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practical compression
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Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Sep 7, 2005 19:41
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ssst !  |
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TRapp
Inactive User
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7
Posts :
271
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 08:55
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On 2005-09-07 15:18, bukboy wrote:
by the by I do have an audiophile hifi which has a very flat response, & Im sure is a decent monitor, & after playing around wif compression for months I dont see overwhelming benefits.Im probably a moron, but I dont see y kick + base finds compression indispensible. Ive looked @ the deedra (I think) track with "altitude 1600" in a wav editor & it looks like the 2nd 16th beat bass sound is mixing wif the kick that is still playing, whereas the 3rd & 4th 16th beat bass notes r fine.
Obviously theyre not using compression, so then if such an awesome track doesnt use compress, then Y is it so reccomended? Y Y Y 
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u dont need to compress anything.....
when mark from hydraglyph was teaching me , no compression on kick or bass....
a lil trick which i have started using for bass-kick compression is this....
i lay down my bass and kick tracks with no compression on either, but i do EQ both for however i might want it to sound.
then i bounce both tracks down onto one track...i take that kick-bass track and i compress that with fast attack and medium release, ratio between 1:4 and 1:8 and i usually then eq that track as well....but not always
then i pull down the slider on the kick-bass track with the seperate kick and seperate bass tracks still playing.....i then slowly push up the kick-bass slider....till u can just hearing it coming thru the mix....
and thats it.....
i think its pretty efective
um bukboy u say you arent using studio reference monitors???? cos i think without those your ability to tell what you are doing with a compressor isnt going to be all that effective...i think at any rate...
compression is not a must ..alot of people rave about it and rate that you have to shove it on everything,....but in reality you dont.
 I dont do the drugs....I AM the drugs |
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 09:24
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thanku very much doods.
I just picked up a copy of mixing engineers handbook with a pretty good description of what compressors do.some engineers use it only for controlling dynamics, others for effect, even if only 2 introduce the colour of a particular compressor.Some use it 2 add dynamics to a track, but mostly a lot add it, coz it just sounds good.(apparently)
Will investigate the subtle effects, played around with New York trick.(adding compressed EQ's version with track)
From this subjectiev point of view Im still not sure if compressors r not 2 overrated.then again some engineers say that nothing changes their sound as much as a compressor.
Thanks 4 the input will play & consider.
P.S. its not like I cant hear the diff, just wondering if it sounds that gr8.
Meow! |
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texmex
Started Topics :
5
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189
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 10:08
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dj tuK:
i never use compression as an effect,
usually what i do is after bouncing to audio i first compress the track untill the track sounds "solid"
without eq and then eq the track, its importent because a lot of times with out compression you have to cut out alot of frequencies and the track sounds thinner but if you eq after commpresion you can leave frequencies that otherwise you would cut .
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I slightly disagree. Isn't eq'ing BEFORE compression more meaningful, because then you'd have the compressor reacting what you hear, not the original signal. For example, if you have a signal that has a lot of high frequency noise in it which you want to get rid of, why would you first compress it and then cut those frequencies out?
More thoughts at: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=100552
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Boobytrip:
You can use a compressor to colour your sounds, to decrease dynamic range, or to add groove to something. If you want to learn how to use it you should start from a good starting point:
attack: fast
release: fast
treshold: low (so it's always on)
ratio: high
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Hey, that sounded almost as the short "Cracking Compression" guide. I found it a nice clean way to work with the compressors. In the guide the ratio is adjusted before the threshold, though...
here's the link: http://www.carothers.info/chase/compressor.txt [orginally posted at kvr: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=97672 ] |
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TuK
TuK
Started Topics :
41
Posts :
228
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 13:36
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hey texmex,
theirs no right way in the order of commpresor or eq its only of a matter of what you want to achieve and on what sound your working on,in the thread you posted they clearly say compress before eq,on most synth/instruments to put a compressor before the eq i think is the right way because first you get the peaks down so the sound itself is more clear and then eq the frequencies which you dont need, also if you first eq then when you compress the freq you cutted will be raised by the commpressor .
in the example you said i think that if you commpress first and then eq you wont have to get rid of all the high which are in peak and leave some of those freq so the sound will be fatter.
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Boobytrip
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
39
Posts :
988
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 16:22
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@ Texmex: Well, you're right. I found this technique in the cracking compression chapter in Mike Stavrou's exellent book "Mixing With Your Mind" I found it THE most useful tutorial on how to set up compressors i ever read. The other chapters like the one about the division between right-brain and left-brain mixing-chores were also very good. |
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texmex
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
189
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 16:53
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On 2005-09-08 13:36, dj tuK wrote:
hey texmex,
theirs no right way in the order of commpresor or eq its only of a matter of what you want to achieve and on what sound your working on,in the thread you posted they clearly say compress before eq,on most synth/instruments to put a compressor before the eq i think is the right way because first you get the peaks down so the sound itself is more clear and then eq the frequencies which you dont need, also if you first eq then when you compress the freq you cutted will be raised by the commpressor .
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okay, perhaps you're right. Maybe the best solution would be eq-comp-eq, where you first radically remove the unwanted frequencies (highpass,lowpass,notch ringing/annoying freqs), then compress it and then eq to make it fit the mix/brighter/any small adjustments. Actually you're already doing this, as the synth's filter can be considered an eq, too.
If I remember correctly, the Waves WaveTrack(?) has eq first, then the compressor...
@ Boobytrip: Hmm, that book should be interesting to read. Let's put in my looong wish-list... |
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missing-link
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
30
Posts :
108
Posted : Sep 8, 2005 19:41
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Mike Stavrou's exellent book "Mixing With Your Mind"
that book sounds interesting can you only get it from their web site or can you get it in book shops in the uk too? |
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NikC
BeatNik
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
601
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 00:56
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On 2005-09-07 13:26, dj tuK wrote:
i never use compression as an effect,
usually what i do is after bouncing to audio i first compress the track untill the track sounds "solid"
without eq and then eq the track, its importent because a lot of times with out compression you have to cut out alot of frequencies and the track sounds thinner but if you eq after commpresion you can leave frequencies that otherwise you would cut .
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?
Maybe i'm jsut misunderstanding you, but I disagree there...
EQ and compress in the mix to avoid frequency clashes, if you e.q. post mix you'll e.q. out chunks of frequncies in the whole track not just little sections.
A track should sound solid in the mix, and compression when there are frequency clashes only serves to make them far more prominent - if 'obviously badly made' is your definition of a 'solid' track then that's the way go about it  ...
The last bit about e.q.ing after the compression i don't really understand at all...
Remember the saying:
THERE IS NO QUICK FIX - IT'S ALL IN THE MIX!
www.myspace.com/beat_nik |
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rob-ot
M-Field
Started Topics :
6
Posts :
123
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 02:06
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I do the eq-comp-eq thing. First eq is a basic low cut, sometimes also with a mid-drop. Then compress. Then second eq is to take out any more straggling unwanted frequencies, such as a lowpass that removes most stuff above 10k for loops, or a 3k dip, or in some cases a boost for brightness.
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 04:41
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TuK
TuK
Started Topics :
41
Posts :
228
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 10:55
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o.k. i wont argue with you ,your experience is better then mine and your probobly correct. even though it still doesnt sit good.
i remember reading an article which said:rule-compress before eq.sorry if i missled anyone |
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TRapp
Inactive User
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
271
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 11:26
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i dont think it is a fixed in stone rule...
some people swear by doing it one way, and some swear by doing it the other
i suppose its agina what ever works for you
I dont do the drugs....I AM the drugs |
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TuK
TuK
Started Topics :
41
Posts :
228
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 11:49
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Sep 9, 2005 14:35
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thanks dj tuK. most of it is just explanation of the settings, but 1 or 2 articles actually give some insight in2 what effects can be achieved with compression, & sorta hint how 2 do this.
It seems that now I know what the question I wanted 2 ask is:
what effects r possible wif comps(dance & trance relevant), & what those effects sound like when correct.
I wonder if I should start another thread wif that title?
Anyway, could som1 please show me what a mix without stuff like "bounce" & "presence" sounds like, & how much it should really have, how much is too much, what a drum with a sufficient amount of "crunch", "punch", or "thickening" actually sounds like, & what a drum sounds like which is severely lacking these qualities.
Ive got rick snomans book & he's got some samples of "bounce" b4 & after, but I dont care about house. what should psytrance compressor sound b is my question. |
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