music theory, then i can start to search what is the effect of the pentatonic onto the brain. i am not sure if any scientists has ever done research on that. cousto has not. i dont have evidence mate. so may be you accept that i am looking for an evidence, and dont have any at the present time here.
i just think that if we define a golden means in the music, then it is quite likely that it will work as a strange attractor in terms of physics. do you agree with this at least?
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Gaiana
Started Topics :
2
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59
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 16:08
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I work with a fully 432 tuned studio, and for us, it is working quite well.
And even if after all it is nothing but a placebo effect, and there is nothing really concrete going on, i personally do not care, because even if its just tricking our own minds, the intention is resulting in the desired effect anyway.
Isn't that all that's important really?
Now, to be honest, i do not really care about the science behind all of this, or any theories and empirical evidence.
I approached it pragmatically, with an open mind, and tried it out for myself to test what effect it would have.
For me, everything in the universe vibrates and resonates throughout a vast interconnected web. Every single thing influences the vibration of everything else.
Our thoughts are no exception.
And that is a very interesting facet of our awareness, because we can consciously affect the world around us, simply by our thoughts and the actions which result from them.
Seen in that way, tuning to 432 is just a tool or method, something used to invoke a certain effect.
In the same way how the predefined actions in a ritual give rise to a certain setting, resulting in the desired effect.
All i'm doing is searching for harmony, in myself and in the things that surround me.
I'll use any and all tools which will aid me in this search.
www.myspace.com/gaiana_25 |
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 16:23
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Quote:
| Your first link, again points to a site with vested financial interest - why are you persisting in linking to sites that are not going to sway me or any else capable of rational thought? |
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i dont persist btw. i am just checking what will happen if i start a topic in isratrance. i did the same in goabase but at the moment they started to write about stupid blond women, fucked up borderliners and that they the only one powerful to understand the language i use to describe an octave- and this was supported by the admin : so i deleted my account.
i dont persist at all. one door closes, another opens. if you want to open the links, and to read what is written there, you do it. the more you read, the more perspectives you have. i find it very boring to live only with one perspective of life. the link includes some nice information about what it is. i can also put only references to books, since the books are the only serious source of information that i currently have. even planetware.de is not so detailed as the books that you can find there and read further. if you perfer to see references to books, tell me that. i can copy paste some dozens of them.
but i would like to ask you to check the links that i am giving you instead ot talking about financial interests behind anything. if you put aside everything that has a financial interest, you have to burn every book from the school and university as well. the whole internet is under financial interest.
btw also the financial interest is the reason why you dont read anything about the true meaning of tesla and his research. because it is exactly the same thing as what i am talking about with the attractors.. it is an implosion.
but anyway. may be it is true that no one needs a scientific evidence for that because it is all about the intention. there are people who claim that the intention has no role in the quantum physics as well. they will never ever accept any idea about the material world, which does not fit to their old views about what is what. but those people are not gonna be the change we need in the third millenium.
and once more, you dont even answer the questions i put you about the attractors in the chaos theory. what about the scuare root of the number two. it is exactly what defines the octave. so THE OCTAVE ITSELF IS THE ATTRACtOR IN THE CHAOS may be?????
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moki
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
38
Posts :
1931
Posted : Jun 27, 2009 16:24
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Hey Gaiana, respect, i was intending to check your myspace recently, i will do it right now. Happy to see you here as well. Lots of Love and Light to you:) Keep it up. We need people like you!
i need the evidence only because ot what i am trying to put as a documentary on the subject.
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