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live acts?
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Plasmorh
IsraTrance Junior Member
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559
Posted : Dec 2, 2010 23:17
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On 2010-12-02 23:08, willsanquil wrote:
imo a truly Live set with actual live elements is more engaging and personal than a DJ set, even if the DJ set is more technically flawless and its perfect the entire time. The connection between the artist and the crowd is much more interesting imo when it's live. Or at least has the *potential* to be.
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+10000x93182491874934
  I want a spare brain.... or 2. |
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dreadieg
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 00:53
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no. one. cares.
well, except us. if they're adjusting the cutoff, they're doing something, yes?
if people are dancing, and there is someone playing music, it may as well be live.
if you want to make a impact on the live trance scene, do what OOOD do. that's live, everything else might just be playing with ourselves. |
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"42"
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 00:54
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 01:23
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On 2010-12-03 00:53, dreadieg wrote:
no. one. cares.
well, except us. if they're adjusting the cutoff, they're doing something, yes?
if people are dancing, and there is someone playing music, it may as well be live.
if you want to make a impact on the live trance scene, do what OOOD do. that's live, everything else might just be playing with ourselves.
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I disagree completely. First of all, sure there will always be those people that come to parties that aren't really invested in the music and will dance to whatever comes out of the speakers. Are you making music or DJing in order to appeal to those people?
A lot of psytrancers are very particular about the music and very attentive and they can recognize the feeling of something with more live elements even if they don't necessarily grasp the technical concepts of what is going on.
As regards the 'if people are dancing and there's music, it may as well be live'....the thing I keep coming back to is the maximum potential for a great musical experience. For me personally, the most interesting and special experience is one that is completely unique to that space and that moment - the product of the musician's ability plus the energy of the crowd that he's performing for. That feedback loop of your energy + crowds energy = more energy for everyone is very powerful.
If you have a liveset or a DJ set of pre-mixed and recorded material no matter how much you re-arrange and mix, it's still the same sounds that were created in a different space. Live sequencing of instruments or playing of synths/instruments with accompanying user-based modulation creates that, or at least it could if one knew what he was doing.
But yeah, considering the complexity of psytrance (some, anyway) it would be really effing hard to pull off with a ton of live elements. That's the other part of it...people love to see people doing something that is hard to do and they appreciate it more than you might give them credit for 
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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dreadieg
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 01:40
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very very well put Will, and i agree 100%
but if we all keep getting all hot and bothered about who's live and who's not, aren't we just going to keep getting disappointed.
point and fact is pulling off a true live set is hard work, and no one wants to look like a fool in front of a bunch of folks.
so don't worry about it so much, just make your
set better than theirs, or just do the best you can, and hope other people do the same.
this is still about fun, imho, so i'm not sure it's worth it to fret so much. |
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willsanquil
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 02:11
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The 'psytrance dissapointment' thing is a complex and multi-faceted issue
There are many things affecting it in my opinion...first of all, psy is a pretty underground form of music, and it attracts people who like underground things...sometimes for contrarian reasons.
Another major one is the subjective aspect of what is psychedelic. If you listen to psy for years and years it becomes harder to really be blown away by something, so if you're not careful you can become pretty cynical about newer music as every year your standards are getting higher and higher.
We see the end result of such an attitude all the time in this and many other forums..you know, those people talking about THAT PARTY back in THE DAY that was SO EPIC and now they're not impressed by anything that comes out as it doesn't match up to that experience.
Personally when I got into the scene in 2003 I was so blown away and amazed and assigned a lot of significance to the music and the people, and I still do....but there were times at parties when I would just get so upset or frustrated or sad when it wouldn't match up with my expectations. I realized that I was going to every psytrance party with the desired outcome of it being a life changing situation.
Once I flipped it around a little bit and went to parties without expectations (as much as possible) I came to appreciate the times when it WAS serious and good music more, yet I could still enjoy myself when it wasn't.
SOooo that was a longwinded way to say that yes, I agree with you that it's not so worth it to fret about, I'd rather appreciate the few people that do put in the work than deride the massive majority of people that slide by doing less than they could.
I can still get super tranced on great DJ sets for sure. But I'd be even MORE super tranced if they also improv'd over the top with a hardware synth 
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch...you must first invent the universe
www.soundcloud.com/tasp
www.soundcloud.com/kinematic-records |
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dreadieg
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 03:23
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believe me i understand. i've only been doing this for 3-4 years, and i'm already jaded as hell. i rarely go out, mainly cause the people are all annoying as hell.
buttttt, it's about the music, and whether i can have fun and dance. so if the music is good for me, it's fun, if it's bad, i'm not having fun.
i'll get to ya'lls level sooner rather than later, i'm sure. |
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Plasmorh
IsraTrance Junior Member
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559
Posted : Dec 3, 2010 03:24
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live act made by using midi, FXs and not premade set is enough for me.... cuz psytrance is very very hard.....
will, i agree with u and i am one of those listeners that r really peaky xDDD
SO FUCK OFF "LIVES" and start midiing like crazy ahahahah
hail live music!
I want a spare brain.... or 2. |
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aciduss
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 04:17
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Lol @ midi |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 04:45
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Plasmorh
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
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559
Posted : Dec 3, 2010 05:39
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i saw hes workshop at boom...
realized abt sound ilusions... didnt knew well it was an illusion xD
I want a spare brain.... or 2. |
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 06:34
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all is illusions 
but do tell me what you realized!?
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Freeflow
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 09:04
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sAt0ri
Satori
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247
Posted : Dec 3, 2010 09:54
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As has been said here, for more minimal loop based music a set played the way tom cosm does it works well, but for music like Kindzadza or other hi speed complex electronic music it just isn't the best way to do it.
The journey is different. With night music it usually doesn't build progressively, it twists and turns and needs to be precise and tight.
When I play I want my songs to be exactly as I made them, I sometimes drop loops and sound effects over the top but usually I just use ableton to mix my tracks together like a dj would, and have maybe one or two vst set up for additional parts in stripped down sections.
I am more concerned about the journey my set, as a whole, is taking the dancer on, I don't care if someone wants to watch me press buttons and turns pots on a midi controller.
For me the term 'live' is usefull to tell the punter that this is a set of original music and not just a dj spinning other peoples music.
.............................................
Satori
Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/s-59 |
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knocz
Moderator
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Posted : Dec 3, 2010 14:25
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I'd just like to clear something that wasn't clear from the beginning. I have a ton of studio work, and make everything fit together, to then play with live. So I can do any type of studio word on something, between subtle effects to complete and complex breaks, to play live.. that's why I said some loops can be long (and they don't have to loop from the beginning, they can have a follow up action, etc.)
It's not to create a track on the fly, that's almost impossible. It's to create a track that's playable.. Every band has their songs planned and composed when playing live and everyone knows what they have to do.. But they can change the song on the fly, which is a lot easier.
Imagine the well known approach:take your already finished track, re-route your buses into 8 group buses, record your track in these group buses, then cut out the structure and arrange your song in loops.. If you want just 3 or 4 loops (per bus), or loop it out the maximum you can.. This way you have you *totally produced, mixed, arranged* song, just as if it's a fake live, but you can ChAnGe your song, without loosing your studio time.. It all fits together. It's the mix between having a track that is made in the studio, with all the time you need to tweak and perfect every little detail, but instead of making a track to be recorded on a CD and played from start to end, it's a track you create from the beginning with the intent of playing with it live with, without a fixed time schedule, but with the ambients you want to drive your music threw.
If there is a will, there is a way. Please don't say it's not possible, that's quitting before even trying. Find a way! Saying you don't want to try this way because you afraid it will be sloppy is stupid, saying it's not possible because of the degree of detail isn't obtainable is also not a very clever statement.
I love playing bpm's from 150+, and believe my you can play haiko style music live (especially this type of music ).. Just imagine all of your loops already have all the degree of detail into them. Imagine if you play your loops from top to bottom, your track would come out perfectly. You could just be playing out your song normally. Or you can change it (majorly working in audio).
Just think about it, don't blow the idea off right away.
Super Banana Sauce http://www.soundcloud.com/knocz |
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