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Processing synth sounds
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Magus
IsraTrance Junior Member
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61
Posted : Jul 12, 2011 16:46:24
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If someone could make a video with how you process your synth sounds, the effect chain, you would make my day. I seem to be lost as to how much should be done within the synth and what should be achieved with the effects. I know that I should aim as much as i can within the synth, but Im not sure when i should go with the effects. |
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supergroover
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jul 12, 2011 19:23
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Uh.. it really depends on the sound and what you want to do with it.
This question is like: could you please make a video how to prepare food?
Sure but what do you want? Pasta? Rice? Aloo mutter? Pizza?
 soundcloud.com/supergroover |
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mudpeople
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jul 12, 2011 20:11
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it depends also on what synth, how many fx it has internally.
Personally I try to get teh sound as close as possible to what i want, before adding any more effects. Saves on CPU, and its satisfying to play a handtweaked patch. Feels like work well done.
Reverb and delay tend to be best handled by their own fx in my experience. To get the 'just right' sound. Depending on instrument of course 
Sometimes, if the synth is te right type, i put a pitch corrector on it.
Or other times, Il put a rack of guitar stompbox type effects on a non-guitar sound.
Other fx i use often enough to mention are ring modulators, alongside lo-fi bitcrusher type fx ringmods can really add, though i try to make sure teh original sound is still there, through btoh the crush and ringmod. Ive got a ringmod in a set of fx in my live / dj fx rack though with the wet set to nearly 100% for ringmodding teh master channel. Take care for your ears and gears when ringmodding, they can cause BAD peaks in the upper register. Start dry and add to taste, is a rule of thumb to live by.
I personally prefer cleaner sounding synths in general so I try to minimize active fx outside of the synth itself.
Sorry to not be able to be more specific, its really a subjective question you're asking Try various effects to see what you like.
Fyi; active effects are ones that change teh tone in some way, heres a few mainstays;
ringmod
flanger/phaser
delay
reverb
chorus
distortion
lofi/bitcrush/granulation
actively sweeping or mooglike filters
As oppposed to passive effects that don't change teh tone unless activated or threshold is reached such as;
compressor/limiter/maximizer
filters not actively sweeping
gate
then tehre are active MIDI fx such as arpeggiators, sequencers, randomizers, algorithmic weirdnesses, chordators... As well as stereo effects such as expanders adn mid-side encoders, autopanners and the like, that are active but don't necessarily (ideally) change the sound itself, rather teh character.
I guess a standard general fx chain of mine woould look liike this;
synth>flanger/phaser/chorus/distortion > ringmod > delay > reverb > filter > EQ
Keep in mind that it does matter what order your fx are chained, delay before reverb means your delay signal is tehn reverbed. I find it best to put the EQ at the final end of the chain so any tonal transient generated by an effect gets eq'ed out. Filters I find best at the end, but before the EQ, as I like to filter-sweep the entire signal chain with band- or high-pass -48 db Butterworth 8-node filters which have a drastic cutoff as one can imagine, -48 decibels for each octave, with a bandpass, is audio surgery extracting desired tones without coloration by resonance. Its fun to set up a high or lopass sweeping actively then set a bandpass after it in the chain, sorta like an audio peephole that the high or lopass sweep 'paints' the sound up and down against...
This is a general idea of how i handle effects in my work, and cant be seen as THE WAY or even good for your work. I do feel it important that the EQ be at teh end to avoid unpleasant and potentially harmful spikes that certain fx can cause. And important too to start dry, then add wet til you're satisfied.
FInally the best fx are NO FX imo, if youre using extra plugins it means your initial sound isn't what you want it to be, for whatever reason. Extra meaning in this context anything added to teh chain that isn't exactly what you want to use for a specific purpose. If I use a chorus with depth of >15% usually its a sign that the initial sound is lacking something that heavy chorus will 'spatch-fix', as in, do-it-good-enough-for-now. Close enough for government work as we say int eh US. Im of teh opinion that fx should be used not to cover up flaws but to add depth of tonality, and should be used with care, and shouldnt be used if you don't know what the effect does (compressors ESPECIALLY). If one adds distortion it should be to distort the sound in a desired manner, with foreknowledge and familiarity with the concept of distortion, with intent to distort the sound Just Enough to acheive the desired result, realize the creative vision. Its important to remember that active, wet effects subtract from the original and each adds their own coloration. Remember playing with finger paints, what happens when you mix red, blue and yellow?
You get mud.
Audio is just another kind of paint, the more you mix it, the worse its going to end up. Sometimes that can be good.
But, if you dont know what youre doing it tends to show in teh result. Everyone plays with finger paints at least once in life, but not everyone goes on to become Rouault or Monet (to name a couple of artists who took finger painting style to a whole new level, with intent and knowledge of what they were doing, and did it Just Right). Feel around with your DAW and plugins, and hopefully someday you too will make a painting worth hanging. 
But foremost; have fun! Get wild, try new things! break rules; teh only way to know the limits of a thing, is to TRY TO EXCEED THEM.
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faxinadu
Faxi Nadu / Elmooht
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282
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Posted : Jul 12, 2011 22:39
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these questions that come up here miss the point entirely as far as i see music making at least.
stop looking for golden rules.
the only rules are: get to know how sound behaves and get to know your gear.
the rest is up to your imagination.
very nice comments from mudpeople too, have fun and let the experience you gain guide you.
the only thing i don't agree with mudpeople so much is the whole idea of too many fx. there is never too many of anything. some basic mix sounds like a bassline of course will benefit from a great initial soundsource, but for crazy sounds and new ideas, the whole digital way of working means that even using a ton of fx won't really hurt the sound as far as signal quality, so yah, go crazy.
The Way Back
https://faxinadu.bandcamp.com/album/the-way-back |
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Padmapani
Started Topics :
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431
Posted : Jul 13, 2011 05:40
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Quote:
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On 2011-07-12 22:39, faxinadu wrote:
the only thing i don't agree with mudpeople so much is the whole idea of too many fx. there is never too many of anything. some basic mix sounds like a bassline of course will benefit from a great initial soundsource, but for crazy sounds and new ideas, the whole digital way of working means that even using a ton of fx won't really hurt the sound as far as signal quality, so yah, go crazy.
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i do think that mudpeople is right here. you usually won't get a great sound by adding lots of effects to a bad source sound. you can hide some of the less desirable qualities of your sound, but it'll never be great.
still an already good sound can of course be turned into something great using effects.
i am myself guilty of over-using effects on not-quite-as-good synth sounds. but sometimes a bad lead sound with a crazy effect chain can be exactly the background percussion your track needs
one thing i often do (but i guess i probably shouldn't?) is using flangers/phasers to thin out (partly important) sounds to make more space in the mix. |
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Upavas
Upavas
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150
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3315
Posted : Jul 13, 2011 06:20
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Quote:
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On 2011-07-12 22:39, faxinadu wrote:
stop looking for golden rules.
the only rules are: get to know how sound behaves and get to know your gear.
the rest is up to your imagination.
very nice comments from mudpeople too, have fun and let the experience you gain guide you.
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Very good advice !
+1000
Upavas - Here And Now (Sangoma Rec.) new EP out Oct.29th, get it here:
http://timecode.bandcamp.com
http://upavas.com
http://soundcloud.com/upavas-1/ |
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mudpeople
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jul 13, 2011 14:36
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of course, Faxi, as you said, there aint no golden rules
I was mainly trying to steer those starting out away from overloading on fx, which is something that I used to do, nowadays when i rework old stuff, it tends to mean getting rid of effects that i threw on carelessly without really knowing what i was doing.
also i mainly speak of my own approach; I try to maintain as pure a sound as possible, when I want to make pure sound that is (sometimes not)
No one can really tell another artist how to make their output, its up to each of us to find our own best way. Half of the fun is finding your own way, like making your own patches for your favorite synth, it may seem like it takes forever, and may seem overwhelming but once youre done, you have something you alone created and that feels AWESOME
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Alien Bug
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jul 13, 2011 17:17
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mudpeople
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
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Posted : Jul 14, 2011 00:34
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lol indeed
I used to use renoise's native stereo expander before i found Rescue AE, and my old works all have at least 5 on each channel
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Magus
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Jul 15, 2011 17:55
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Thanx alot for taking the time to reply! Im asking my original question because I dont have any producer friends and have never seen how others make their sounds, so I was really interested in getting some insides into other approaches. Been twiddling with sounds for some 2 years now, but still I dont get the sounds that I want. But, when I see tutorials on the net I see how some make their sounds and it strikes me that the synths sounds themselves arent that "deep". I observe that mostly the processing is done with the effects. Thats why im asking how much is done in the synth and how does it sound before you start adding effects. I dont have any reference points when dealing with this matter, since I dont know how its "supposed" to sound. Hope u catch my drift |
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Jul 15, 2011 18:21
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Quote:
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On 2011-07-15 17:55, Magus wrote:
Thanx alot for taking the time to reply! Im asking my original question because I dont have any producer friends and have never seen how others make their sounds...
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faxinadu
Faxi Nadu / Elmooht
Started Topics :
282
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Posted : Jul 15, 2011 20:55
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well, try to experiment and get to know as many pieces of gear as you can, be it hardware/software.
even if it is just stopping by at music stores from time to time to hear some synths. it takes time, years even and is always ongoing but the more you hear and experiment the more you learn and at some point lights start turning on 
The Way Back
https://faxinadu.bandcamp.com/album/the-way-back |
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