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midi controller resolution smooth
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metalball
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
40
Posted : Aug 21, 2007 23:46
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hey everyone...
is there any way to smooth resolution of the midi controller?
i mean the midi channel has value from 0-127, and while recording midi automation the differences between each unit ain't smooth enough like the resolution while automating a VSTi channel from the automation track...
is there any way to resolve the issue?
  134-139 bpm |
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Auralviolence
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
58
Posted : Aug 22, 2007 01:19
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It mostly depends of sofwtare that you use. Normal sequencers and synths smooth/interpolate this 128 gradation resolution automaticaly, for audible "stepping" effects prevention. I never experienced this problem  |
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metalball
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
40
Posted : Aug 22, 2007 01:33
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well SX3 is my soft, and "steps" really killing me... so maybe there is some filter plugin or something that may help...
134-139 bpm |
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Auralviolence
Started Topics :
0
Posts :
58
Posted : Aug 22, 2007 02:06
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Cubase/Nuendo is my soft too. Is it audible for you when you tweak Cubase parametrs (mixer volume faders for example) or VSTi parametrs ? Or may be you tweak the knobs too slow (low bpm factor) ?  |
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metalball
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
40
Posted : Aug 22, 2007 03:08
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actually i have no problems with the steps in any other parameter, not the mixer faders, not the VSTi knobs, anything, until i start controlling with the knobs/faders from the keyboard...
by the way, the pitch wheel on my keys dont have that issue, only the controllers-knobs,faders
134-139 bpm |
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ansolas
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
108
Posts :
977
Posted : Aug 24, 2007 12:09
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Quote:
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On 2007-08-22 03:08, metalball wrote:
until i start controlling with the knobs/faders from the keyboard...
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probaly your keyboards knobs suxx I had a similar issue with other equipment. |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Aug 24, 2007 19:48
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Yeah this can often be the case. If you have an early Edirol keyboard controller you can get a firmware update which will fix this.
If you're using SX you can make your MIDI CC automation as smooth as possible by using the SX automation in the arrange window instead of discrete CC messages in the key editor. This will at least make sure that it passes through every possible value without missing any out!
If you record your controller moves into the key editor you can select the MIDI part and use the "right-click -> Functions -> Extract MIDI Automation" function to convert your MIDI CCs into automation on the MIDI track. You can then edit this to remove the steps and smooth everything out
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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shamantrixx
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
549
Posted : Aug 25, 2007 17:40
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Some MIDI controls also have NRPN standard that is divided into 14 bit resolution which means that the movement of the fader or the knob is divided into more than 16000 steps. One of such controls is Behringer BCF2000 (but I guess others controls use it as well).
More than few VST plugs support NRPN standard and can be automated with 14 bit precision. For example OhmForce QuadFrohmage filters use NRPN. If you do automation in the way Colin described to you such plugs will provide greater accuracy while automating mix. Needless to say, you can use almost any plug in to control the level of a track while actually not affecting track in any other way. I guess that would be the solution for more than 127 steps in automation.
"It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity |
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metalball
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
40
Posted : Aug 27, 2007 05:46
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Quote:
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On 2007-08-24 19:48, Colin OOOD wrote:
Yeah this can often be the case. If you have an early Edirol keyboard controller you can get a firmware update which will fix this.
If you're using SX you can make your MIDI CC automation as smooth as possible by using the SX automation in the arrange window instead of discrete CC messages in the key editor. This will at least make sure that it passes through every possible value without missing any out!
If you record your controller moves into the key editor you can select the MIDI part and use the "right-click -> Functions -> Extract MIDI Automation" function to convert your MIDI CCs into automation on the MIDI track. You can then edit this to remove the steps and smooth everything out
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actually thats what i have been doing until now, and it sucks, because its annoying work!
well i'm using M-Audio Radium61 keys, i guess i should bye better ones...
134-139 bpm |
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Trip-
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
3239
Posted : Aug 27, 2007 09:00
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nevertheless,
it should be a software integrated option.
If I ever program knob controllers in Reaktor for instance, I can apply an event smoother to smooth those fast movements - and instead of hearing each step, I hear a smooth transition.
Crackling universes dive into their own neverending crackle...
AgalactiA |
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metalball
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
40
Posted : Aug 27, 2007 20:27
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Quote:
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On 2007-08-27 09:00, Trip- wrote:
nevertheless,
it should be a software integrated option.
If I ever program knob controllers in Reaktor for instance, I can apply an event smoother to smooth those fast movements - and instead of hearing each step, I hear a smooth transition.
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well thats because the reaktor is advance and powerfull synth, unlike the Discovery for example, that doesnt have this option for tuning, and i use Dicovery more than Reaktor... so it could be hardware limit.
134-139 bpm |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Aug 27, 2007 20:34
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Quote:
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On 2007-08-25 17:40, shamantrixx wrote:
Some MIDI controls also have NRPN standard that is divided into 14 bit resolution which means that the movement of the fader or the knob is divided into more than 16000 steps. |
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Actually you don't need to plunge into the heafuck that is NRPNs to deal with hi-res MIDI control; the first 14 controllers, from 0 (Bank Select) to 13 (Effect Control 2) are also capable of working in 14-bit resolution. This includes our favourites Modulation (CC #1 + CC #33), Breath Control (CC #2 + CC #34), Main Volume (CC #7 + CC #39) and Expression (CC #11 + CC #43).
http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/tech/midispec/ctllist.htm
Hats off to anyone who can write 14-bit MIDI automation by hand without using a control-surface though!
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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shamantrixx
Started Topics :
7
Posts :
549
Posted : Aug 28, 2007 05:16
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Interesting. tnx!
Even thou I'm not sure that I need such automation. I use 14 bit resolution only for hand control of knobs and faders. For the rest of the automation I'm quite happy with line tool and manual value entry for more complex patterns.
"It occurred to me by intuition, and music was the driving force behind that intuition. My discovery was the result of musical perception"
Albert Einstein, speaking about his theory of relativity |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Aug 28, 2007 06:53
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Using paired CCs (1/33, 2/34) etc. also uses less MIDI bandwidth compared to an equivalent 14-bit controller using NRPNs, although this is only really an issue when dealing with external MIDI hardware such as synths or control surfaces as VST MIDI is not limited to the slow speed of a physical MIDI interface.
I'm pretty sure that more VSTis are capable of using 14-bit controllers than you might think; it's not advertised much though as most people can't be bothered to use them - they're obviously pretty fiddly! Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
OOOD 5th album 'You Think You Are' - www.is.gd/tobuyoood :: www.OOOD.net
www.facebook.com/OOOD.music :: www.soundcloud.com/oood
Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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Trip-
IsraTrance Team
Started Topics :
101
Posts :
3239
Posted : Aug 28, 2007 10:24
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Quote:
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On 2007-08-27 20:27, metalball wrote:
Quote:
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On 2007-08-27 09:00, Trip- wrote:
nevertheless,
it should be a software integrated option.
If I ever program knob controllers in Reaktor for instance, I can apply an event smoother to smooth those fast movements - and instead of hearing each step, I hear a smooth transition.
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well thats because the reaktor is advance and powerfull synth, unlike the Discovery for example, that doesnt have this option for tuning, and i use Dicovery more than Reaktor... so it could be hardware limit.
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I'm just pointing out that there can be a software related cure. I guess Discovery didn't implement this option.
Crackling universes dive into their own neverending crackle...
AgalactiA |
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