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Learn me how to use compressors
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 22, 2010 18:44
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you can destroy quite a lot with false attack and release settings.For instance with an attack of zero you mostly hear crackles on low signals ,actually zero is mostly only good for limiting.Like limiting in life performance in mastering you could maybe vary the attack a lil if sounds better but most limiter dont even have an attack since it is fixed ,in that case go for a compressor and set ration to the max and attack to sth else than zero - I think zero in limiting is 99% the right option for limiting.
On the other side with a too big release it can happen that you only hear the first punch ..and all other ones are swimming under because release is not short enugh.Or attck to long.
Don't know if it can help but gain reduction meter is also a good point to look at while playying with attack and release.It should work and not stay the whole time on same level.
Hope you know what I mean.And please correct me someone if
it's not clear enough of maybe you see it different.
I think with attack and release you can make comp work properly or totaly false.It should not be squashed but also not breath in the wrong parts..
If the punch is clear each time,than all is set correct mostly.If it is what you want of course.
  https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 22, 2010 19:17
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On 2010-12-22 18:37, Colin OOOD wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 18:10, daark wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 17:46, makus wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 17:44, daark wrote:
guy sais "i stoped using compressors i use volume envelopes"
ooook thats reasonable X_X
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back to the old school
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i just record myself tweaking the volume with my mouse
"lo-fi"
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A standard technique used by some of the most experienced mix engineers when using large-format mixers with moving-fader automation is also not to use compression for dynamics, but to record fader movements to compensate for rapid changes in channel level. Apparently when watching the mix play back, the faders seem to vibrate! So this isn't such a stupid idea at all, perhaps, although you'd need a control surface of some kind to do it justice 
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would love to see a multiband compressor limiter and expander live performance i make this guy my permanent mastering engie lol
http://soundcloud.com/magimix-1/chilling-forest-whispers
Wierd shit happens :) |
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 22, 2010 19:21
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monno
Grapes Of Wrath
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Posted : Dec 22, 2010 19:32
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An expander is by definition an upward compression scheme, not a downward one. Also it does nothing to control the noise floor but can bring it up along with minute details hidden away. That being said however there should be little concern about raising the noise floor if all processes are taking place inside the box.
Unless you are using external hardware, noise is not an issue (broadly speaking, as poor design also translates to the software world) Where would that noise come from if it wasn´t already present somewhere in the chain. There is likewise no need to use a noise gate if there is no noise.
Eq springs to mind as being the tool that warrants much more attention than compression really.
As an alternative to using compressors to control stray dynamics use your sequencer´s automation and ride the volume on the sections that are too loud. This has it´s limits but is well suited for longer dynamic snippets and not sharp transients.
For sharp transients use the zoom tool and change the gain of the offending bit. For most things automation might actually work better, but people like convenience and let other people think for them. Many ways to skin a cat
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TimeTraveller
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 22, 2010 19:42
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On 2010-12-22 19:21, daark wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 18:44, TimeTraveller wrote:
It should work and not stay the whole time on same level.
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that really depends on what you want to do
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Yes I agree.But than it means that there is always no dynamic..it is on same level like in a box - but fur sure it can be a wish to some elements.
But when it moves a bit its not bad imo.
https://soundcloud.com/shivagarden |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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8087
Posted : Dec 22, 2010 19:44
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if it don t sound better you dont need it,imo it s good rule when you begin using compressor to be sure you dont fuck all the mix.
but maybe you will learn faster by compressing the shit out of everyhting and then notice what is wrong.
compression is boring use in psytrance, you rarely have to compress a lot a sound, you compress a little here and there to get more punch ,to tighten a bit ,glue ,sidechain technics ... i probably forgot some but i think they are the most usefull use for psytrance.
except sidehcaining all these use sound usually better with a slower attack and the release set to groove with the track but it depends the compressor used, the source... |
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Upavas
Upavas
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Posted : Dec 23, 2010 02:56
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On 2010-12-22 12:37, disco hooligans wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 10:55, Upavas wrote:
Basic idea, compression brings the loud tones down, expansion brings the quiet tones up.
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When you compress a signal you bring the peaks down but you also bring the quieter elements, up.
...For example if you compress a noisy source a lot, you get a lot of noise in your mix.
Peace out.
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You get more noise in the mix, provided you raise the volume after compressing, either on the track fader, or in the compressor itself! The compression itself does nothing else but bring loud tones down!
If you want to bring the quieter elements up, I suggest you use an expander!
Bom
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http://upavas.com
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Upavas
Upavas
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Posted : Dec 23, 2010 03:02
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[/quote]
A standard technique used by some of the most experienced mix engineers when using large-format mixers with moving-fader automation is also not to use compression for dynamics, but to record fader movements to compensate for rapid changes in channel level. Apparently when watching the mix play back, the faders seem to vibrate! So this isn't such a stupid idea at all, perhaps, although you'd need a control surface of some kind to do it justice
[/quote]
This is also done in film mixing.
I wonder how long it would take for any console to break if you used it e.g. as a ducking method for bass lines when the kick sets in!
Upavas - Here And Now (Sangoma Rec.) new EP out Oct.29th, get it here:
http://timecode.bandcamp.com
http://upavas.com
http://soundcloud.com/upavas-1/ |
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
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5292
Posted : Dec 23, 2010 04:48
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On 2010-12-23 02:56, Upavas wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 12:37, disco hooligans wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 10:55, Upavas wrote:
Basic idea, compression brings the loud tones down, expansion brings the quiet tones up.
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When you compress a signal you bring the peaks down but you also bring the quieter elements, up.
...For example if you compress a noisy source a lot, you get a lot of noise in your mix.
Peace out.
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You get more noise in the mix, provided you raise the volume after compressing, either on the track fader, or in the compressor itself! The compression itself does nothing else but bring loud tones down!
If you want to bring the quieter elements up, I suggest you use an expander!
Bom
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True that, actually, I stand corrected.
I always use make up gain/raise the fader after I compress a signal, to compansate for the compressor's gain reduction.
Too much practise and I forgot the actual theory.
To add to this thread, I use compression a lot, kicks, bass, leads, drums/percussion (that has not been compressed already), especially in live instruments, but in electronic tuens as well.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Conny
IsraTrance Senior Member
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Posted : Dec 23, 2010 11:10
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Israel forum is getting better and better
thanx for all great answers today im going to compress all day long ;D
1. Could you give me examples on sounds which are wide in dynamics ?
I believe vocals for example have a wide dynamic range but what about other instruments ?
Whern i compress the kick though i notice how the other sounds in the mix comes forward in a good way
but i usally don´t have any compression on the bass
is sidechaining bass to kick really needed, i mean if you program the notes right would you still need sidechai
sidechaing ?
2 Ok i no what you mean you bring up all the parts of the individual sound.
3.Yes your right
4. It seems like you can affect the length on kicks etc with compressor and make it tighter this way.
My music is extremly untight i hope i can figure out how i can make it tighter.
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 23, 2010 15:29
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 23, 2010 16:47
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On 2010-12-23 02:56, Upavas wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 12:37, disco hooligans wrote:
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On 2010-12-22 10:55, Upavas wrote:
Basic idea, compression brings the loud tones down, expansion brings the quiet tones up.
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When you compress a signal you bring the peaks down but you also bring the quieter elements, up.
...For example if you compress a noisy source a lot, you get a lot of noise in your mix.
Peace out.
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You get more noise in the mix, provided you raise the volume after compressing, either on the track fader, or in the compressor itself!
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I think it is only true on wav files no?
by the way all of you descriped upward compression (expanding) lol
http://soundcloud.com/magimix-1/chilling-forest-whispers
Wierd shit happens :) |
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Colin OOOD
Moderator
Started Topics :
95
Posts :
5380
Posted : Dec 23, 2010 23:00
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On 2010-12-23 03:02, Upavas wrote:
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A standard technique used by some of the most experienced mix engineers when using large-format mixers with moving-fader automation is also not to use compression for dynamics, but to record fader movements to compensate for rapid changes in channel level. Apparently when watching the mix play back, the faders seem to vibrate! So this isn't such a stupid idea at all, perhaps, although you'd need a control surface of some kind to do it justice
[/quote]
This is also done in film mixing.
I wonder how long it would take for any console to break if you used it e.g. as a ducking method for bass lines when the kick sets in!
[/quote]
If they can handle sub-syllable-timing 12+dB gain changes then a simple 4/4 movement would be no problem I bet... those mixers tend to be built to take all the punishment a creative professional with no sense of restraint can throw at them - that's one reason why they're so expensive!
Mastering - http://mastering.OOOD.net :: www.is.gd/mastering
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Contact for bookings/mastering - colin@oood.net |
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Upavas
Upavas
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150
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3315
Posted : Dec 24, 2010 00:42
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daark
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Dec 24, 2010 12:46
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On 2010-12-24 00:42, Upavas wrote:
@ Daark, no and no!
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yes and yes
noise levels are depending on youre soundcard
if you haven't exported that noise it is not part of the signal the signal to noise ratio stays the same and is not affected by compression but by the level of ur mixer track 
compression is compression, gain riding is gain riding and volume envelopes are volume envelopes. don't confuse different stuff
for conny: take a sine and compress and see how the compressor affects the wave that will give you a basic idea
http://soundcloud.com/magimix-1/chilling-forest-whispers
Wierd shit happens :) |
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