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Kick drums: Generated in real time or Sampled?
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 14:42:50
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For the longest time I've been playing my tracks with Bazzism generating kicks in real time.
I read a really good tip from Br0d, suggesting that could cause it to be inconsistent.
So i did the experiment myself, and I think my Kick and Bassline sit together much better now.
Any comments on this? |
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psyraal
IsraTrance Full Member
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768
Posted : Apr 13, 2011 15:12
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makus
Overdream
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3087
Posted : Apr 13, 2011 15:14
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 15:49
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I use Ultrabeat to create all my kicks and trigger the drum machine in real time, instead of sampling the kick and trigger it in a sampler or drop it in the arrangement as audio.
Works fine over here.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 15:50
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On 2011-04-13 15:12, NychroLogic wrote:
you mean you swaped from synth to sample?
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Yes, I made my own kick on Bazzism and selected the option Export as Audio. This created an audio file of my kick, now ready to be used.
And this basically makes the combo more consistent so Br0d was right.
This could help somebody else too.
Thanks. |
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 15:55
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It does not make any difference if you trigger the drum machine in real time (provided it works well, i.e. the timing is sample accurate, phase is always the same), or drop it in as audio. That's my experience from Logic and Ultrabeat.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:01
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Quote:
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On 2011-04-13 15:55, disco hooligans wrote:
It does not make any difference if you trigger the drum machine in real time (provided it works well, i.e. the timing is sample accurate, phase is always the same), or drop it in as audio. That's my experience from Logic and Ultrabeat.
Peace out.
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I guess that's your opinion, we'll have to hear more opinions.
Here is what I quoted from Br0d
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Never generate kicks in real time on a synthesizer, especially if that synth is multitimbral and is being used to play other parts. Always sample them. Synths claiming to have "envelope modes" or trigger offsets (hardware virus comes to mind) will munge up your kicks with their voice/polyphony schemes and make them inconsistent.
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:14
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That's for the virus though, and most hardware synthesizers that work on MIDI, which is not sample accurate as is triggering a software synthesizer/drum machine.
You mentioned Bassizm, which (correct me if I am wrong) is a software drum machine. It "should" work as good as dropping a kick sample into an audio channel in the arrangement.
And as strong minded as I might appear to be, in this case, it is not my opinion, it is the way things are.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:17
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yes this dont apply to most plugins... thought sometimes it seems plugs can loose accuracy but it s not smething you gonna hear ,it s way to small |
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:19
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Quote:
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On 2011-04-13 16:14, disco hooligans wrote:
That's for the virus though, and most hardware synthesizers that work on MIDI, which is not sample accurate as is triggering a software synthesizer/drum machine.
You mentioned Bassizm, which (correct me if I am wrong) is a software drum machine. It "should" work as good as dropping a kick sample into an audio channel in the arrangement.
And as strong minded as I might appear to be, in this case, it is not my opinion, it is the way things are.
Peace out.
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Umm... Bazzism isn't a Drum Machine.
BazzISM is a drum synthesizer that produces bass kicks by a sinus sweep.
So as smart as you try to sound you obviously don't know the difference between a drum machine and a drum Synth.
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PoM
IsraTrance Full Member
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:24
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LOL |
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
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5292
Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:32
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Thx, you're asking questions to which people including my self are providing answers. If you don't like the answers, it is your problem. Your mate was correct in the event of using a hardware synthesizer to generate a kick drum and use that hardware synth to trigger it in real time.
There is also the case of software synths/drum machines...etc...where this problem, does not occur. I have not used Bassizm, all I know about it is that people use it to create kick drums. If you want to be a twat and suggest what I do know and what I don't, based on Bassizm and whether I know it creates anything more than a kick drum, knock your self out.
Do your self a favor and read further into triggering software synths internally and about the problems of sequencing hardware synths via MIDI on modern computers (i.e not including the old ATARI ST). You might learn something.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Thx-1138
IsraTrance Junior Member
Started Topics :
11
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Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:43
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Again I'll quote Br0d. Now let's pretend we are in kindergarten.
What is Bazzism kids? A drum Synth!
What is a synth? A Synthesizer!
What does it do kids? It generates kicks real time!
What happends if you generate kicks in real time? It's not consistent!
How do we fix that kids? WE SAMPLE IT! YAY!
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Never generate kicks in real time on a synthesizer, especially if that synth is multitimbral and is being used to play other parts. Always sample them. Synths claiming to have "envelope modes" or trigger offsets (hardware virus comes to mind) will munge up your kicks with their voice/polyphony schemes and make them inconsistent.
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Nectarios
Martian Arts
Started Topics :
187
Posts :
5292
Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:44
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For good laugh's sake I'll say this one last time.
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On 2011-04-13 16:43, Thx-1138 wrote:
What happends if you generate kicks in real time? It's not consistent!
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This is not the case for software synthesizers, software drum synths, software drum machines, software samplers...etc.
Is not bassizm a software drum whatever? Yes it is.
Should" it be consistent? Yes it should.
Why? Because other software drum synths/machines are consistent.
Ask your mate about all this and save your self further embarrassment, because it seems to me that unless you hear it from him, you won't believe it.
Peace out.
http://soundcloud.com/martianarts |
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Speakafreaka
IsraTrance Junior Member
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779
Posted : Apr 13, 2011 16:53
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I built a Drum Synth VST. I understand how this works.
Assuming Bazzism retriggers the phase of the osc, DH is completely and utterly correct, meaningless semantic arguments aside.
There could of course, be a 'bug' in Bassizm's code, but it has been around for a long while and I'm sure they would have sorted it by now so I find that unlikely.
This exact issue is something I spent a long time developing out of my own software ... in VST land it is entirely possible to be just as accurate as a VST sampler when synthesizing ... unsurprisingly, as most synths work with wavetables, otherwise known as ... samples.
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http://www.soundcloud.com/speakafreaka |
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