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phoscyon help
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kylistar
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Mar 3, 2011 16:20:37
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Hello!
Im trying to make a lead of phoscyon and this is what im getting:
http://kylis.homeftp.org:18000/MyWeb/warez/303kyliss.mp3
The end of the sound is how i want it to sound, in the start there is to much noise? if you know what i mean.
Any experienced phoscyon user that could tell me how to get the whole sound to sound like the end of the sound without loosing volume or anything? sound sound sound... 
Cheers! |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 3, 2011 18:59
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What I've found works well with phoscyon is automating the cutoff, resonance, and env mod amounts within the 'sweet spot' range to get that pleasing 303-style high-resonance sound in the tail end of your example.
At the beginning it seems like the cutoff is 'too' low, in that it comes in kind of squelchy and 'noisy' or whatever.
Are you using the internal sequencer for this pattern? or your host's piano roll? if so, which one?
But yeah, the trick to good sounding phoscyon leads imo is detailed automation. Try automating the cutoff to rise from ~50-90% within the space of one midi note, and make it a nice curve. Love that sound.
If you have ableton one of the fun things to do is to map cutoff, resonance, env mod (at least) to macro knobs, and then go into map mode and change the min/max ranges of those paremeters...for instance I usually don't like to have the resonance at 100%, maybe like 90-95 for a lead patch....and also don't want it too low, so change the minimum to say 10-15, max to 90-95. Do the same thing (dif min/max values) for resonance and env mod to taste
your goal should be that no matter how far up and down you move your macro knobs, it should sound good...so then when you automate or play with a MIDI controller you can be sure that when you push the values to min or max it'll still sound good.
Of course...if you're not using ableton that won't be particular helpful.
cheers.
 If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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kylistar
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Mar 3, 2011 23:25
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hello!
Thanks alot for the answere!
Im not using ableton, im using cubase :/
but i think i get what you mean with the automation thing in the beginning, gonna try that out.
Ive done the pattern in the interneal sequenser, but i also have host automation on, that whole sound is one "E" that i change octave in, but im planning to also change notes, got any way to make the glide effect in a better way?
Thanks alot again!
Cheers! |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 00:23
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one of the things with the phoscyon glide is that there is no sustain...
so if you have the glide go for more than a couple of 16ths the volume drops off considerably. You can't make the glide go on forever, so that is why your volume is dropping off.
I don't ever use the internal sequencer, I find it hard to think like that....but to each their own, Ive heard many people say that to make convincing 303 patterns you should spend some time with the internal sequencer first. However...
What I would reccomend for learning and getting used to phoscyon...turn your internal sequencer off, use Cubases piano roll and write a 1 bar loop that is all 16ths with a 16th note space inbetween each note. All the same key.
Press play, and move the cutoff/resonance/env mod parameters around until you get comfortable with what the different ranges of those parameters sound like.
Now, take one of the 16th notes and move it up to a different note or take it up an octave, and make it an 8th length note so that it overlaps onto one of the 16th length notes...and see how that glide feels. Adjust the slide time on phoscyon to taste. Play with adding automation curves to filter/resonance/env mod during the glide time of one note to the other...the placement of the curve will dramatically affect how it sounds. Try different automations on the same loop, it will make a big difference.
If you have any more questions I'd be happy to answer them as best I can, I effing love phoscyon. Writing a nice 303 arpeggio and then mad-man turning the cutoff/res knobs makes me feel all warm and fuzzy on the inside.
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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kylistar
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 10:06
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Hey again and thanks again!
So if i I understand you correctly with those 16 notes is that it should be one note every 1/16 of the loop that is 1/16 long?
And when I make them 1/8 is when the slide effect starts working?
Yeah, you're right, those kinds of leads does really make one feel warm and fussy
Arpeggio, are you using the internal arpeggio? I haven't really tried that one out to much, maybe I should?
Do you use phoscyon alot for bass aswell? In that case, how do you do it?
Alot of compression and distortion? Anything else?
Thanks again! |
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kylistar
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 14:23
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 19:45
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I have used phoscyon for bass, but not on any of my soundcloud tunes I don't think. I like Sylenth a lot for bass, though phoscyon definitely has that nice oldschool flavor to it in bass territory.
The built-in distortion unit in phoscyon is pretty great.
I never use the internal seqeuencer in phoscyon, so I just write the arpeggios in my piano roll.
The slide starts working whenever you have two notes overlapping - the 1/16 1/8 thing I was talking about was just an example to get started, not by any means a rule that you should follow
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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loki
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 19:50
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wicked tune, that one!
i use ABL for my 303 emulation, or Sylenth when i want a gorgeous saw/reso/squelchy lead without the signature 303 character, but wilsanqil's advice applies to all of them. the sweet spot for cutoff/reso is where it's at.
as opposed to editing min/max of macro knobs, i'd just record your automation and then manually edit it where it goes too high or low.
keep using your midi in your DAW piano roll as well, not the internal sequencer (unless you are damn good at editing its patterns to get what you want!). there is nothing worse than having a great riff made with an arpeggiator and realizing you need to change one single note!
as for distortion/compression, try an amp simulator or multi-band compression (i use logic's guitar amp sometimes, and ohm force predatohm/melohman). quadrafuzz or anything else will work great - play around! the key is to have your bottom end phattened up as you like it, and your high end (where your resonance squelches are) to scream just the right amount without losing control. if the resonance does create nasty volume spikes at any point, you can use a multiband compressor just to tighten up the high-mids/highs where it screams.
you can have a lot of fun playing with automation of delay/reverb send and your hi-pass filter on your channel as well to give the feel of your riff moving in and out, farther from and closer to the listener. this goes for any riff, but it really sounds stellar on 303 lines. hmmm, i'm stuck in a tune right now and this thread has reminded me that a good scorching 303 line does wonders over a solid groove stfu whoever said dubstep can't be psychedelic with lush 303 lines 
happy squelching!
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your living room. ~Kurt Vonnegut
www.soundcloud.com/mixyott |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 20:50
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I like the min/max macro knob method because then I can easily make my automation lines go to the bottom and top without worrying about going too high or too low
Or setting min/max then recording the automation live as I tweak the knob...and again I can go all the way up and down quite dramatically without it sounding shit (well, hopefully)
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 22:22
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You can get a good sustained glide going when using your DAW to sequence Phoscyon if you have a glissando between the two notes; lots of short overlapping notes, each of which will glide from one to another. The envelope won't retrigger each time but somehow it keeps the sustain level up. We used to do this all the time with a real 303, works well.
Another secret to getting an authentic TB303 sound from Phoscyon or ABL is to get the note-lengths right - a TB303 16th note lasts seven-twelfths of a 16th (or 70 ticks with Cubase standard settings ).
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Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 4, 2011 23:08
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hm I'll have to try that when I get home, I've never been able to sustain the glide for very long without the volume dropping away.
Didn't know that about the TB303 length...interesting...
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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kylistar
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
34
Posts :
129
Posted : Mar 5, 2011 12:19
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Yeah, I understood that with 1/16 and 1/8 notes, and tried others aswell.
Having a bit of a hard time making the glide sustain though. Gonna try that one with little notes in between when I get the time and get back to you!
Thanks Alot again! |
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woodster77
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Mar 5, 2011 16:50
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another point to make is the fact that the glide on a 303 is triggered before the next note plays
try stretching the legato note earlier to get a type of exponential hlide
°°°ACTS 4:12°°°° |
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