| Author
|
Sub bass
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 13:57
|
|
Audioholic
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
21
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:03
|
hi, i am new to the Forum.I can explain u all secrets abt Bass and Subbass and roomacoustics etc...
I am a HiFi/HighEnd Speaker Designer for abt 35 years + a Bassplayer since that time (1973)+ i did one of the first native 5.1 DTS Cds in 2002 (i mixed and produced it, some friends did the musical part).
So just for information to known my experience in Audio.
Here are the perfect definitions:
Infrabass 10-20Hz (used in Films for shaking effects, Dino stomping etc)
Subbass is 20Hz-40 Hz (my subs can do that without problem in your home at abt 105db)
Bass is from abt 40 Hz to 200 Hz (that what u know as the Instrument)
Guitar starts at abt 80Hz
So believe me, more than 80 Hz is NOT Bass and should be described as LOW Mids!
The wave theorie is wrong in rooms because less than wavelength is called nearfield and what u hear is Air pressure changes NOT electrical waves...
Proof : have u ever heard Kickass Deep bass in a Car HifI and a Space of 1,5mx1mx1m ???
So u CAN hear deepest Bass in small rooms, and the good thing its a nearfield bass so its pretty good in sound.
Standingwaves still occur and destroy the good tight and fast Bass Sound. But thats another discussion (we should do that separate cuz its kinda complicated)
When i show my customers the potential of my High End Speakers and Subwoofers i use AVRATZ from Infected Mushroom.
I CUT my subwoofers active 4th order at 44-50 Hz Lowpass!!! The sats can handle easily fom 40Hz -20khz with high efficiency.
This piece of Music is a reference for electronic Bass at different frequencies because u have several Bassfreqencies and "deep Sounds" layered...
It can sound very tight deep and fast if u have High End Audio equipment.
i am from Germany, so sorry for some bad english....
  Admin and Speakerdesigner at
http://www.AudioVideoForum.de |
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:12
|
A car does not have the structure to contain the energy of the wave, hence you hear the low end. the same can be said for small studios where the walls are not solid....I have personally experienced this phenomena at the mission R&D facilities in Huntington, England.
Nice of you to join the forum just for that bit of info 
http://www.whatacunt.co.uk/ |
|
|
|
psytendo
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
73
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:12
|
Quote:
|
On 2008-06-06 13:57, Psytracked wrote:
so are you saying that headphones coupled to you ears act as an isolated space?
|
|
With closed headphones i'd assume an approached isolated space, yes.
If that were an issue there would be a change in response if i would change rooms.
There doesnt seem to be.
|
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:15
|
|
psytendo
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
73
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:22
|
Quote:
|
On 2008-06-06 14:12, Psytracked wrote:
A car does not have the structure to contain the energy of the wave,
|
|
Nor does an anechoic room !! ....
Actually you can consider a perfect anechoic room as an infinite space. Which would fit any frequency, would it not? ...
|
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:26
|
|
lol......no reflections doesn't mean a sound can't radiate with in.....maybe you are getting confused with space i.e. a vacuum where sound can't actually do anything.
http://www.whatacunt.co.uk/ |
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:36
|
|
Audioholic
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
21
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:38
|
the threadstarter asked:
why lower frequencies than 40 Hz? Should i cut with a highpass?
i tell u as experienced speakerdesigner (i sold more than 10k expensive speakers to satisfied customers in Germany, read my Forum infos abt my VITA in HiFi )
NO! u cut at 20 Hz maybe 25. Just DON'T push ur Equalizer to something like 12-18dB + at 30 Hz, because ur homerecording rubbish 5" speakers cant do less than 50 Hz.
U need some decent active woofers of like 10" in small recording rooms for kinda linear listening down to 25Hz.
In big recordingrooms (15+ sqm) add atleast 2x12" active Woofers...
TRy to NOT have to boomy sounds which merge too much into the upper musical areas (u know that effect from some boomy HipHop Tracks)
If u wanna know a good deep Bass mix check that AVRATZ form I.M.
Admin and Speakerdesigner at
http://www.AudioVideoForum.de |
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:46
|
I have worked for Meridian, Mission and B&W......but please do tell me.......are you a speaker designer or a salesman?
and I would still love to know what front end you are using.
http://www.whatacunt.co.uk/ |
|
|
|
Audioholic
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
21
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:51
|
i sent u a PM cuz it offtopic... sorry!
i am Speaker Designer...was Germany's distributor for ScanSpeak, FOCAL + JMlab, Morel +++++ ....
Admin and Speakerdesigner at
http://www.AudioVideoForum.de |
|
|
|
psytendo
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
73
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:51
|
Quote:
|
On 2008-06-06 14:26, Psytracked wrote:
lol......no reflections doesn't mean a sound can't radiate with in.....maybe you are getting confused with space i.e. a vacuum where sound can't actually do anything.
|
|
i understand,
but no reflections means no interaction with the inside of the room.
Which is the same as an infinite space where sound can propagate away from the source freely.
Since in open space sound radiates away at ever decreasing energy one can say that open space will , in the end, absorb any frequency thrown into it without reflecting it back.
An ideal anechoic room, no?
|
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:55
|
|
well actually even open space can throw a spanner in the works.......ever been to a festival and heard the PA from the distance.....the highs.........at night.....
http://www.whatacunt.co.uk/ |
|
|
|
Psytracked
Inactive User
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
424
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 14:57
|
what u wanna know? itd mayby Offtopic in the thread,
Ok: i use normal HiFi equipment for my customers to show (DENON AV Receiver), nobody needs High End electronics.
But i have lots of real HighEnd stuff around me (lots of Tube amps and high End turntables like GOLDMUND and ZARATHUSTRA which i manufactured +dirstributed in the 90s)
Honestly i am well known as a "pain in the ass" guy because i am in that HighEnd-Scene and deny the value of Cable sounds +expensive electronics etc..
My Philosophy:
The only thing counting is the Speakers and the room surrounding it.
Today i explain my customers and friends HOW to "do it yourself" a high end speaker for like 10-20% of similar sounding/quality readymade speakers like B&W.
And i am back to the basics, make music and have fun....
from our friend audioholic.........bloody charlatan.
http://www.whatacunt.co.uk/ |
|
|
|
Audioholic
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
21
Posted : Jun 6, 2008 15:07
|
guys i suggest we do some extra Threads for theoretical discussions (Roomacoustics etc... and then we can go deeper into that,
lets make a simple summation for all,
1. There is DEEP Bass possible to hear (down to 20-25Hz) in smallest ROOMs, so we cant say it doesnt exist, so take it off your mix.
2. Use subbass 20-40Hz frequencies carefully!
cuz to get a GOOD sound in deep Bass u need expensive Speakers, especially good Active Subwoofers with huge drivers. If ur listener has a 8 "inch subwoofer in a 30sqm room it ends up in a desaster. Or he listens at 80DB levels.
3. Be careful with Eqaulizers, as a Purist i would like suggest to use them AS LESS as possible.
Dont use it to push/force sound (thats the + dB area), use it get rid of resonances and boominess in your mixes, to make it "airy".
its hard to explain in foreign language i hope u understand what i mean.
Admin and Speakerdesigner at
http://www.AudioVideoForum.de |
|
|
|
