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PRO TOOLS -FREE
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DJ Buju
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
Posts :
1334
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 19:49
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@ Spindrift
Ofcourse after you print the midi into audio you wouldn't edit the midi. as what you are monitoring is the audio.
Editing the midi is fine and what i have ment is that in GENERAL midi isn't as reliable and time wise audio is much more INTIME then midi. (ofcourse you need to time the audio in which ever way you desire)
I have no problem with my configuration @ all.
I'm using Pro-tools HD 3 acccel system with 48 I/O .
A unitor 8 as my midi interface as we recored and use lots of synts and other midi devices on different projects.
Lots of TDM plugins and lots of virtual instruments.
Midi is just not as reliable as audio and that a fact you can not argue with my friend... i'm sorry.
i Forget that once you started you never change it as it , after all why would you hey? makes things harder.
then you gonna use something on the stereo mix to strech it , yeah thats gonna sound good....
And yes in Logic when you'll change the grid to a new tempo the automaition will not follow! now thats a bummer for someone like me who mixes is it with a lot of automation and using a lot of tracks. (sorry mate but unlike you i do find sometimes the need to change my multitracks to a different tempo and most of all the producer i work for does it all the time...)
Outside psy tracne bubble world (home user making a recored) pro tools is the ONE and ONLY software used in a professional enviorment.
Bom BOm
BUju
P.S. - i used to use Logic for all my midi and then use pro tools for everything else until the latest version of pro tools came out and i can do it all in tools.
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Hayez
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
393
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 19:53
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P.S,- your track is @ 140bpm and you finished mixing it, there are lots of tracks and LOTS of automation youve done while mixing this track for the past week...
Then you deicde to speed it up to 144bpm.
What you gonna do? time the stereo track?
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And how exactly you're going to do that in PT ?, ok, you'll have the automation in time but the audio out. It's not Live or Acid. You'll have to time stretch each region in PT, hardly somthing I'd like to do.
PT is the best audio multitrack, but it was designed for sound engineers not musicians. That's why it's midi was so lame and still not up to Logic\Cubase standards.
On the other hand Logic\Cubase were designed at first as midi only sequencers. That's why they have such impressive midi support.
@TRANCER, try before you buy. choose the program that meet your needs. Both programs are good, but each has it's qualities.
 "a new art came into my mind which only you can create, the Art of Noises, the logical consequence of your marvelous innovations." Russolo, 1913 |
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Spindrift
Spindrift
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1560
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 20:18
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I agree that it's good practice to record down MIDI to audio and not keep changeing things around to much during the creation of a track. Make sure it sounds good, and when you are sure it does that it is more reliable to record it down to audio.
For a variety of reason MIDI is less realiable than audio, that I can agree on.
But I do not have problems with the MIDI timing on my system at least, although some plugins might offset the signal a bit and I find it good to move the audio a bit after recording, but that has nothing to do with audio timing.
If you say the MIDI in the latest version of PT is just as good as in Logic then I can agree that it would be good for trance producers as well.
It did not use to and many pro producers was infact using Logic with their PT hardware because of that reason.
To me it seemed like you where trying to claim that MIDI is unimportant and that it is a problem with the timing. That is simply not true IMO.
It's also not true that PT is the "ONE and ONLY software used in a professional envorinment".
Thats just narrow minded and exaggereated.
It's the most commonly used for sure.
But there is a lot of music you hear on the radio that is made on both cubase and logic as well.
About the tempo changeing...are you saying that the pitch shift/timestretch in PT is better than prosonic for example??
If you change the tempo does the audio files get rendered offline or online??
I have serious problems beliving that unless they have are rendered offline they can have an alogorithm better than prosonic.
From my experiences most real time stretching sounds quite bad and I would much rather take the whole mix and strech it with a good algorythm.
If PT indeed makes new versions of the files when changing the tempo it would be quite handy, although I never felt the need to use such a function myself.
But the bottom line is that to get a nice PT system you have to take everything you earn from sveral albums to be able to afford it.
Anyone who does that is either loaded before they went into trance or just stupidly obessed with having the fattest gear.
To complain about trance producers not working with PT is just arrogant and displaying a total lack of insight into the industry.
Getting a PT system wont make them compete with britney because if it now would help them to get better production.
They still will sell like shit compared to most the music made using PT and would have made an unreasonable investment.
So keep looking up to pop producers because of the gear they use, but I don't feel any envy to producers who sit with PT or Neve making bullskit commercial crap with their gear.
I would much rather sit with a 400Mhz PC and fruity loops making some music I like myself.
(``·.¸(``·.¸(``·.¸¸.·`´)¸.·`´)¸.·`´)
« .....www.ResonantEarth.com..... »
(¸.·`´(¸.·`´(¸.·`´``·.¸)``·.¸)``·.¸)
http://www.myspace.com/spindriftsounds
http://www.myspace.com/resonantearth |
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DJ Buju
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
Posts :
1334
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 20:18
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On 2005-02-08 19:53, Hayez wrote:
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P.S,- your track is @ 140bpm and you finished mixing it, there are lots of tracks and LOTS of automation youve done while mixing this track for the past week...
Then you deicde to speed it up to 144bpm.
What you gonna do? time the stereo track?
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And how exactly you're going to do that in PT ?, ok, you'll have the automation in time but the audio out. It's not Live or Acid. You'll have to time stretch each region in PT, hardly somthing I'd like to do.
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Thats exectly it dude!
I'll time stretch every track! thats how you do it... it's not great fun and takes a while but thats the way life goes...
Now, My audio will be IN TIME and my automation will follow the grid which it didn't used 2 before so there is no problem @ all.
And totaly agree with you on the last note for trancer.
Try it and find out yourself, you'll probebly find logic/cubase better for your current needs but maybe one day you'll want a bit more....
Bom BOm
BUju |
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TRANCER
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
11
Posts :
94
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 20:28
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yeah thanks people...
Regards, |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Feb 8, 2005 21:16
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When you've stopped showing off, Buju, maybe you'd like to let us hear what you've done with your "Pro-tools HD 3 acccel system with 48 I/O" (by the way, there are only two 'c's in 'accel') and all your fancy hardware. Personally I don't use hardware at all (other than the PC, that is), but that hasn't stopped people writing to me asking what hardware synths I'm using. Here's a link to a website where you can listen to clips of my productions:
http://www.voiceofcod.com
Care to share your tracks?
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| Mr OOOD saying there is nothing pro tools does that cubase doesn't well thats just someone showing off about something he doesn't know about.
as spindrift said highest quality DSP effects. you pay for what you get.... |
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I had that in mind when I said "There is nothing that your basic Pro-Tools will do that Cubase won't do...", 'basic' in this case meaning excluding plugins. Fair enough though, you might have misunderstood that.
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| Maybe OOOD can tell me how can he make is track faster in 4bpm without losing all the automation you've done??! |
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Mate, it's easy. I'd write it at the correct tempo in the first place. And if I really needed to speed it up I'd do what you do in Pro Tools and TS each segment individually. Except I wouldn't, I'd write it at the correct tempo in the first place.
So then, let's hear your tracks. That's the bottom line here.
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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DJ Buju
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
70
Posts :
1334
Posted : Feb 9, 2005 19:06
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@ Colin
Belive me you don't want to listen to most of the stuff I do, don't think it's any good and after being in a control room for 18hours a day working on your own stuff doesn't really happen...
Never mentioned your skills as a producer on my posts and if i did then I'm sorry chief.
And reagarding my spelling issues please excuse me as I'm typing very fast as i go along...
Bottom line was regarding a software and as a trained expirianced user of this programes i wanted to make a point of my view of things.
I think because you use only your pc and thats what most psy trance producers do then it becomes all the same.
Nothing is ground breaking and in my opinion it would be great if people would expiriment more...
Some live stuff some, some stuff that no one done before... After all you been there from 1994 (thats would it said in the Bio) so i wonder for how long you can go with the same 4x4 and tweeking some sounds till it gets a bit boaring...
Very nice website (voice of cod), music not my style but and as I said before, i'm sure other people love it as we all have a different taste...
Bom BOm
BUju
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Feb 10, 2005 12:23
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On 2005-02-09 19:06, DJ Buju wrote:
I think because you use only your pc and thats what most psy trance producers do then it becomes all the same.
Nothing is ground breaking and in my opinion it would be great if people would expiriment more... |
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I don't think you can blame the tools for the type work done with them. A synth is a synth, whether it's inside a PC, a Mac, or its own shiny box on a keyboard stand. Likewise FX. There are many other reasons why people feel that much trance these days sounds the same. I agree; experimentation is good, but you can do that on any software... Cubase is just as good as Pro Tools for this.
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| Some live stuff some, some stuff that no one done before... After all you been there from 1994 (thats would it said in the Bio) so i wonder for how long you can go with the same 4x4 and tweeking some sounds till it gets a bit boaring... |
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About 3 trance tracks in a row, before I have to do something different - and even with the trance tunes I have to try and do something new to make myself feel satisfied with what I'm doing; a breakbeat track or an ambient tune, or maybe some solo piano... it's kind of like clearing one's palate with a sorbet between courses at a posh restaurant. BTW, for something a little bit different in trance (including that live element you mentioned), check out:
http://www.triskelemanagement.com/artists/oood/lists/definer.m3u
http://www.triskelemanagement.com/oood.html has more clips of my productions that you might prefer to the Voice of Cod stuff.
If anything, I think one big reason that people think trance sounds the same is that very few producers these days have any kind of prior musical experience. Even on the technical side, many people don't stray from the presets which doesnt't exactly help their tracks sound different. Also there is a very strong temptation to sound like one's favourite artists in the hope of getting released - or even just because that's what you like to hear.
However I really don't think the scene would be any better if everyone used Pro Tools.
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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