| Author
|
Linux Ubuntu Studio
|
Seppa
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
485
Posted : May 20, 2007 02:58
|
Quote:
| Windows is good for ordinary people that don't know how to use a computer. And the reason is because everybody has it. But you don't control the computer.. it controls you. |
|
So I guess you can come and explain me how to use it then!
I have had my first computer at the age of 7, an Apple II c,I move on to a pc, a "80 286" running dos, to an apple Lc in 1990 to486 dx2, dx4 .....ect
I runned and used apple os, dos , win (3.1 to xp), Linux ( different kinds).
In all I have started 2 computer company in italy and london which i have sold now.
All this to say what you say is nonsense !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Linux is for more experienced user who likes to customize and program, but to say that windows is for user who don't know how to use a computer is ridiculous. A computer has many uses.... its a tool not an end, unless you like to program and that's all you care about.
In isratrance people talk about music related topic and linux is not the best tool to make music far from it.
so I would say this: Linux at the moment is for people that do not want to make music.
-
|
|
|
Spindrift
Spindrift
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1560
Posted : May 20, 2007 13:13
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-20 02:00, UnderTow wrote:
As Spindrift allready pointed out, Wine is pretty much useless for audio applications but I suspect that you are refering to VMware which isn't part of Linux.
|
|
Also if you for some insane reason run Linux just to run windows applications at approx 80% of the original speed using VMware you still have to use hardware supported by Linux.
VMware is just runs a virtual OS under another OS and has virtual hardware, so if your hardware is not picked up by Linux it will not be possible to access from VMware.
 (``·.¸(``·.¸(``·.¸¸.·`´)¸.·`´)¸.·`´)
« .....www.ResonantEarth.com..... »
(¸.·`´(¸.·`´(¸.·`´``·.¸)``·.¸)``·.¸)
http://www.myspace.com/spindriftsounds
http://www.myspace.com/resonantearth |
|
|
|
ohshit
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
45
Posts :
605
Posted : May 20, 2007 14:31
|
I am not here to suggest to anyone to switch to ubuntu from your trusted XP/OsX.
I am just saying that ubuntu studio is ready and free to download, that you can try it and you can have fun with a lot of FREE stuff.
IMHO, the point is not XP/OsX vs Ubuntu. Not now at least.
If you are a "pro" you'll need your old OS with a lot of expensive buyware for sure, but if you are an "hobbyst" the choice, I think, is between Open Source and Warez.
And the free software is growing fast, when the warez is more problematic and controlled day by day.
Anyway, it's all about the fun. |
|
|
|
PlutoDelic
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
12
Posts :
244
Posted : May 20, 2007 21:23
|
i really like the Work of Ubuntu Studio, but they have to learn from the mistakes of all the other Distros, we dont need RTFM's, we need special user friendly with strategy in front of our eyes, and support from all sides. if the UbuntuStudios guys had time to make a distro, then now its time for them to Program every freakin driver that Audio Producers need and then we could PRAY that Cubase 6 could end with a .deb or .rpm, but there's the problem, not all producers know how to MOUNT somethin on Linux or compiling a new Sequencer, thats the problem linux always had and called its self still USER FRIENDLY, all they need to work on is AUTOMATION, XP/Vista isnt popular just from the graphics and the dominating softwares that run under it, they have more users because all the they have to do is press some NEXT NEXT NEXT FINISH buttons, this stuff might sound very UNPROFESSIONAL and it is, but those who want to go deeper, they have GOOGLE and the Human Curiosity, but making a full OS like a labyrinth i think thats not a magnet for the Curiosity of a Producer
CONCLUSION: we need buttons that do the work for us. understanding them is a different thing.
ps, its not fair to say XP/OS X vs Linux, the right way is XP vs OS X/Linux, OS X and Linux they both come from UNIX, just like BSD (mentioned before)...
PSYKS |
|
|
|
ohshit
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
45
Posts :
605
Posted : May 21, 2007 23:57
|
Quote:
|
ps, its not fair to say XP/OS X vs Linux, the right way is XP vs OS X/Linux, OS X and Linux they both come from UNIX
|
|
Is more than fair if you divide operating systems in open source and propietary. |
|
|
|
knocz
Moderator
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1151
Posted : May 22, 2007 04:55
|
I didn't know my words would create such a discussion...
There's no way you can convince me otherwise. Linux is and always will be better. Just ask who knows.
And there's nothing that windows can do that linux can't do better. You just need to know how to use it. If you know how to program, you do what ever you want in linux.
AND NO, WINDOWS RUNS THRU LINUX, CONSUMING LESS CPU THEN IF IT WOULD RUN BY ITS SELF. MOSTLY ANY PROGRAMS RUNNING THRU AN EMULATOR ON LINUX RUNS WITH LESS CPU THAN IN WINDOWS. I GARANTY THAT BY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. I didn't believe it either when they first told me that. It didn't seem possible... Than I tryed it out and they were right.
If you wan't to keep on with windows, fine. I'm just saying that there are alternatives that will increase the performance of your cpu. You cannot tell the pc what to do in windows.. You can only understand me if you know how to use Linux. You control the machine.
Please don't run down Linux anymore. It only shows you don't know what your talking about.
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-20 02:58, Seppa wrote:
Quote:
| Windows is good for ordinary people that don't know how to use a computer. And the reason is because everybody has it. But you don't control the computer.. it controls you. |
|
So I guess you can come and explain me how to use it then!
I have had my first computer at the age of 7, an Apple II c,I move on to a pc, a "80 286" running dos, to an apple Lc in 1990 to486 dx2, dx4 .....ect
I runned and used apple os, dos , win (3.1 to xp), Linux ( different kinds).
In all I have started 2 computer company in italy and london which i have sold now.
All this to say what you say is nonsense !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Linux is for more experienced user who likes to customize and program, but to say that windows is for user who don't know how to use a computer is ridiculous. A computer has many uses.... its a tool not an end, unless you like to program and that's all you care about.
In isratrance people talk about music related topic and linux is not the best tool to make music far from it.
so I would say this: Linux at the moment is for people that do not want to make music.
-
|
|
Ok, you used a 286. You should know what I'm talking about.
It's not rediculous to say that 95% of the world pc users dont know how to use a pc... They know how to use windows. But thay have no idea how everything works. It's like trying to make music without understanding sound. It's like having a VST and using the presets.. You should tune and tweak so everything goes how you want.
Now tell me, how do YOU, in windows, make your wouting of your sound card? Probably a program does it for you. And how does that program work?
You probably think thats unecessary, but for example, if you want something to be totally inovation, you should make your own vsts...Were in the digital era for music. Before, you bought a synth and you opened it. after research, you get your welder and you start modding. Now people dont do that with pc's for sound..in hardware its a little dificult, but with software its original.
In conclusion, Linux is programable, Windows isn't. I don't think there is a better explanation.
Super Banana Sauce http://www.soundcloud.com/knocz |
|
|
|
thockin
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
114
Posted : May 22, 2007 07:04
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-20 02:00, UnderTow wrote:
Actually, the Linux kernel isn't designed for realtime applications. Windows IS better for running audio applications. It is even better than OSX which doesn't have core affinity.
Linux is better for alot of other things but not for audio.
|
|
Sorry Undertow. You may have been right three years ago, but not anymore. Linux is not a realtime OS, but it is closer than Windows by FAR. Linux audio apps regularly get single digit millisecond latency with every plugin in a seperate process. Windows can't DREAM of touching that.
The Linux kernel and audio folks have spent a LONG time and a LOT of effort to make Linux really shine at audio.
|
|
|
|
UnderTow
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
1448
Posted : May 22, 2007 13:18
|
Hey Tim,
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-22 07:04, thockin wrote:
Sorry Undertow. You may have been right three years ago, but not anymore. Linux is not a realtime OS, but it is closer than Windows by FAR. Linux audio apps regularly get single digit millisecond latency with every plugin in a seperate process. Windows can't DREAM of touching that.
|
|
What makes you think that? I can run my Windows setup at 1 ms latency. Not very practical because of the high CPU usage but it can be done. I can have Live rewired to Sonar with 3 ms latency.
Benchmarks on Vista seem to show that it is even better than XP for audio. (I am not running Vista so I havn't tried this myself).
So Windows doesn't need to dream about it. 
Quote:
|
The Linux kernel and audio folks have spent a LONG time and a LOT of effort to make Linux really shine at audio.
|
|
From my understanding, it has always been a battle to get the kernel guys to take audio into account. But indeed, I havn't been following things too closely lately.
The bottom line for me is always about the available tools. For recording and mixing, Linux has the necessarty tools but for producing electronic music, Windows (or OSX) is a much better choice at the moment.
If the tools (and drivers) become available in Linux, I would be glad to switch.
UnderTow |
|
|
|
subconsciousmind
SCM
Started Topics :
37
Posts :
1033
Posted : May 22, 2007 18:20
|
Quote:
|
Windows is good for ordinary people that don't know how to use a computer. And the reason is because everybody has it.
|
|
? I thought that is MacOS? at least thats what they say in their "mac pc" ads.
Anyway.. its all too complicated for me.. i don't know anything about kernel etc. etc. at least not that deep that I could join a discussion about what is better for audio..
All that counts for me is that I get the tools that I want and that it works!
I can say that kubuntu is freaking amazing since it boots from the CD on my laptop and needs no drivers and from lan to grafic and sound everything works out of the box.
But there are none of my tools.. so I leave it.
I have OSx and WinXP installed on my PC and it's more or less the same stable, same latency, same performance... but I have most of my tools on windows... so there I am.
Most of my music for you to download at:
http://www.subconsciousmind.ch |
|
|
|
Spindrift
Spindrift
Started Topics :
33
Posts :
1560
Posted : May 22, 2007 19:50
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-22 04:55, knocz wrote:
AND NO, WINDOWS RUNS THRU LINUX, CONSUMING LESS CPU THEN IF IT WOULD RUN BY ITS SELF. MOSTLY ANY PROGRAMS RUNNING THRU AN EMULATOR ON LINUX RUNS WITH LESS CPU THAN IN WINDOWS. I GARANTY THAT BY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. I didn't believe it either when they first told me that. It didn't seem possible... Than I tryed it out and they were right.
|
|
Your guarantee is not worth much considering how clueless you seem to be about both Linux and Windows.
The fact that you have to share one CPU and RAM between two OS's as well as a virtual machine makes it slower than native operation, no matter how good the virtual machine performs.
I read lot's of people either complaining about it being much slower than running applications natively, as well as many people claiming it to be near native speed.
But so far I only heard you making the bizarre claim it's faster.
My guess is that you have an error in your testing method since it's not easy to do a straight comparision.
Maybe you for example had a badly configured Windows install that you was comparing to.
Quote:
|
Now tell me, how do YOU, in windows, make your wouting of your sound card? Probably a program does it for you. And how does that program work?
You probably think thats unecessary, but for example, if you want something to be totally inovation, you should make your own vsts...Were in the digital era for music. Before, you bought a synth and you opened it. after research, you get your welder and you start modding. Now people dont do that with pc's for sound..in hardware its a little dificult, but with software its original.
In conclusion, Linux is programable, Windows isn't. I don't think there is a better explanation. |
|
I don't think there is a worse explanation.
Not many people actually doing music was taking out their soldering irons to mod their new hardware synths...no idea where you got that idea from.
And you don't need to develop plugs to be a producer or musician.
But even if that would been case...you can program VST's as well as audio routing software in windows.
So both your presumption and conclusion is completely off.
Linux is a nice OS, and MS is a horrible company IMO.
But I like to get on with making music and use whatever is most suitable for that job.
Until I can run Abelton, Scope and all my plugs on Linux why would I change?
You argument is that anything else would show that I don't know what I'm talking about, while you yourself claim that you can run drivers under VMware and that programs will run faster than native windows operation....hmmm.
My advice to avoid coming across as a fool...first get a clue about what you are talking about yourself and then you can try to be the judge of other peoples knowledge.
Ok...enough feeding the troll...sorry about that 
On topic:
Hopefully the Ubuntu initiative can help spur some progress, so in that sense it's welcome news even if I have no interest in switching any time soon.
(``·.¸(``·.¸(``·.¸¸.·`´)¸.·`´)¸.·`´)
« .....www.ResonantEarth.com..... »
(¸.·`´(¸.·`´(¸.·`´``·.¸)``·.¸)``·.¸)
http://www.myspace.com/spindriftsounds
http://www.myspace.com/resonantearth |
|
|
|
knocz
Moderator
Started Topics :
40
Posts :
1151
Posted : May 23, 2007 03:27
|
You know the game world of warcraft 3?
Running It through windows it take about half aminute loading (on a normal 1.8 gigahtz processor) On the same computer, emulated through linux, you don't even see the loading page. Its almost instant. Extreamly fast. As I already said, I faithfully didn't believe it until I tryed it.
And you dont really need to emulate windows to use a windows program..
If you and everybody say windows is better, who am I to say otherwise. If you feel more confortable in windows (witch you all do), forget about linux. Stay as you are and don't reply to this topic anymore. Anybody who's interested in making music with Linux, like me, please reply.
Super Banana Sauce http://www.soundcloud.com/knocz |
|
|
|
thockin
Started Topics :
1
Posts :
114
Posted : May 23, 2007 06:14
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-22 13:18, UnderTow wrote:
Hey Tim,
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-22 07:04, thockin wrote:
Sorry Undertow. You may have been right three years ago, but not anymore. Linux is not a realtime OS, but it is closer than Windows by FAR. Linux audio apps regularly get single digit millisecond latency with every plugin in a seperate process. Windows can't DREAM of touching that.
|
|
What makes you think that? I can run my Windows setup at 1 ms latency. Not very practical because of the high CPU usage but it can be done. I can have Live rewired to Sonar with 3 ms latency.
|
|
You missed the bit where I said each plugin runs in it's own process. I'm not a windows programmer, but the Windows programmers I know tell me "hell no, Windows can not pull that off".
Quote:
|
The bottom line for me is always about the available tools. For recording and mixing, Linux has the necessarty tools but for producing electronic music, Windows (or OSX) is a much better choice at the moment.
If the tools (and drivers) become available in Linux, I would be glad to switch.
|
|
Of course. I don't use linux as my DAW OS yet, either |
|
|
|
UnderTow
Started Topics :
9
Posts :
1448
Posted : May 23, 2007 15:36
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-23 06:14, thockin wrote:
You missed the bit where I said each plugin runs in it's own process. I'm not a windows programmer, but the Windows programmers I know tell me "hell no, Windows can not pull that off".
|
|
No I didn't miss that bit. That is why I mentioned Ableton Live rewired to Sonar.
I am assuming that that is two seperate processes but maybe it just loads a DLL in rewire mode. I would have to check but I tested with the demo version of Live which of course is long expired...
Quote:
|
Of course. I don't use linux as my DAW OS yet, either
|
|
LOL.
UnderTow |
|
|
|
cr1st0
IsraTrance Full Member
Started Topics :
80
Posts :
208
Posted : May 23, 2007 16:43
|
|
This is so good news sooner or later they will update it and get it more and more profissional i hope they will find a way to support vst in that.
|
|
|
|
bilbobagginz
Started Topics :
8
Posts :
399
Posted : May 24, 2007 04:04
|
Quote:
|
On 2007-05-23 16:43, cr1st0 wrote:
This is so good news sooner or later they will update it and get it more and more profissional i hope they will find a way to support vst in that.
|
|
Linux has a great sequencer named ardour, http://www.ardour.org, If compiled specially it supports VSTs.
if you want to take a shot on linux, check out the audio cards support matrix: http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/
Cheerz. |
|
|
|
|
