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out of curiousity, How many of you guys make a good living with music alone?
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cytopia
Cytopia.org
Started Topics :
61
Posts :
329
Posted : Jul 17, 2008 22:22
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Quote:
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On 2008-07-17 09:30, bukboy wrote:
cytopia - can u just for 1 second entertain that I have a point? that your sources of information are scam artists bent on making money out of u? just for a second? I mean isn't human credulity the oldest revenue stream?
just for 1 sec? Or is it just impossible. and you will never look at your "non-fiction" books as "mistakes" (if not deliberate lies) to milk your cash?
Anyway the whole premise of the book is flawed, comparing faiths, religions and beliefs is like comparing dreams. Pretty useless unless u can justify one of them to be true.
Fraggletrollet - truth is not a subjective concept(it exists despite us and our beliefs), it does not have degrees (half true, half false), and it is not relative (different for everyone.) Moreover truth is consistent and non contradictory.
People have lied to you if you were told otherwise. painful? but TRUE. someone doesn't accept that? thats called avoiding the truth.
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Have you met these people you are accusing of being scam artists? Have you spent time with them and gotten to know them, perhaps looked at the content of what they are speaking about before condemning it under false assumptions based on your own past, and lack of experience?
I don't know you, I have read your posts and you come across as quite an asshole, to be honest. People's theories and conclusions about the nature of reality not conforming to your personal beliefs is one thing, but the way you accuse them of intentionally spreading lies is disgusting and really says more about you than it does about them. I think your intension is not genuine, and your arguments are shallow. It is very convenient for you to condemn the whole thing before knowing anything of the content. But I don't doubt that you would condemn it even after reading it because you have made a decision, you already know everything, so again congratulations, you win.   Cytopia.org
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 11:01
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I meet people every single day who all have their own explanation for the way the universe is. And when I ask them Y they believe what they believe, they accuse me of sabotaging their starting blocks or some such.
One person was telling me there are 5 "rings" in life, and I immediately asked, why 5, why not 4 or 6. (Which immediately exposes the arbitrary nature of his theory)
Its a fair question, but to him I was second guessing his obvious good intentions (which to him might be good, but doesn't make em true.) Just coz he feels mystical doesn't mean he has a clue.
Point is everyone who doesnt have a critical education is like this, they listen to huge ass liars of these virus memes, pick and choose eclectically(depending on how cool it sounds), and spread them further. (ok so they're not lies, just mistakes, however everyone is a culpable accomplice in spreading these lies even though they are just mistaken)
If I told you that the catholic church was nothing more than a social system for control and extortion, literally u might agree with me. But If I draw the parallels between the teachers of the message of the "messiah", and mystic teachers of spiritualism you would be insulted. Fact is you're believing stories that are created in the same way, using the same human weaknesses in knowledge, except you are choosing these to be true over others that you dont like.
Thats all that your "sprituality" is.
Now u call me an asshole, but there are a lot more of dudes like you than there are of me, and everywhere I turn some asshole is either trying to convert me or radiate his peace in my direction, or praying for me, or sending his love and warmth telepathically. ITS FUCKING PATHETIC. Humanity please oh please wake up. See these fake stories for what they are. |
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mk47
Inactive User
Started Topics :
118
Posts :
4444
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 11:12
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Fragletrollet
Fragletrollet
Started Topics :
111
Posts :
1748
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 11:33
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On 2008-07-17 15:01, bukboy wrote:
Fraggletrollet -
"Truth" is only a name we use for "correct" statements. "This is a seat" is true if indeed the object is made for the purpose of sitting on.
Contradiction is a direct relation that excludes the possibility that two statements that are contradictory are true. So if I say "this is a seat", and you say "no, that is not a seat" then at least one of them must be false, because both of them cannot be true.
The definition of the objective is "everything that is true whether we believe it or not"
And the subjective "is everything else"
So the objective contains everything that is correct and nothing that is false(irrespectively of what we believe)
However, when I can show that a concept is contradictory with another, then I can prove that it is not objective, (i.e. not real)
Now in the case of "spirituality", my main objection is that the teachers who teach it, cannot possibly KNOW the things they are teaching are true, so therefore even though what they say may be true, it cannot be knowledge. And if it cannot be knowledge, then Y are these scummy conmen teaching this crap?
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For me, contradictorism rather indicates that we live in a multiverse, where several realities are happening simultaniously. Contradictories are created in order to make contrast: a diamond shines the most when put before a black background?
If the reality always in the end is being percieved by subjective observers, how can you claim there even exists something like objectivism?
I believe anything anyone will say, will be false. It will only be the subjective observation of a truth, expressed through a subjective language. Your adjectives, not the truth's... but ofcourse, the truth is so big it also includes it.
Paradoxes dont exist? 
http://www.myspace.com/fragletrollet
http://www.myspace.com/unknowncausesound
http://www.fragletrollet.com/ |
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Servellen
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
42
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 14:00
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On 2008-07-18 11:01, bukboy wrote:
Thats all that your "sprituality" is.
Now u call me an asshole, but there are a lot more of dudes like you than there are of me, and everywhere I turn some asshole is either trying to convert me or radiate his peace in my direction, or praying for me, or sending his love and warmth telepathically. ITS FUCKING PATHETIC. Humanity please oh please wake up. See these fake stories for what they are.
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I'll continue this under my personal login, because the content of my posts does not have anything to do with Cytopia.
I am glad there are more dudes like me than you. Time and time again your aggressive condemnation lacks content and depth and any form of interest for a position that you obviously have not taken the time to read about, assuming it is something that it is not.
Cytopia.org
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 16:16
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Fraggletrollet - Quote:
| If the reality always in the end is being percieved by subjective observers, how can you claim there even exists something like objectivism? |
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I think what you are asking is how can we know that the objective exists outside of us?
before that can be answered, we should start by asking - how can we have any knowledge anyway right?
This is one of those problems that can only be solved by attacking it from the inside.
if we doubt that we can have knowledge, then nothing we do constitutes knowledge.
But if we assume knowledge is possible, then we can perform experiments that confirm reproducibly any bit of knowledge we'd like to test.
The point of view that you advocate, if you took it seriously, would hurt your life, because you would never be able to know anything objective, However, do you wanna test whether a speeding car against your body will hurt? I think not because we both KNOW it will hurt, so in this case I think if you argue your point any further you will be culpable of hypocrisy.
Now if we conclude that knowledge is possible, then the objective must exist. i.e. a world outside of our subjective perspective.
Quote:
| For me, contradictorism rather indicates that we live in a multiverse, where several realities are happening simultaniously. Contradictories are created in order to make contrast: a diamond shines the most when put before a black background? |
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the concept of parsimony - occams razor - is our friend here. i.e. if you can explain everything that you observe within one universe then Y make your life complicated and make an infinite amount of them? If we see a ball flying why conclude that a hundred people kicked it?
more importantly why in hell would the universe exist to give you contrast. Are people the only reason why the universe exists? now I am arrogant but thats a new level.
Quote:
| I believe anything anyone will say, will be false. It will only be the subjective observation of a truth, expressed through a subjective language. Your adjectives, not the truth's... but ofcourse, the truth is so big it also includes it. |
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your statement is false, so obviously it cant be true right. do you realise you just contradicted yourself? i.e. there is no way in which your statement could make sense.
Servellen - I do not have to read your books to know they are crap. I can just look at the people who have read them and see the blank look in their eyes. |
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Servellen
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
42
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 16:37
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Servellen - I do not have to read your books to know they are crap. I can just look at the people who have read them and see the blank look in their eyes.
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Haha, you are funny.
Convenient attitude to avoid certain sources and have strong preconcieved oppinions about the content, based on the assumption it must be like other things you have read or experienced WITHOUT TAKING THE TIME TO READ IT and then calling that wise... its funny.
Cytopia.org
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 17:05
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Dude I am not going to buy this book.
Send me a reasonably sized link that u feel is an incontrovertible motivator for a spiritual mindset and I will accept your view as being valid, until then I will consider your point of view as wishful thinking sourced from really dubious conmen.
Come on dude. just one article, just one piece of evidence I DONT HAVE to take on FAITH. And ul have a convert who will spread the word of your wiseness around the globe.
Or you could just avoid me. If you're too closed minded to accept that my view is superior in every palpable way. |
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klippel
Stereofeld
Started Topics :
91
Posts :
1153
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 17:20
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On 2008-07-18 17:05, bukboy wrote:
Or you could just avoid me. If you're too closed minded to accept that my view is superior in every palpable way.
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could you pass me the number of your coke supplier? must be premiere league shite to make you think you found the holy grail....
oh, sorry you donĀ“t believe in this christianity stuff...  |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 18:19
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Servellen
Started Topics :
5
Posts :
42
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 18:41
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On 2008-07-18 17:05, bukboy wrote:
If you're too closed minded to accept that my view is superior in every palpable way.
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ROFL yes of course you are far superior, any argument against that is bound to be flawed.
Cytopia.org
Wicked Legal Affordable Music Downloads in CD Quality |
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Fragletrollet
Fragletrollet
Started Topics :
111
Posts :
1748
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 21:25
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Quote:
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On 2008-07-18 16:16, bukboy wrote:
Fraggletrollet - Quote:
| If the reality always in the end is being percieved by subjective observers, how can you claim there even exists something like objectivism? |
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I think what you are asking is how can we know that the objective exists outside of us?
before that can be answered, we should start by asking - how can we have any knowledge anyway right?
This is one of those problems that can only be solved by attacking it from the inside.
if we doubt that we can have knowledge, then nothing we do constitutes knowledge.
But if we assume knowledge is possible, then we can perform experiments that confirm reproducibly any bit of knowledge we'd like to test.
The point of view that you advocate, if you took it seriously, would hurt your life, because you would never be able to know anything objective, However, do you wanna test whether a speeding car against your body will hurt? I think not because we both KNOW it will hurt, so in this case I think if you argue your point any further you will be culpable of hypocrisy.
Now if we conclude that knowledge is possible, then the objective must exist. i.e. a world outside of our subjective perspective.
Quote:
| For me, contradictorism rather indicates that we live in a multiverse, where several realities are happening simultaniously. Contradictories are created in order to make contrast: a diamond shines the most when put before a black background? |
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the concept of parsimony - occams razor - is our friend here. i.e. if you can explain everything that you observe within one universe then Y make your life complicated and make an infinite amount of them? If we see a ball flying why conclude that a hundred people kicked it?
more importantly why in hell would the universe exist to give you contrast. Are people the only reason why the universe exists? now I am arrogant but thats a new level.
Quote:
| I believe anything anyone will say, will be false. It will only be the subjective observation of a truth, expressed through a subjective language. Your adjectives, not the truth's... but ofcourse, the truth is so big it also includes it. |
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your statement is false, so obviously it cant be true right. do you realise you just contradicted yourself? i.e. there is no way in which your statement could make sense.
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Do you believe the universe is limitless? If so, how can anything be "the" truth? Why cant it be seen from infinite perspectives? And why do you have a problem calling all those different perspective for different realities? Is there anything, if there isnt something to percieve it? And if yes, isnt that a paradox?
What if you create your reality out of your and the common counsciousness? Maybe laws of physics is just boundaries we set for our experience in order to learn things in a special way...
You totally misunderstood my last comment about everything told will be untrue.
If we speak about something, we do exactly that: speak _ABOUT_ it. We are NOT speaking _THE_ thing.
So everything we say will be based upon the observation, and not the actual thing, right?
Illusions.... illusions.... illusions...
We are not able to understand such concepts with our minds. Try meditating
Ps: i believe acceptance of everything is the path to go to not getting fried by all this heavy information. Accept the weirdness, accept that it is bigger than we can comprehend, accept that we know everything and nothing at the same time...
Accept this weird and wonderful creation that is EVERYTHING 
good vibes
magnus http://www.myspace.com/fragletrollet
http://www.myspace.com/unknowncausesound
http://www.fragletrollet.com/ |
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Braindrop
Braindrop
Started Topics :
140
Posts :
1730
Posted : Jul 18, 2008 22:52
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Take a break guys.
Have a Kit Kat 
www.braindrop.in |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
60
Posts :
3709
Posted : Jul 19, 2008 01:28
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On 2008-07-18 22:52, UrbanPsySpirit wrote:
Take a break guys.
Have a Kit Kat
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Haha
Mindfry...
Reality is what you make of it!
who cares what the truth is as long as you feel good! wanna believe in fairies, go ahead! but its probably all in your head though i feel good when i believe in them and live for a moment in a fantasy, its all good to taste and touch fantasy world.... as long as you dont get stuck in it, case you will probably get mad when people confront you and try to blow your bubble...
fantasy can be like a drug that you want other people to try aswell
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bukboy
Hyperboreans
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
803
Posted : Jul 19, 2008 02:06
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freeflow - at least ur consistent. |
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.. babas pwnd