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Trance Forum  Forum  Production & Music Making - Room Harmonics Trick
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Room Harmonics Trick

routingwithin
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  46
Posts :  204
Posted : Oct 7, 2016 22:29:29

Sup guys.. hope all is well, lol

As u know, many producers out there wants to make epic tunes but their setup is shit.. like proper shit. almost like mine.

So you want to make the kick n bass sound good but ur not getting there. Cause u have no sound absorption on the walls etc etc.

I sat outside today thinking about how can Ace Ventura or Astrix create such epic Quality in their tracks. And obviously I realized that they probably compose and produce in a studio environment.

Ok, that is fine and dandy but many guys don't have the thousands to spend on a correct setup.

So I realized this trick you can do.

Say you make a kick n bass, im talking about initialize and make it, not samples.
Bazzism and Massive etc etc

Your room aint harmonically leveled but you are sitting in the sweet spot.
Then you get the sound right, not using too much EQ - - - remember, cause too much EQ creates an illusion - which fcuks up the balance.

But then you realize if u move ur head, to the left or right, or stand up and walk around, it sounds different. ( like bad )

So u blame the setup, or room harmonics. BUT then why is it that when you listen to a well produced track in the same environment it sounds great. even though you move your head etc etc.

Then it hit me.. it's cause those guys master and mix their tracks in a studio environment. hmmmmm, ok lets go into it.

How can they do it but u cannot ( talking to the guys with a bad setup )
It's because in the studio u hear EXACTLY what to EQ and where the problem is. The better ur setup the better u can zone in on the problem areas.

Again that's good and dandy but i just don't have the money to put myself in that situation.

So then,, A little trick I learned is that if u can't beat them,,,,,,, find another way. This made me realize the following. (Yes i am so dragging on with this, lol)

EQ,, and etc, ur sounds in the sweet spot. Then move to the right (body). Listen if u hear any problems in the sound. If so, "LIGHTLY" EQ it further, until ur happy. then move back a bit. And repeat. Move urself around the speakers and EQ,, etc the sound ... again LIGHTLY, until it sounds good in all areas.

This way you can in a way move around the room harmonics problem.

It was based on the basic concept that if ASTRIX's tune sounds good in all areas of my room, then u can do the same. If u know how to implement it.

PS. Obviously u need Studio monitors and trained ears- not cheap logitecs, If you want this to work.


Cheers guys ENJOY
Thanks 4 readin
Peace





          " We are together in this matter you and I, closer to death, yes, closer than i'd like. How do you feel? - There can be no division in our actions, or everything is lost. What affects you affects me. "
frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :  10
Posts :  1350
Posted : Oct 8, 2016 13:55
What makes you so sure you're not just correcting problems created by the room in the first place and that have nothing to do with your mix whatsoever?

Not just that, but doing many layers of corrective EQ on everything - from many listening points.

To put it lightly, NO.

The solution to your problem is, indeed, called room treatment. If you're having trouble getting some spare money, welcome to the club, but that's just another problem that you need solving. There are, however, some ways of doing it that are more cost effective. In short, there's always the DIY avenue. There's plenty of information readily available, I've pointed out myself to a website by a guy named Marc Mozart which is very informative (also has a book with a whole chapter dedicated to this). Check that out and make plans for getting there.

Life's tough. Money doesn't come by easily. Sure.

The problem is not how do you survive not solving the problem. The problem is how do you get to where you want to be. There's plenty of cost effective solutions. If even this is completely out of reach, then everything else is. You just need to put money aside and wait for the right chance to jump in. It will be worth the wait and the struggle. Because a big part of achieving success is by (here I go again) keeping it real.

There's no solution to not applying the known solution to something and having to cope with the shortcomings of not setting up the proper solution. That's not the way to look at it. You can survive the most adverse conditions if only you use your brains and make the most of what you have, sure. But it doesn't help if you start thinking you can use magic tricks. You can't. There's the stair case. You need to climb one step at a time. But at least you know where you need to go. You just need to figure out how to achieve it. That's really the question that needs solving.

But leaving this aside now. Taking different measurements from many listening positions isn't a bad thing in itself, it's actually good advise. You just can't be too sure about how many different things are interacting, such as the sound of the room, the speaker's design and so forth. For example, if you're using ported speakers, they tend to be a little hyped around the frequency where the woofer begins to fail short. Since we're talking bass here, this may be even further accentuated by your room - which many times does. If you were to EQ from many listening positions to cope with this, you'd only be chasing your own tail.

Cheers
routingwithin
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  46
Posts :  204
Posted : Oct 21, 2016 18:47
Yeah.. my bad.
It just seemed to work pretty well at the time.

Took ur advise and invested into some room treatment. After i also saw everyone is talking about it. Have 6 500mm absorbers.. two on each side wall on the first reflection points. Two on the ceiling. Used a mirror to find the right location.

Monday iam getting four bass traps for the trihidral corners since they are the most important. And then finishing off with two difussers on the back wall.

I get what u said afterwards reading an article that what i heard was an amplified frequency which i eq'd.. but it was merely caused by the room refections.
          " We are together in this matter you and I, closer to death, yes, closer than i'd like. How do you feel? - There can be no division in our actions, or everything is lost. What affects you affects me. "
frisbeehead
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :  10
Posts :  1350
Posted : Oct 22, 2016 20:40
That's very cool!
routingwithin
IsraTrance Junior Member

Started Topics :  46
Posts :  204
Posted : Oct 25, 2016 10:32
After I installed the bass traps a tear came to my eye, realizing my long awaited search for a good mix is over. The absorbers alone did not really change that much - but the bass traps made an out of this world difference.

I am still mindfcuked about how differently I hear frequencies now. EQ and compression is effortless. Before I struggled to get a lead blended with the knb. Now it just gets there.

Zoning in on certain frequencies is easy. Everything is amazingly clear. Sounds like my room has a compressor on it, the tightness keeps me in tune with my next mixing decision.

I was a complete fool, tinkering with trinkets and theories. It changed everything.

And for those wondering if room treatment is worth it. Well ask yourself - how much time do you want to waste getting no-where.


          " We are together in this matter you and I, closer to death, yes, closer than i'd like. How do you feel? - There can be no division in our actions, or everything is lost. What affects you affects me. "
ansolas
IsraTrance Full Member

Started Topics :  107
Posts :  975
Posted : Nov 4, 2016 17:26
And thats why acoustic treatment is much more important to have than a lot of Hardware Synthesizers or other expensive things Another big point is the room size and the distance to the wall you are sitting at.

That reminds me that I wanted to create a blog post about that topic. I spend a lot of month last year to delve into this topic.
I did a lot of measurements and the result is something like this (I am not sure anymore if thise picturs are the final measurement or not finished or it is even better now. I just picked 2 images out of the images folder as example, eg the scale is not the same, but you can see that the reverbtime is a lot less compared to the red):

before

after


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Trance Forum  Forum  Production & Music Making - Room Harmonics Trick
 
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